Real world Towing a 25LSV with a newer Tahoe/Suburban/Grand Wagoneer - And weight

[Slayer]

31 minutes ago, SouthsideBoarder said:

Sorry if this is a bit off topic but what is a very solid used half ton pickup tow vehicle? Obviously all have some sort of issues and nothing is perfect. Seems like the GM 5.3 or 6.0 with the 6 speed is fairly good from what I’ve read. If I should move this to a new topic let me know. 

Depending on what you're towing, I would prefer the GM with the 6.0 over the 5.3.  I would also look at the F-150 with the 3.5 ecoboost and max tow package.  

[UWSkier]

1 hour ago, Slayer said:

Depending on what you're towing, I would prefer the GM with the 6.0 over the 5.3.  I would also look at the F-150 with the 3.5 ecoboost and max tow package.  

Mated to the 6 speed, I agree.  8 speed or 10 speed and 5.3 re-enters the conversation.  I have a 5.3 with a 3.55 rear and (one that works well) 8 speed and was actually shocked how well it did towing the RV to WI and back through the mountains of AZ, NM, CO, and the rolling hills of the Ozarks.  I didn't scale it, but we were rolling heavy.  Probably close to 7500 lbs if I had to guess.  I locked out 7th and 8th gears manually.  I could have used another gear between 3 and 4, which the 10 speed has.

[ahopkins22LSV]

48 minutes ago, UWSkier said:

Mated to the 6 speed, I agree.  8 speed or 10 speed and 5.3 re-enters the conversation.  I have a 5.3 with a 3.55 rear and (one that works well) 8 speed and was actually shocked how well it did towing the RV to WI and back through the mountains of AZ, NM, CO, and the rolling hills of the Ozarks.  I didn't scale it, but we were rolling heavy.  Probably close to 7500 lbs if I had to guess.  I locked out 7th and 8th gears manually.  I could have used another gear between 3 and 4, which the 10 speed has.

Also in 2019 the 5.3 throttle mapping and other programming was completely revamped. Going from my 2018 5.3 6speed to my 2021 5.3 8 speed is night and day different. It is so much better for daily driving and towing. It definitely wasn’t the best with the old programing and 6 speed but everyone go didn’t like that should at least test drive a new truck. Plus 2023’s come with the 10 speed even with the 5.3. 

[oldjeep]

3 hours ago, SouthsideBoarder said:

Sorry if this is a bit off topic but what is a very solid used half ton pickup tow vehicle? Obviously all have some sort of issues and nothing is perfect. Seems like the GM 5.3 or 6.0 with the 6 speed is fairly good from what I’ve read. If I should move this to a new topic let me know. 

Gen 4 Ram 1500 - 2011 or newer (2019 - present would be a 1500 Classic (still Gen 4)).  The newer ones have a nice 8 speed trans, but the 6 speed was very good too.  If there are any common problems from 2011 on, I have not heard of them.  2009-2010 had some issues with exhaust manifold to head studs snapping.  Was a warranty thing but wouldn't be any more.  175K on the 2009 and 60K so far on the 2018.

Edited January 20, 2023 by oldjeep

[SouthsideBoarder]

4 hours ago, Slayer said:

Depending on what you're towing, I would prefer the GM with the 6.0 over the 5.3.  I would also look at the F-150 with the 3.5 ecoboost and max tow package.  

Only towing would be a 2018 23LSV about 2-3 miles twice a year from the ramp to the dealer for storage. It would be my daily driver outside of that. 

[Slayer]

On 1/20/2023 at 4:39 PM, SouthsideBoarder said:

Only towing would be a 2018 23LSV about 2-3 miles twice a year from the ramp to the dealer for storage. It would be my daily driver outside of that. 

If I was in the market for a GM truck, I would be looking for one with the 6.2.  That's simply my opinion.  @UWSkier makes a great point, but I simply don't care for the 5.3.  

