2022 Malibu 23 LSV Stereo Writeup

[Brandonloos21]

So I have promised myself I would do a write up of my fully custom designed stereo and install, as well as share some of my learnings along the process. I have installed multiple stereos in previous years, piggybacking off of the stock system, and having help from local stereo shops for boxes and installation. In 2023, I decided I wanted to go big, and do it all myself. 
 

I wanted it to be big, and previously had full wetsounds systems, utilizing 4 rev 10’s, 2 xxx12’s, etc. When the rev 12’s came out I knew I had to have them and wanted to go beyond. 
 

This year I’m deciding to go with 6 rev 12’s as the towers. As for subs, I liked the DC audio xl elite subs, as you can get more out of car audio than any marine sub, and they don’t require a whole lot of airspace ported, which is great for marine application. Cabins are staying stock 8 revo 8’s, as I think they sound good and get the job done.

As for amplifiers, each pair of rev 12’s will be powered by a sundown salt 200.4, which provides 700x2 bridged at 4 ohm. Each subwoofer will be powered by a sundown salt 3k, I’m still unsure if I want to do these 2 amps strapped OR if I want to gain match them, any input would be awesome. Lastly for the cabins, I’m going to run a sundown salt 500.4. I decided to go with the sundown salt series, as I feel confident enough they’ll stay dry, and they are great low voltage (engine off) performers. Yes these amps have some headroom compared to what the speakers call for, but this is perfect, as it should help them operate efficiently. 
 

As for source, I am going to (for now at least) be running the stock medallion unit, paired with an audio control DM810 DSP. This is going to be a learning experience for me, as the world of DSP seems to be huge, with a bunch of room for tweaking. 
 

My battery setup is just going to be basic Duracell GC2 6v batteries, as I’ve seen some guys use them, they say they can take a beating in terms of deep cell cycling, and they are very affordable at Sam’s club. To charge them I’m going to run a ProMariner ProNautic 1250p. 

Edited April 25, 2023 by Brandonloos21

[Brandonloos21]

This weekend, I started off by test fitting the tower speakers. 6 rev 12’s, and I’m deciding whether I want ti go 6 horizontal or 2 sets of 3. I’m leaning more towards the 2 sets of 3, as headroom could be an issue for some friends and family. I’m kind of bummed to be leaving out that “line array” effect, but I think we should be content.

I tested them out on the front most bar too, but the tube was so large that there would be a slight gap in the clamps, which my OCD did not like. 

[Brandonloos21]

Due to some western pa weather, this weekend was dedicated to designing and fabricating the subwoofer enclosure. A buddy and myself are running the same dc xl elite 12 subs, so we built them together this weekend. My final decision on spec was 3 cubic ft, 34hz, 42sqin port area for a dual box. I am going to squeeze this in the observers compartment, subs and port facing the hull. Got the basic construction down, and will be adding bracing and resin this upcoming week/weekend. I opted to use 13 ply birch and a dual front baffle due to the high power of these subs (2200rms each). 

[Brandonloos21]

I spent today designing and fabbing up the amp rack, which will go under the helm. The amp rack consists of 4 shelfs to fit the amplifiers. I utilized the smaller amp on the bottom to take advantage of the expanding width in the helm due to the outer hull. That way I was able to fit the larger amps as well. I used 3/4 HDPE and countersunk the screws. The HDPE was reprocessed HDPE, as it was a bit cheaper, though it’s a little less machinable than normal. Cost savings was more important here as it will be covered up by a faceplate. 
 

I guess I could have gone a LITTLE slimmer on the width, but at least this will make sliding amps around to tune a little easier. All I will need to tune on the amp will be gains, as crossovers can be left wide open, due to DSP designating the crossovers.   

 

Edited April 25, 2023 by Brandonloos21

[stang233]

Fun build to track.   How many 6v batteries are you going to run?  What alternator? 

