Towing Truck

[DaBU]

Okay, I am stumped. I have a 2021 23 LSV that sits on a trailer with 20’ wheels. Estimated weight with gear, gas and trailer is est. at 7,200 lbs. I tow with a 6.2L Denali which seems to have plenty of power and I appreciate the airbags. However I can feel this load pushing around the Yukon.  I live in the Rocky Mountain region and looking at a Yukon XL with 3.0 Duramax but I am second guessing if I really need a bigger truck.   The question is; would a 3.0L Sierra (with airbags) suffice or should I consider a 2500 Diesel? I do make long trips down to Powell/Mead and up to Island Park and love the space in the Yukon, but can make the switch to a legit truck, if needed. But is anyone has experience towing with the 3.0L Yukon XL I would be interested in your experience. 
 

also, Ram Eco Vs. Durmax…..

[BlindSquirrel]

I went the diesel route, ram 2500 megacab , and never been happier. Came from a v8 4runner that got 6 mpg pulling our vlx. I tow my 21 vlx all over the country at 18 mpg now. I also towed my brothers old 2019 25 lsv for a while no sweat. Would get 16ish mpg with cruise set at 75. Unreal power. Got the backflip bed cover to help with dry storage when needed. My brother has a 2020 Chevy high country duramax. It’s a nice rig too. Has more tech and rides a little softer…. But no mega cab option. I can’t comment on the baby diesel but think @ahopkinsVTX drove one? 

[Sparky450]

I am going to recommend you borrow a 2500 diesel, gas whatever. Tow your boat 100 miles.  Then make your decision. IMO. A 1/2 ton is still a 1/2 ton. We all no what opinions are like everyone has one  I would never tow my 25LSV with less than a 3/4 ton chassis. I tow, in some form or another, almost daily. 

Edited December 24, 2021 by Sparky450

[ahopkins22LSV]

55 minutes ago, BlindSquirrel said:

I went the diesel route, ram 2500 megacab , and never been happier. Came from a v8 4runner that got 6 mpg pulling our vlx. I tow my 21 vlx all over the country at 18 mpg now. I also towed my brothers old 2019 25 lsv for a while no sweat. Would get 16ish mpg with cruise set at 75. Unreal power. Got the backflip bed cover to help with dry storage when needed. My brother has a 2020 Chevy high country duramax. It’s a nice rig too. Has more tech and rides a little softer…. But no mega cab option. I can’t comment on the baby diesel but think @ahopkinsVTX drove one? 

I didn’t. I heavily debated buying one in my new Sierra but went with 5.3 because I knew it would 100% work for my applications.

That said, it gets amazing reviews and I am kinda bummed I didn’t get it.

That, that said, I agree with sparky. Do it right for that boat and terrain. 2500. The boat on a scale is going to weight more than the estimated 7200. 

[jjackkrash]

The 2019 and later 1500s, and 2021 and later Yukons, are improved tow vehicles over the previous generation.  That new 3.0L diesel with the 10-speed is also a great combo.  I suspect you could get away with one of the new models and the 3.0L diesel.  That said, neither one compare to a real Duramax on an HD chassis.  And the ride on the new HD trucks even unloaded is awesome.  I would also say that a 3500 is basically the same truck as a 2500 except you get more payload rating and full torque in 1st gear.  SRW 3500 would be my vote if I had to pick one tow vehicle and did not need to tow more than 14K pounds.  I have been daily driving an HD truck in one form or another since 2010; this year I got a company car and don't have to drive my DRW to work, but I would if I had to pick just one and frequently drive it to work anyway because I love driving it.  

 

Edited December 25, 2021 by jjackkrash

[Stevo]

Back in 2014 I bought a GMC Sierra Denali 1500 truck , wife was driving 2010 Yukon Denali and when we made the jump from our 01 VLX to 2014 23lsv  I dropped the 1500 like 3rd period French.  I bought a used 2011 f350 with the 6.7l diesel for roughly 48k and never looked back. Towing was a dream.