Edited January 23, 2023 by Slayer

[RyanB]

2 hours ago, Slayer said:

If I was in the market for a GM truck, I would be looking for one with the 6.0.  That's simply my opinion.  @UWSkier makes a great point, but I simply don't care for the 5.3.  

Agree that in a GM, I'd go for the 6.2.  I'm also not a fan of the 5.3 (at least not the ones in the rental Tahoe/Yukon/Burbs that I have rented).  Maybe the difference is that I live at elevation, but I've never been impressed with the 5.3.

[spikew919]

The 6.2 is only way I would ever go. Had them both in same gear ratios and  the 6.2 out performs in every aspect. Even in fuel mileage in real world application. 

[UWSkier]

2 hours ago, spikew919 said:

The 6.2 is only way I would ever go. Had them both in same gear ratios and  the 6.2 out performs in every aspect. Even in fuel mileage in real world application. 

Yeah, but who wants to run Premium?

[wdr]

I ran premium 93 exclusively in my 6.2 DD for years until the gas price increases started. Switched to mid 89 and haven’t noticed a difference in performance or gas mileage. With both I am seeing @ 19 mpg in town using the TFL mileage process. I only drive 30 miles a day @ 45mph round trip so that has a bit to do with it I imagine. 

[jjackkrash]

The 5.3 does not have as much grunt as the 6.2 but it's not supposed to.  I think it's a fine engine, but obviously the 6.2 has more power.  The other option is the 3.0L diesel, which I absolutely love.  

[UWSkier]

Just now, jjackkrash said:

The 5.3 does not have as much grunt as the 6.2 but it's not supposed to.  I think it's a fine engine, but obviously the 6.2 has more power.  The other option is the 3.0L diesel, which I absolutely love.  

that's the only engine I'd consider in a new GM half ton TBH.

[wdr]

42 minutes ago, jjackkrash said:

The 5.3 does not have as much grunt as the 6.2 but it's not supposed to.  I think it's a fine engine, but obviously the 6.2 has more power.  The other option is the 3.0L diesel, which I absolutely love.  

What is 3.0 like in comparison to the 6.2 for towing?

[RyanB]

1 hour ago, UWSkier said:

Yeah, but who wants to run Premium?

 

1 hour ago, UWSkier said:

that's the only engine I'd consider in a new GM half ton TBH.

So, I’ll be “that guy”. Why is there a reluctance to run premium, but ok with diesel?  In my market, diesel is a significant premium over the cost of premium. 
 

Im not against the 3.0. But fuel prices for the last couple of years make cost per mile go in favor of all the gassers. I think the small diesel market is close to dead. 

[Bozboat]

7 minutes ago, RyanB said:

 

Why is there a reluctance to run premium, but ok with diesel?  
 

 

This is going to keep me awake at night.

[SouthsideBoarder]

1 hour ago, UWSkier said:

that's the only engine I'd consider in a new GM half ton TBH.

So which brand and engine is your overall ideal half ton?

[jjackkrash]

1 hour ago, wdr said:

What is 3.0 like in comparison to the 6.2 for towing?

I have the 6.2 in an Escalade and the 3.0L in a 1/2 ton Sierra.  The boat and trailer are around 4500 lbs. loaded.  Both vehicles are good tow vehicles for this size boat.  The 3.0l is a little smoother towing and tows more like a diesel (go figure) in a better, flatter RPM range, but, honestly, I think both engines do a good job.  The 3.0l gets quite a bit better milage loaded and unloaded, but, as Ryan noted, diesel is pretty expensive right now even over premium.  I really like the way diesels drive so that's just my bias.  But the 6.2L is a great gas power plant.

Edited January 23, 2023 by jjackkrash

[wdr]

I have been looking at both, but how I normally would use it and the cost of overall diesel ownership kind of scare me away from the 3.0. The older 3.0 at 270hp/460lbft tq is a wash against the 420/460 in my current 6.2. The new LZO is slightly better at 305/495 but not significantly and then the $4.00+ gallon reality sets in. If I could see a significant fuel savings over the 6.2 then I could probably justify the 3.0. Smarter guys than me on here could probably make the case. 