[CaptainMorgan]

this is a serious project!  if worried about headroom, what about putting the speakers above the tower like @Slurpee is working?

you worried about heat buildup from all those amps?  i've never built such a system, but those amps look like power hogs and that solid rack won't conduct any heat and its gonna choke off whatever minimal air circulation you could have

[Brandonloos21]

5 hours ago, stang233 said:

Fun build to track.   How many 6v batteries are you going to run?  What alternator? 

8 GC2 6v’s. The alternator I went with is Mechman 170a. Plan on using at beginning of day to keep batts topped off. Wouldn’t want to use toward end of day and strain it on depleted batts. 

[Brandonloos21]

3 hours ago, CaptainMorgan said:

this is a serious project!  if worried about headroom, what about putting the speakers above the tower like @Slurpee is working?

you worried about heat buildup from all those amps?  i've never built such a system, but those amps look like power hogs and that solid rack won't conduct any heat and its gonna choke off whatever minimal air circulation you could have

Not a huge fan of speakers above, plus we trailer often so Bimini is always going up and down. 
 

Not super concerned about heat, as these amps have some nice headroom ontop of what the speakers need, they’re also super efficient at low voltages (engine off). To really push these amps we’d have to be full blare and I’m not sure how long listeners would want to put up w that for, I’d say we’ll do majority of our listening at 50-75%. 
 

If I do find heat to be an issue, I’ll build a fan panel/board to attach to the rear of the rack and pull ambient air across the amps!

[Slurpee]

Over the bimini speakers are definitely an acquired taste.  And the bimini going up and down would be a chore for sure.  A big one.  I never move mine once it's up but once a year or so.

Very nice selection of amps and the rack is interesting.  I'm going to be cutting up my rack somehow to fit in the 2023 since the compartment is different than the 2019. I'm still considering things.

My experience with the amps even when running them very efficiently was they do get too hot here in Texas without a little airflow.  I ended up with a solution using some fans and never worried about it again even on 110 degree days.

As for the DSP, there is a bunch of hardware agnostic trainings on JL's website.  You can use the Tun software to measure a lot easier than REW I'm finding.  You'd have an extra step since you'll need your own GUI for your AudioControl DSP, but it's nice.  Makes seeing the phase wrapping and getting things aligned better for blending the sound.

[Brandonloos21]

35 minutes ago, Slurpee said:

Over the bimini speakers are definitely an acquired taste.  And the bimini going up and down would be a chore for sure.  A big one.  I never move mine once it's up but once a year or so.

Very nice selection of amps and the rack is interesting.  I'm going to be cutting up my rack somehow to fit in the 2023 since the compartment is different than the 2019. I'm still considering things.

My experience with the amps even when running them very efficiently was they do get too hot here in Texas without a little airflow.  I ended up with a solution using some fans and never worried about it again even on 110 degree days.

As for the DSP, there is a bunch of hardware agnostic trainings on JL's website.  You can use the Tun software to measure a lot easier than REW I'm finding.  You'd have an extra step since you'll need your own GUI for your AudioControl DSP, but it's nice.  Makes seeing the phase wrapping and getting things aligned better for blending the sound.

Yes it’s acquired, I like the look of them tucked in personally, but to each their own, that’s the great thing about having your own boat is who cares what others think of how you build/modify it!

Are you still doing 1 sub under ob and 1 under helm? If so, maybe you could glass a board in on the hull side. If not, maybe think dual subs in ob and rack under helm.

So here in Western PA, we only rarely see 90+. Like mentioned these amps have some headroom as well as run efficient at lower voltages, so im going to play this one by some trial and error. If decided that we need some cooling, I’ll install some simple 12v fans to pull air across the amps. 

I have DM810 baseline tunes for everything. I’ll be running everything mono. Plan on (for the cabins and towers) starting at a bit of a higher crossover, and selecting a gradual sloping DP slope in order to also play some of the lower frequencies. I’m wanting to RTA pink noise in order to find resonant frequencies and model EQ to a target curve. 

