2024 Boat Show impressions

[JibbyPTMEdge]

On 3/3/2024 at 5:40 PM, mxmark4 said:

That was literally the only pic I took. Not much interested me. We spent a bit of time looking at the Moomba Tykon, and the supreme s220. Looked at a lot of pontoons for some reason. I guess we were just fighting boredom. The Centurion/ atx/Tige dealer in town just got their entire floor plan repo'ed so there was not much there from them. Was hoping to see an Ultre

Are you referring to the Knoxville Boat Show? If so, that is weird as I saw a few Tige's and Centurion's. I definitely walked all thru the Ultre, that thing is pretty slick! Tige is stepping up pretty big this model year. 

Edited March 6 by JibbyPTMEdge

[Sixer]

Was the Knoxville place formerly know as Sunny Marine..........also formerly known as Great Wakes????

[mxmark4]

4 hours ago, JibbyPTMEdge said:

Are you referring to the Knoxville Boat Show? If so, that is weird as I saw a few Tige's and Centurion's. I definitely walked all thru the Ultre, that thing is pretty slick! Tige is stepping up pretty big this model year. 

Were they in the other section where Mastercraft was?  I only saw the one Centurion and the 2 supremes Norris boat center had there. We didnt go to the other section of the show as we were running short on time. 

[The Hulk]

7 hours ago, mxmark4 said:

  spoke to the sales guy I know from Tommys who is now the service manager there and he had mentioned not selling a single wake boat by late Saturday afternoon. Said they had sold some pontoons, but no Axis or Bu sales. He seemed concerned by the lack of movement, meanwhile the paragon across the way  with no listed price was sold as well as a G23 at 270k. 

Someone with numbers they were not allowed to share said the wake boat sector is taking the brunt of the downturn more than style boats/ sectors. I wanted numbers but that's all I was informed. Two major brands non-towboat MFGs have just further revised forecast downward.

Rumor has it RV sector is planning another large layoff very soon. And some of the same suppliers said marine parts business is way down.

Mercury engines cut Major production forecast and orders for parts that go on their new outboard engines. 

Many Non diversified boat dealers are in panic, while those that are more diversified and make a larger % from service, storage, dock, lift services are fairing far better.

Just a super odd year on different areas and markets doing oddly worse or better than others even down to the types of boats..

[The Hulk]

On 3/3/2024 at 4:07 PM, skurfer said:

Ingenuity might be owned by Correct Craft. 

I cant fathom anyone paying $250k + major extra $$$$ to get charging trenched down to their dock to do 20mph, when you can get a twin engine TRI for similar $ . Oh and BTW zero chance of resale..

What I don't understand is who is funding this stuff or who thinks they can make a return on investment? I mean who actually convinced investors to make this? I want that guy on my team ! 

Edited March 7 by The Hulk

[dwc032]

Weird that all the boats here in the PNW mainly Active Water Sports is who I am talking about. They pretty much have every boat on their showroom floor sold. But across the country shops are closing up. 

[Cole2001]

@The Hulk A lot of marinas already have 30 or 50 amp power at each slip so wouldn’t be a big issue for charging. I’d still take a gas engine but I think it’s feasible. 

Yes, ingenuity is under the correct craft umbrella. I think it’s more aimed at product research and development than what it is traditional marine sales. 10 years from now when electric is the rage correct craft will have the kinks figured out and be selling it to other brands. Look at what they did with pcm. 

[Cole2001]

2 hours ago, dwc032 said:

Weird that all the boats here in the PNW mainly Active Water Sports is who I am talking about. They pretty much have every boat on their showroom floor sold. But across the country shops are closing up. 

PNW is a very unique market. I’ve noticed used have really slowed but new is still strong. 
Will be interesting to see how the market plays out and if we see some inventory/lower prices shift over from the east. 

[dshack]

5 hours ago, dwc032 said:

Weird that all the boats here in the PNW mainly Active Water Sports is who I am talking about. They pretty much have every boat on their showroom floor sold. But across the country shops are closing up. 

Yep and just to add an anecdote for Utah as well, my build that was supposedly confirmed for March ended up getting an April spray date (I was a little bummed but it's fine...I'm just impatient). And Taylor's website shows plenty of pending/sold listings.

[The Hulk]

2 hours ago, Cole2001 said:

@The Hulk A lot of marinas already have 30 or 50 amp power at each slip so wouldn’t be a big issue for charging. I’d still take a gas engine but I think it’s feasible. 