I just sold the 2011 for 45k 7yrs later with 110k miles and ordered a 2022 f350. The 22 ride quality is vastly improved over my previous generation. And the bells and whistles are a welcomed bonus.

take @Sparky450 advise and demo or borrow one to get a feel for it, but I’d get in line and place an order so it would get here before boating season. I ordered in may and took delivery in late September. 

I heard 22 Ford orders now are running close to delivery around the closing of the 22 order bank and dealers have started talking 23’s

also food for thought I ordered wheels tires and some suspension components back in September when I took delivery and nothing has shown up yet. 

[MLBurns]

If you just refuse to move up to 2500/3500 try upgrading your tires. I have a 6.2/10 speed that I put 10ply load range E tires on it and now it tows similar to my 2500 HD. Sure it did sacrifice some ride quality, but when I am towing the 5th and the wife is pulling the 247 I don't have to worry about her towing setup.

[ThinBuLine]

17 minutes ago, MLBurns said:

If you just refuse to move up to 2500/3500 try upgrading your tires. I have a 6.2/10 speed that I put 10ply load range E tires on it and now it tows similar to my 2500 HD. Sure it did sacrifice some ride quality, but when I am towing the 5th and the wife is pulling the 247 I don't have to worry about her towing setup.

I think the issue is weight of the boat pushing the truck around rather than tongue weight. For tongue weight, yes heavier duty 10 ply tires will support more weight and less risk of a blow out. 
 

these trucks have enough power now days to straight pull just about anything. Great example for the visual effect of this is the tundra pulling the space shuttle… marketing scheme successful and I have first hand account that the tundra can pull just about anything. 
 

however the issue for these half tons is stopping and turning. These heavy boats just push the lighter weight trucks around and the brakes arnt built to support that kind of load. They also don’t have exhaust brakes. 
 

I’ll get off my soap box but tires alone won’t make the truck tow any better or worse and you might be feeling a placebo effect with the bigger tires. Please be careful when towing heavy loads. 

[dwc032]

I wouldn’t use my 2018 Escalade for long tows, but anything within 150 miles and it’s fine.  If your just staying local or short trips your good. 
 

Most of our Lakes we go to are pretty close. You will be fine with your 6.2 Denali with the factory air suspension. You don’t need a 250-350 diesel. I have a 2022 duramax 3500, but I use that for my camper and sometimes the boat. The cost of these newer diesels are ridiculous. Are Escalade is fine just drive conservative and you will be good. 

[Surf4FamFun]

Comparing a Sequoia and a diesel F-250 crew cab 4x4 the Ford feels like it is pulling the boat.  The Sequoia feels like is is negotiating with the 2021 23 MXZ on where we are going.  The diesel power is really nice but it is the stability of the tow that is the big thing for me.  The Sequoia is 4,600 lb, the Ford is north of 7,200 lb.  I suspect almost as much of an issue is the wheelbase.  I have not looked at the specs but with the two side by side the tail of the Sequoia lines up just behind the center of the rear axel on the Ford.  There has to be over 24 inches difference in the length of the wheelbase.  I think that the wheelbase has a lot to do with it.  Weight is a factor but from what I read a F=250 out at the limits of its tow weight does well and at that point the trailer has a big weight advantage over the truck.

Edited December 26, 2021 by Surf4FamFun
Fix wording

[Slayer]

You've been given some good advice @DaBU.  I have a 2019 F-150 that I tow my 23LSV with.  While it handles the boat well, I've decided to get a 3/4 ton.  I didn't order a diesel because it doesn't fit my use case as well as a gas engine, but the towing benefit is worth it for me and I don't tow much.  When I do it's usually for a long weekend or a vacation with the boat away from our home lake.  Once you tow with a 3/4 ton, then tow with a 1/2 ton, you're not going to want to tow with the 1/2 ton any longer.  