As for tuning gameplan, im thinking this will be the method once everything is installed 

- Check HU for clipping point, turn gain up to and slightly back off (what test tones would you recommend for cabins/towers/subs)

- Check DM810 output for clipping point, turn gain up to and slightly back off

- Check each amplifier for clipping point, turn gain up to and slightly back off

- Gain match each of the sub amps and tower amps

- RTA for resonant frequencies and target curve per channel (pink noise)

- Time delays

- Anything else?

[Slurpee]

Yeah, they look better under the bimini.  I'm just not allowed to play them if I have them there. LOL.  The cabins are plenty loud and sound better than an HLCD in your ear.  Above the bimini the sound is clearer to the surfer and I don't need as much speaker to fill the area with good music.  That's basically how I ended up on that path.  Now, we don't play music when we wakeboard.  If I did, then I know I'd be squeezing 4 Rev12's up there somehow to get the projection.  Big speakers like that would start looking odd up there I think.  Rev12s sound really nice and are crazy loud so far here on this lake.  I've wondered about powering more than one pair to.  So seeing your amp choices is really interesting.  I've only seen IXFE's solution besides yours.  Nice to see folks solving that challenge now.

I would add a couple iterations of the last two steps.  I found if I went too "car audio" on my boat tune with precise time delays and phase matching at one location then the whole boat sounded like crap except in the driver's seat where it sounded awesome.  By all means make a file with that tune, but don't plan on using it.  I don't mean it was less than perfect either, but awful.  Instead on this big 25 footer I focused on gains and time delays so that in the bow, front of cabin, back of cabin, and swim platform the music sounded equally loud and blended as you move through the cabin.  It should keep you from being able to tell which speakers you're hearing over others.  I've got two tunes like that.  One for anchoring and one for underway.  Messing with the time delays too much can really goof with the sound.  So maybe don't even touch those too much at first until you gain the speakers to blend well and get happy with the RTA.  Use them to tackle the bits in the pink noise you don't like.

I'm still doing the ported 12W6 in the helm.  Same design as last time.  I cut all the plywood last night actually.  I just didn't have the screws on hand to finish buidling it and the store was closed.  I'll get to it tonight or tomorrow.

I am going to do a second sub.  I think what I'm going to do is put in a well sealed wall (or maybe it's a floor in this case) in the storage under the port seats to create an ideal location for an Infinite Baffle sub.  I've never done one in a boat before.  Just homes.  They play loud and deep as long as you can keep the front and rear waves from colliding with a big baffle.  We don't use that space really for anything right now but an anchor and some buouys.  Ocassionally an extra bag.  And it's already so big that I should be able to get the entire compartment baffled off at floor level and have all the necessary volume, and still have storage under the seats on top.  I'll probably stay with JL marine because that area DOES get wet.  12M6IB probably.  Wish I could get it in 2 ohms.

[COOP]

This is a great example of why wake boat bans are getting more common.

 

 

Also, the Audio Control piece is the cats meow. Ive used it several times.

Edited April 25, 2023 by COOP

[RyanB]

I’m fine listening to my own music on the boat, not so much into listening to someone else’s. I feel the same way about obnoxiously loud exhaust. 
 

Maybe I’m officially old. Get off my lawn. 

[Brandonloos21]

31 minutes ago, COOP said:

This is a great example of why wake boat bans are getting more common.

 

 

Also, the Audio Control piece is the cats meow. Ive used it several times.

Lol, in my defense, anyone can be loud and obnoxious if you want to be. I could take a stock boat with sound pack 1 and go around docks/establishments and piss people off the the point of the comments being “it’s always those wake boats” if I wanted.

As a matter of fact, give me a Yamaha jet boat with tower speakers and I’m sure I could accomplish the same, and even achieve the same “wake boat” comment, hahaha

The times we bump music are either on the lake in a party cove where everyone’s doing the same, or the river tied up in the middle of nowhere where everyone’s doing the same. 

