Help me get bigger surf on 2004 LSV 25 PLEASE!!

[vision24seven]

Hi there, we've just started surfing and we need more push for sure.  My kids can drop the rope most times, I can only some times.  I don't have unlimited budget, so what is the most important thing I should do? 

 Ballast in 1 corner?   shaper?   I have the 8.1L engine, NO other accessories for skiing/boarding.  I think I have stock prop but do not know for sure. 

All suggestions welcome, thank you!

Edited May 17, 2023 by vision24seven

[smileysteve]

Shaper is better than Ballast in one corner (for push you don't want ballast in one corner but more up front). Shaper is cheap. Shaper will make the boat more drive-able.

For push, you can also increase speed. For more length and push you need more front weight, for more height, rear weight.

Edited May 17, 2023 by smileysteve

[CaptainMorgan]

more info is better to help us help you.  Speed? ballast setup right now?  are you just listing it over to the side?

also board selection is important - if you are riding a board that is too small, every wave will feel insufficient.  How big are you/kids and what boards are you on?

[Jgf042]

Hello, in general: more weight = bigger wake. On many older boats you need more weight and then some weight in the front/nose. 

 

If on a tight budget I would:

- build a homemade wakeshaper. You can find videos online and make for $50 or so. Be sure to tie a buoy on it as it will sink if it falls off. put it on NON-SURF side low on the hull and far back as you can.

- buy a bag for the rear locker on the surf side. Not sure what size of bag you can fit but measure and get a 400lb at minimum or a 750 lb ideally. You will need a pump too. Fatsac tsunami is good brand.

- position people evenly on the boat and then tweak from there. probably need someone up front in bow of boat.

- be sure to fill your stock ballasts in the boat fully.

Also double check the max weight your boat can hold and keep that in mind. Go over that total weight limit with some caution! 

[Zippymbr]

You have a huge boat so you will need a ton of ballast and a Delta point type wave shaper.  Goto WakeMakers and get 3 reversible pumps with 2 1100 pound bags for the rear lockers and a bow bag.  Then get 4-6 50 pound lead bags that you can move around to shape the wave.  I would pick up an ACME 1235 prop used for $350 and a hyper lite HiFi used and have at it.

[vision24seven]

On 5/17/2023 at 7:30 AM, CaptainMorgan said:

more info is better to help us help you.  Speed? ballast setup right now?  are you just listing it over to the side?

also board selection is important - if you are riding a board that is too small, every wave will feel insufficient.  How big are you/kids and what boards are you on?

Hi there.  I think Im usually getting into 10-12 mph range via gps on my phone.  no ballasts at all in boat, it didnt come with anything like that.  im not listing, except when i load passengers to the surf side to try to make it more surfable.  Board I bought in 2016 and is a Hyperlite Landlock Wakesurf Board 5'9" 2015.   I am 210 lbs..  kids range from 100-155.   THX

[Brad B]

You need what Zippy said. Fill everything. No need to list anymore - use the shaper. Put it as far back as possible and under the waterline. Start slow and gradually add speed until wave face clears up - thats your lowest speed. Weight in bow will help make the wave longer. That size boat may even need a 750 or so in the floor

[pawter1970]

41 minutes ago, vision24seven said:

Hi there.  I think Im usually getting into 10-12 mph range via gps on my phone.  no ballasts at all in boat, it didnt come with anything like that.  im not listing, except when i load passengers to the surf side to try to make it more surfable.  Board I bought in 2016 and is a Hyperlite Landlock Wakesurf Board 5'9" 2015.   I am 210 lbs..  kids range from 100-155.   THX

So no hard tanks anywhere? If you are using a wake shaper start with 2 x 750's in the rear trunks and both full, I am guessing no wedge but if you do have one fully deploy it. For a boat this size you will definitely need mid and bow weight so you should get 2 more 400lb bags, put one mid and other in the bow.  

[CaptainMorgan]

6 hours ago, vision24seven said:

Hi there.  I think Im usually getting into 10-12 mph range via gps on my phone.  no ballasts at all in boat, it didnt come with anything like that.  im not listing, except when i load passengers to the surf side to try to make it more surfable.  Board I bought in 2016 and is a Hyperlite Landlock Wakesurf Board 5'9" 2015.   I am 210 lbs..  kids range from 100-155.   THX

That board seems reasonable for you. For comparison, looks like your boat is prob <5000 lbs...people with nice surf waves in a newer 25ft boat have surf systems and are displacing 2x that. (Not endorsing you putring that much weight, but a $500 investment in a shaper / some fat sacs like described by others would help a lot).