Yes, ingenuity is under the correct craft umbrella. I think it’s more aimed at product research and development than what it is traditional marine sales. 10 years from now when electric is the rage correct craft will have the kinks figured out and be selling it to other brands. Look at what they did with pcm. 

Guess I didn't think of Marina's, or possibly rental market. Still think it would be hard to make an ROI renting a quarter million dollar boat. Heck most boat rentals are 500ish /day for a crappy old pontoon. Can't imagine a boat of this expense. 

I guess my confusion is on the price point.. go fo something that could be more mainstream, 50-75k range. I just don't see the quarter million dollar buyer going for this.. like saying buy an electric rolls Royce that can only go 40-50mph... you can't do Watersports or or in this case say drive down the highway 

 

even a handful of sales the project is basically R&D subsidized. I won't be surprised if these pet projects get cut quickly with the current market downturn. I have no doubts ppl will continue to dabber in electric (for show) and experimenting purposes. But we're a LONG ways from Lage scale practicality. But who knows with how fast technology is advancing. I mean who thought a tiny electric motor could power a 200+ lbs person on an e-foil at 30mph only a few years ago!

Edited March 7 by The Hulk

[JibbyPTMEdge]

19 hours ago, mxmark4 said:

Were they in the other section where Mastercraft was?  I only saw the one Centurion and the 2 supremes Norris boat center had there. We didnt go to the other section of the show as we were running short on time. 

No, they were in then main building, far back right corner. I believe Adventure Watersports was the dealer's name. Kinda felt back for the Mastercraft guys over in the other building. Hopefully they got some traffic. 

[The Hulk]

Is MC even top 3 anymore?

[MikeR397]

2 hours ago, The Hulk said:

Is MC even top 3 anymore?

Their NXT is a joke for a “value” boat. It’s far inferior to an Axis. The XT and X seem pretty awesome, but at sky high prices with a lot of other serious contenders in the $200-$350k range. 

[dizzygti]

16 minutes ago, MikeR397 said:

Their NXT is a joke for a “value” boat. It’s far inferior to an Axis. The XT and X seem pretty awesome, but at sky high prices with a lot of other serious contenders in the $200-$350k range. 

I want to believe you, but in what ways?   The XT24 I've been in was awesome but not $100K better than my Axis so just curious what your specific thoughts are. 

[Cole2001]

30 minutes ago, MikeR397 said:

Their NXT is a joke for a “value” boat. It’s far inferior to an Axis. The XT and X seem pretty awesome, but at sky high prices with a lot of other serious contenders in the $200-$350k range. 

It might seem like a joke just looking at it. But on the water it is one of the most solid and well put together budget boats. Just my experience. 

[MikeR397]

Maybe I spoke too harshly. By “joke” I mean my nxt 22 quote was $40k higher then my T220 was. With Axis I got a more powerful engine (m6), significantly more ballast and an easier to use surf system, and was able to choose options like 1. Surf exhaust (not available on nxt, so fumes it is) 2. Power steering (ditto)  3: fast fill ballasts (5 min vs 15+ min are you kidding me?) 4: in 23 and earlier NXT boats no digital dash. The NXT is a nice boat for sure, but you are paying a LOT more money for significantly fewer important features compared to Axis and some others. Styling and space and other features are close enough it’s not worth mentioning. 
 

The XT and X cannot be compared to an Axis, and get all the features I wanted, but I have a hard time with their out the door price on a X24 vs M242, both of which were more than I wanted to spend on a first wake boat (and ignoring other idiosyncratic issues for me like draft and tower folding). 

 

[The Hulk]

Does anybody know the numbers obviously if you had it you could sell it during the past couple years but I'd be really curious to know if MC is in top 3 now let alone in a year or two.

 

I suspect they are losing a much higher percentage of their market share compared to the other brands.. 

Their Tower is 30 years old?.. Jk.. but seriously they are way overpriced in comparison to all the other brands for less.. after being at numerous boat shows around the country perhaps it was the time I was there but they seemed pretty dead compared to the other brands for foot traffic... 

I have a small gut feeling they have lost a lot of appeal in the market..  

[Nick55]

MC doesn’t have much presence around me, despite having several dealers nearby.  I also feel (this is a feeling, not a data-proven statement) like they accelerated their pricing quicker than most, ran into the wall quicker, and were early to shed workforce when the chips were laid down. 
 