As long as you’re cognizant of your surroundings you’re good. Kind of the same argument we make in terms of wakes/waves. 

In terms of the DM810, I’m really excited to see the difference it makes with tuning and how it sounds. 

Edited April 25, 2023 by Brandonloos21

[Brandonloos21]

13 minutes ago, RyanB said:

I’m fine listening to my own music on the boat, not so much into listening to someone else’s. I feel the same way about obnoxiously loud exhaust. 
 

Maybe I’m officially old. Get off my lawn. 

See above reply, same applies. To each their own, if you don’t want to hear other peoples music, then I wouldn’t assume you to hang out in party cove/tie ups. 

[Slurpee]

24 minutes ago, COOP said:

This is a great example of why wake boat bans are getting more common.

 

 

Also, the Audio Control piece is the cats meow. Ive used it several times.

I like Audio Control.  The DSP chips are top shelf and the firmware is clean and fast and optimized.  I need to go grab the latest GUI.  When I got into the first JL TWK-D8 back in 2017 the AC stuff was all setup for cars and wasn't flexible enough to easily use in boats.  That was a long time ago in the software world.  I think it's time I sound out the other choices.  I have zero complaints about JL Tun software though.  It's just rapidly accelerating with updates and features and I love it.  But I like to see competition and innovation to.

Speaking to the loud boats.  As long as the OP doesn't turn his teenage son loose on the lake with Nickelback at 100% volume, I like the engineering of pushing the upper right corner like this.  We all benefit from clever ideas.  OEM stereo setups are already putting four 10" HLCDs in the hands of Wallys everywhere.  I'll take six 12" HLCDs in the hands of a competent listener over that.

After a lot of time on the lake with too many Wetsounds it was obvious I just needed two pair of coaxials to have too loud sound for the surfer.  And it decays enough at range that it doesn't piss off the lake. Above the bimini makes it sound good.  Bimini's are the enemy for tower sound, and there's not much that can be done about it without mounting the speakers on the gunnels like a pontoon boat or over the tower which has a bunch of other hurdles.  Just punish the cabin and blast through.

[Brandonloos21]

2 minutes ago, Slurpee said:

I like Audio Control.  The DSP chips are top shelf and the firmware is clean and fast and optimized.  I need to go grab the latest GUI.  When I got into the first JL TWK-D8 back in 2017 the AC stuff was all setup for cars and wasn't flexible enough to easily use in boats.  That was a long time ago in the software world.  I think it's time I sound out the other choices.  I have zero complaints about JL Tun software though.  It's just rapidly accelerating with updates and features and I love it.  But I like to see competition and innovation to.

Speaking to the loud boats.  As long as the OP doesn't turn his teenage son loose on the lake with Nickelback at 100% volume, I like the engineering of pushing the upper right corner like this.  We all benefit from clever ideas.  OEM stereo setups are already putting four 10" HLCDs in the hands of Wallys everywhere.  I'll take six 12" HLCDs in the hands of a competent listener over that.

After a lot of time on the lake with too many Wetsounds it was obvious I just needed two pair of coaxials to have too loud sound for the surfer.  And it decays enough at range that it doesn't piss off the lake. Above the bimini makes it sound good.  Bimini's are the enemy for tower sound, and there's not much that can be done about it without mounting the speakers on the gunnels like a pontoon boat or over the tower which has a bunch of other hurdles.  Just punish the cabin and blast through.

Yes my point exactly. If we’re tied off in the middle of the river and out of the boats swimming or rafted, let her rip. 

Pulling out of the nice restaurant on the lake, don’t be an a**. 

Also mentioned above my listening will probably be 50-75% max volume. 

When you say “New GUI” did they come out with a new interface? I need to get the 810 all plugged in and check out the updates available. I will also comment and say I messed with the jumpers to turn the auto on with signal off, as well as turn the output voltages up. 