[vision24seven]

Howdy all, okay, put 750 pounds in my surfside/port locker, 600 pounds in middle ski locker, and i surfed fine but again, could not get enough consistent push to be able to let go of the rope. ony had 1 other adult on boat and a couple kids.  Here is a video of my friends daughter surfing so you can see my wave.  thoughts?  Im 210 pounds with a 5' 10" board so im assuming i should be able to let go of the rope.  

here is link to video of the wave. 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/hU7RdE5RbUCJEomT7

 

 

[Termi1]

I have a 2004 23 LSV and make a great wave. As mentioned above a shaper will help dramatically, I use the mission delta and really like it.  I have the front hard tank filled but also put a bag on the bow seat.  The rear locker bags are full and I typically run a bag under the port side seat.   

[vision24seven]

@Termi1 That sounds like a lot more than my two bags at 1350 lbs total.  Would you reccomend i move my port rear locker bag to port under the rear seat?  Just wondering,   or would you suggest i try shaper next first?   was hoping with a 25 lsv being so big i would only have to sink it with a couple bags and not invest so much.   

[Jgf042]

For a boat that big you need to get more of it in the water. Check marketplace on facebook. We have a bunch of used fatsacs pop up this time of year. Get another 750 for the non surf side and fill it half full. Then, ideally one in the bow as well. First thing I would do is build a homemade wake shaper for $50. Look at what your boat is rated to hold in weight and try to get CLOSER to there with water plus people.

 

 

[Zippymbr]

On 6/26/2023 at 3:13 PM, vision24seven said:

Howdy all, okay, put 750 pounds in my surfside/port locker, 600 pounds in middle ski locker, and i surfed fine but again, could not get enough consistent push to be able to let go of the rope. ony had 1 other adult on boat and a couple kids.  Here is a video of my friends daughter surfing so you can see my wave.  thoughts?  Im 210 pounds with a 5' 10" board so im assuming i should be able to let go of the rope.  

here is link to video of the wave. 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/hU7RdE5RbUCJEomT7

Still not enough ballast.  In my 23 LSV I have over 4K of ballast and and a upgraded prop with a GSA system and now my wave is as good as a new boat.  I spent 8K to get there but for me its a lot cheaper than 135K for a new boat

On 6/26/2023 at 3:13 PM, vision24seven said:

 

 

 

[carguy79ta]

A 25 ft boat needs A LOT of ballast. My boat (diff brand 25'+) has about 5500 lbs of water ballast and the wave is good but with 1000 lead the wave is massive. Bottom line: 25' and larger boats need to be SUNK. The wake shaper is good. I made one myself for about 30bucks IIRC. As stated above..keep an eye on total weight with crew and ballast. As you increase your ballast weight note that the boat will handle like a drunken pig. Watch for taking water over the bow. Also if your boat is loaded up..watch the water at the stern when you decelerate after a rider falls. Don't want to take water over the stern. Couple other things..if your loaded up heavy you can possibly hydrolock your motor..not good. If you are going to take a swim break drain off some rear ballast. Finally get a Tsumani (?) 3000 gph ballast pump with hose to keep in the boat in case of emergency. It can pump almost a 55gal drum of water in a min if some how you take on a lot of water. The older boats don't have as much fretboard. Good luck! 

[vision24seven]

On 7/8/2023 at 8:55 PM, carguy79ta said:

A 25 ft boat needs A LOT of ballast. My boat (diff brand 25'+) has about 5500 lbs of water ballast and the wave is good but with 1000 lead the wave is massive. Bottom line: 25' and larger boats need to be SUNK. The wake shaper is good. I made one myself for about 30bucks IIRC. As stated above..keep an eye on total weight with crew and ballast. As you increase your ballast weight note that the boat will handle like a drunken pig. Watch for taking water over the bow. Also if your boat is loaded up..watch the water at the stern when you decelerate after a rider falls. Don't want to take water over the stern. Couple other things..if your loaded up heavy you can possibly hydrolock your motor..not good. If you are going to take a swim break drain off some rear ballast. Finally get a Tsumani (?) 3000 gph ballast pump with hose to keep in the boat in case of emergency. It can pump almost a 55gal drum of water in a min if some how you take on a lot of water. The older boats don't have as much fretboard. Good luck! 

awesome info here and above.   

@carguy79taMy boat weight capacity is 2900 lbs.  Are you saying that it is common to go far beyond the rated capacity?