[RyanB]

30 minutes ago, wdr said:

Smarter guys than me on here could probably make the case. 

I won’t claim to be the smarter guy here, but economically, there isn’t a case to be made. 
 

In my mind, the better solution is direct injection forced induction gas. I’ve never been a Ford fan, but I feel like they figured it out with the 3.5 EcoBoost. Similar torque to the 3.0 diesels. Significantly more HP. And the less expensive gasoline fuel. I’m looking forward to the 3.0 I6 in upcoming MOPARs. 
 

Both the EcoBoost and Hurricane will be best in 1500 platforms for towing performance. Significantly better than the 3.0 diesels. And much more fun to drive when you aren’t towing. 

[UWSkier]

1 hour ago, RyanB said:

 

So, I’ll be “that guy”. Why is there a reluctance to run premium, but ok with diesel?  In my market, diesel is a significant premium over the cost of premium. 
 

Im not against the 3.0. But fuel prices for the last couple of years make cost per mile go in favor of all the gassers. I think the small diesel market is close to dead. 

In my market, the math still works out that the baby diesel would be cheaper to operate from a fuel perspective than Premium by quite a bit.  Difference between 91 octane and Diesel here is only around 20 cents.  It's about a wash when comparing against 87 octane.

[UWSkier]

1 hour ago, SouthsideBoarder said:

So which brand and engine is your overall ideal half ton?

I'm not an expert, but if I could get an F150 Powerboost Lariat with the 7.2kw charger and 2000 lbs of payload, I'd be at the dealer ordering one right now.

[jjackkrash]

For what it's worth, I had a 2022 Tundra with the 3.5L turbo (not hybrid) and while it had plenty of power, I did not like the way it towed. It was turbo laggy and surged too much for my taste towing down the highway, even with its new 10-speed.  So I traded it for the GM diesel (and for a few other reasons).  Both GM options (6.2l and diesel) are better, IMO.  

Edited January 23, 2023 by jjackkrash

[wdr]

Gas is about $1.00 a gal cheaper than diesel, today. Last year when both were below $3.00 gal a diesel made a lot more sense and who knows where it is going to level out at. I miss the days of .25 a gallon as a kid. I had Blue Oval  blood in my veins for years. Now, it probably makes more sense for the way I would normally use it, but I just can’t subscribe to a smaller displacement, boosted engine living a trouble free life as long as I normally own a truck. 

[LakePTDoc]

last november I compared fuel usage, where I looked at how many gallons of fuel I used in my 2015 with a 5.3 and my 2021 with a 3.0 and found gas could be a dollar cheaper than diesel and it would be a break even on fuel cost per miles driven.  I love my 3.0 4x4 crew cab.  I got 14.5 mph towing about 5k boat at 65 mph and about 27 mpg on the highway unloaded when we drove cross country and found the conversion on the truck was not quite as high as if I calculated fuel consumption and miles driven.  So yes I may be spending more at the pump per pump but at least 550 miles between fill ups with the 3.0L.  and of course pulling the same boat I was getting 9-11 mph at the same speed, and luckly to get more than 21 mpg on the highway with the 5.3.  

[shawndoggy]

38 minutes ago, LakePTDoc said:

last november I compared fuel usage, where I looked at how many gallons of fuel I used in my 2015 with a 5.3 and my 2021 with a 3.0 and found gas could be a dollar cheaper than diesel and it would be a break even on fuel cost per miles driven.  I love my 3.0 4x4 crew cab.  I got 14.5 mph towing about 5k boat at 65 mph and about 27 mpg on the highway unloaded when we drove cross country and found the conversion on the truck was not quite as high as if I calculated fuel consumption and miles driven.  So yes I may be spending more at the pump per pump but at least 550 miles between fill ups with the 3.0L.  and of course pulling the same boat I was getting 9-11 mph at the same speed, and luckly to get more than 21 mpg on the highway with the 5.3.  

are you factoring in DEF and oil changes too?