[Slurpee]

When I decided I wanted to directly drive my cabin speakers I looked at all the DSP options at the time.  The AC one and the JL one were the most thorough.  The AC one was better in the sense that it gave you a couple of All-Pass filters to use.  But the AC one - at the time - made you dance around various car setups.  Like templates you had to defeat since it was a boat.  It didn't lend itself well to the biamplified setups in boats with big cabin coaxials with crossovers and the same with tower speakers be they HLCD or CoAx's.  In 6 years I hope they've modified the GUI so you can look at the system from a block diagram like point of view.  So it'll be very cool when you get to that part of your install in this thread.

For instance I just grabbed one of my MVI 800/8 mixer setups below.  I've got another one for the other 4 cabins and DSP tuned outputs to the tower speakers.  This one has the DSP tunes to the subs.  The other has the DSP processing for the towers.  I have two non-DSP SDX2 amps to the towers and subs respectively that take their inputs from these DSP enabled amps.

 

[COOP]

51 minutes ago, Brandonloos21 said:

as well as turn the output voltages up. 

Please keep in mind these are NOT volume controls. These have a high output voltage, every system I have done with these I have been able to leave the amplifier input gains ALL the way down and set everything with the Audio Control piece. If youre setting the Audio Control gain high and still turning up your amps gains youre doing it wrong. Also, too high an input voltage can damage a lot of amplifiers, so find out what the amps can take so you dont burn up the inputs. 

[Brandonloos21]

36 minutes ago, COOP said:

Please keep in mind these are NOT volume controls. These have a high output voltage, every system I have done with these I have been able to leave the amplifier input gains ALL the way down and set everything with the Audio Control piece. If youre setting the Audio Control gain high and still turning up your amps gains youre doing it wrong. Also, too high an input voltage can damage a lot of amplifiers, so find out what the amps can take so you dont burn up the inputs. 

I am talking about the actual jumpers inside of the DSP, you can move those for weaker headunits to turn output voltages up, almost like a line driver, in order to be able to keep the amp gains down and reduce noise. But yes, the interface gain control as well I will be cognizant of. 

Edited April 25, 2023 by Brandonloos21

[COOP]

You should not have to move those jumpers. That unit has more than enough output. The ONLY reason to move them would be if you have an amplifier that can accept more that 5 volts of input, and again, if using it this way the amp gains should be dead nuts all the way down. Im not talking out of my a** on this. I come from the car audio industry (20 yrs installing all manner of competition sq and spl systems) Ive been using Audio Control products since the early 90s. Tune this correctly and the noise floor will be non existent and it will sound fantastic. tune it wrong and it will make all kinds of noise, sound poor and possibly damage your amps.

The factory setting is 0-5 volts.

You now have it at 0-10 volts. You will fry your amp inputs if they cant take that kind of voltage. 

 

Edited April 25, 2023 by COOP

[Brandonloos21]

25 minutes ago, COOP said:

You should not have to move those jumpers. That unit has more than enough output. The ONLY reason to move them would be if you have an amplifier that can accept more that 5 volts of input, and again, if using it this way the amp gains should be dead nuts all the way down. Im not talking out of my a** on this. I come from the car audio industry (20 yrs installing all manner of competition sq and spl systems) Ive been using Audio Control products since the early 90s. Tune this correctly and the noise floor will be non existent and it will sound fantastic. tune it wrong and it will make all kinds of noise, sound poor and possibly damage your amps.

The factory setting is 0-5 volts.

You now have it at 0-10 volts. You will fry your amp inputs if they cant take that kind of voltage. 

 

Salt amplifiers are rated up to 6v, thoughts? The large/known installer from California area who I talked to uses these frequently and recommended this is what I have it set at for my application. 

[Slurpee]

What MLA said. 

[COOP]

50 minutes ago, Brandonloos21 said:

Salt amplifiers are rated up to 6v, thoughts? The large/known installer from California area who I talked to uses these frequently and recommended this is what I have it set at for my application. 

I would use the higher settings. But when you get into the software to set gains start low. 

[COOP]

Btw, the Audio Control software still isnt that intuitive.