I know a few people that have MCs that had serious vinyl failures by 5-7 years old which left the owners with a really bad taste.  I also think their boats are not very good looking now and like Hulk said, the towers…… 

[rennis]

The MC franchise in our market has had some turnover the last 15 years but their boats are still in high demand here.  They have the 2nd best or most prominent display at the Seattle boat show behind Malibu/Cobalt.  Far better location and more real estate than Nautique does out here.  

Anecdotally I've observed a number of die-hard MC loyalists switch brands in the last 5 years (to Malibu) but most MC loyalists I know wouldn't switch brands for any reason.  It's a status symbol for a lot of people. 

Personally I think the styling of MC boats needs a major overhaul.  I don't think it helps that MB continues to low-key rip off their designs and repeatedly dilute their curb appeal either.  

[Five Cent Worth]

I spend the second most time in a MC vs by Bu's.  My best friend has a X24.  He came from a NXT22 (literally didn't surf...) and then a X22 to the X24.  Great boats.  I would buy one.  I believe they were some of the first for the added freeboard, cool feel and you could argue their rear seats are alone worth looking at their X series models.  However, the low end and medium towers look like coat hangers and the premium over equivalents make / models is staggering.  Plus, in our market, they are on their third, maybe fourth, local dealer in five years.  At one point they had TWO dealers in the same city...  (Who does that?!?)

Also, I much prefer the gate surf wave over the tab.  

[Cole2001]

The MC X series is a great boat but besides some cosmetics and software updates the boat hasn’t changed since 2019 except the price. Much overdue for an update, rumour has it 2025 we’re going to see an update. 

[kstateskier1]

On 3/6/2024 at 1:48 PM, mxmark4 said:

They have 2 locations. One on Norris lake and one here in Knoxville about 2 miles from my house. I think they were just over leveraged, nice guys there did free surf demos every weeks during the summer. The Knoxville location apparently lost their floor plan and folded up shop. I think it sucks because it was nice to have some options out there, and a free ride on Tuesday nights for anyone that wanted to come out and play was cool. 

I spoke to the sales guy I know from Tommys who is now the service manager there and he had mentioned not selling a single wake boat by late Saturday afternoon. Said they had sold some pontoons, but no Axis or Bu sales. He seemed concerned by the lack of movement, meanwhile the paragon across the way  with no listed price was sold as well as a G23 at 270k. 

I think if people are shopping on appearance only, they are skipping Malibu for other brands.  The equipment on the Malibus with wedge and gate make them very competitve, but I would never buy one just on interior appearance.  To me the Moomba is close to as nice inside as the Malibus anymore.  Mastercraft, Nautique, and Supra all show as a superior product in a show environment IMO.  

[kstateskier1]

4 hours ago, Five Cent Worth said:

I spend the second most time in a MC vs by Bu's.  My best friend has a X24.  He came from a NXT22 (literally didn't surf...) and then a X22 to the X24.  Great boats.  I would buy one.  I believe they were some of the first for the added freeboard, cool feel and you could argue their rear seats are alone worth looking at their X series models.  However, the low end and medium towers look like coat hangers and the premium over equivalents make / models is staggering.  Plus, in our market, they are on their third, maybe fourth, local dealer in five years.  At one point they had TWO dealers in the same city...  (Who does that?!?)

Also, I much prefer the gate surf wave over the tab.  

To me, though the tower isn't super pleasing to the eye, is better than the Axis tower, which is also somewhat on the ugly side.  At least with the MC you can fold a manual tower to tow with it down.  A year ago I would have probably also been on the bash MC side just from looks, but spent a ton of hours on an NXT and was very pleased.

 

@MikeR397 NXT has had a digital display of some sort since around 2015. 

[NWBU]

We used to go entire summers without seeing a newer MC in our area, but now they're fairly common. The difference around here is the former dealer didn't want to sell boats, at all, and the new dealer (6-7 years ago) is very capable and aggressively markets their boats. They're getting a lot of repeat buyers.

A good friend had a new X24 and now a new XStar. I've been very impressed with both boats and their waves.

[The Hulk]

On 3/6/2024 at 10:10 PM, The Hulk said:

Rumor has it RV sector is planning another large layoff very soon. And some of the same suppliers said marine parts business is way down.

Mercury engines cut Major production forecast and orders for parts that go on their new outboard engines. 

 

Well that happened fast!

Makes me worry what's coming our boating way in 6-9mo / NEXT season