[carguy79ta]

On 7/14/2023 at 5:38 PM, vision24seven said:

awesome info here and above.   

@carguy79taMy boat weight capacity is 2900 lbs.  Are you saying that it is common to go far beyond the rated capacity?

You are the Captain of your boat. You have to make the decision of what is safe and what is a calculated risk. If you are not comfortable with a particular course of action then dont do that. I am not familiar with the older boats. I did look up your drywt at about 4600 IIRC. That tells me you prolly have less freeboard than the newer boats so you can take water over the side/bow/stern easier. If you want to pursue larger waves then you will prolly have to add weight. Be careful and use common sense. Good luck!!

[twolsborn]

On 6/27/2023 at 4:13 AM, Termi1 said:

I have a 2004 23 LSV and make a great wave. As mentioned above a shaper will help dramatically, I use the mission delta and really like it.  I have the front hard tank filled but also put a bag on the bow seat.  The rear locker bags are full and I typically run a bag under the port side seat.   

Termi1 - I have a 2003 23 LSV. I think exact same boat.

running 750 in each rear locker, mid factory ballast about 400.  750-1200 ballast in bow.  Shaper: mission or bigger home made cutting board shaper. Run 10.5-11 mph.

I get a nice wave but have trouble consistently getting it a good wave.  Typically either get tall wave or longer but no push.

I'd love any tips for a consistent wave.

[twolsborn]

@Zippymbr I have the same boat.  2003 Malibu Wakesetter LSV.  Running 750 in each rear locker, mid factory ballast then 750-1250 in front and a wake shaper.  Surf prop. Not getting a consistent wake.
I'd love details of what you are running and how you got there.  Did you add the $5k GSA tab system?

[Zippymbr]

On 8/22/2023 at 11:06 PM, twolsborn said:

@Zippymbr I have the same boat.  2003 Malibu Wakesetter LSV.  Running 750 in each rear locker, mid factory ballast then 750-1250 in front and a wake shaper.  Surf prop. Not getting a consistent wake.
I'd love details of what you are running and how you got there.  Did you add the $5k GSA tab system?

Yes I added the GSA system.  My boat needs 4K of ballast to make its best wave.  I have 1100 bags on reversible pumps in each locker.  The stock MLS system is intact with 250 in the lockers a keel tank and bow tank.  I then have 650 Pounds of lead in 50 pound bags in each corner seat with one I move around to balance the wave.  I run at 9.8-10.2 speed and then use about 50% power wedge.  Sometimes it takes a min to dial in the Tabs and the wedge to get a perfect wave.  My wave is big and very long in the pocket.  I have surfed behind several new Maibu boats and their waves are bigger but not as long and surf able.  I Spent a ton but my family and friends love to surf.

[twolsborn]

@Zippymbr I have the same in rear & mid. No stock bow ballast.  Manual wedge instead of power.  All up or all down.  HP slightly less but close.  Very encouraging.

How much difference do the GSA tabs make vs a wake shaper?  Everything else I can easily reproduce but the tab system is expensive and a lot of money.

[DRB10SEVEN]

2 hours ago, twolsborn said:

@Zippymbr I have the same in rear & mid. No stock bow ballast.  Manual wedge instead of power.  All up or all down.  HP slightly less but close.  Very encouraging.

How much difference do the GSA tabs make vs a wake shaper?  Everything else I can easily reproduce but the tab system is expensive and a lot of money.

I have GSA and would never go back to a shaper. That being said, what made my boat have a surfable wave was the WEIGHT. (I run around 4000lbs in my 247) The main benefits I gained from Go Surf Assist have been consistency, length of wave, ease of use, and overall high end feel of an actual surf system.

BTW, you will typically need even more weight (especially in the rear) on a boat that has GSA vs a shaper.

[Zippymbr]

On 8/25/2023 at 1:12 PM, twolsborn said:

@Zippymbr I have the same in rear & mid. No stock bow ballast.  Manual wedge instead of power.  All up or all down.  HP slightly less but close.  Very encouraging.

How much difference do the GSA tabs make vs a wake shaper?  Everything else I can easily reproduce but the tab system is expensive and a lot of money.

For our boat the GSA takes all the guesswork out of the shaper.  I can adjust on the fly the tap and my wedge and mov some weight around if needed.  My wave is fantastic.  Not to be honest I needed more total weight to get a great wave with the GSA.  The mission Delta had such inconsistency as to where it was placed and how deep it was and then it would fall off.