[LakePTDoc]

I recently bought a 2021 Sierra Crew Cab with the 3.0L duramax.  I upgraded from the2015 GMC sierra Crew Cab 5.3 with a 6 speed.  I really like how the 3.0L feels, its torque and MPG.  I have not towed my 2016 VTX yet due to getting the truck in October.  The 3.0L does have an engine break and other trailering tech that is miles ahead of the 2015 I did have.  I remember by 2015 towed my boat much better than the 2008 I had before that.  I ended up with the 3.0L due to wanting better gas mileage and the lower powerband for when I do tow my boat.  Since I have owned the truck my fuel economy has stayed about 20mpg and has 23.2 average over about 5k miles.  We will take trips 30-45 minutes away up to 3 hours away, so anything that gets better than the 9-11 mpg I used to get with the 5.3 I consider it a win and money saved to put in as gas money for the boat.  

[shawndoggy]

4 hours ago, LakePTDoc said:

We will take trips 30-45 minutes away up to 3 hours away, so anything that gets better than the 9-11 mpg I used to get with the 5.3 I consider it a win and money saved to put in as gas money for the boat.  

Huh.  Here in Nevada I'm sure I wouldn't have enough savings on fuel cost to pay for the increase on insurance for the new vehicle, let alone the increased cost of registration.  When trying to figure out what's the most economical approach I've never been able to justify an upgrade.  It's always been less expensive for me to keep what I have.  That doesn't mean I don't upgrade, but it does mean that I don't try to trick myself into it with the "spend money to save money" trap.

 

7 hours ago, Slayer said:

You've been given some good advice @DaBU.  I have a 2019 F-150 that I tow my 23LSV with.  While it handles the boat well, I've decided to get a 3/4 ton.  I didn't order a diesel because it doesn't fit my use case as well as a gas engine, but the towing benefit is worth it for me and I don't tow much.  When I do it's usually for a long weekend or a vacation with the boat away from our home lake.  Once you tow with a 3/4 ton, then tow with a 1/2 ton, you're not going to want to tow with the 1/2 ton any longer.  

I really like this approach and am semi-tempted to do a 2500 gasser.  apropos to my response to @LakePTDoc doc tho, I'm getting hung up on whether any cost savings realized on the front end would be lost on the backend with a gasser vs diesel.  Maybe I just need to find a used gasser that's already taken the big depreciation hit... ?

[Slayer]

42 minutes ago, shawndoggy said:

I really like this approach and am semi-tempted to do a 2500 gasser.  apropos to my response to @LakePTDoc doc tho, I'm getting hung up on whether any cost savings realized on the front end would be lost on the backend with a gasser vs diesel.  Maybe I just need to find a used gasser that's already taken the big depreciation hit... ?

I think this is a market specific kind of thing.  Around here, I see lots of used gassers and oil burners and there is a delta in used vehicle cost.  The delta in my mind is not only the cost of entry, but you also need to factor in prevailing fuel costs where you are to determine the best case scenario.  

 

In my market, there's virtually no difference in gently used vs. new gas or diesel.  The used market is crazy because there's no new stock.  I could buy my current F-150 lease outright, sell it, and make money right now.  That would have already happened if I had found what I want used for a reasonable price.  Given the circumstances, I ordered a new one.  I think, barring any unforeseen economic collapse, it will work out to be a good decision. 

 

[Sparky450]

2 hours ago, shawndoggy said:

Huh.  Here in Nevada I'm sure I wouldn't have enough savings on fuel cost to pay for the increase on insurance for the new vehicle, let alone the increased cost of registration.  When trying to figure out what's the most economical approach I've never been able to justify an upgrade.  It's always been less expensive for me to keep what I have.  That doesn't mean I don't upgrade, but it does mean that I don't try to trick myself into it with the "spend money to save money" trap.

 

I really like this approach and am semi-tempted to do a 2500 gasser.  apropos to my response to @LakePTDoc doc tho, I'm getting hung up on whether any cost savings realized on the front end would be lost on the backend with a gasser vs diesel.  Maybe I just need to find a used gasser that's already taken the big depreciation hit... ?

I have 2019 Ram 3500 SRW utility bed with the big 6.4  Hemi and the 8 speed. If I did not tow on a regular basis. I would probably buy one. My sister pulls a 24’ gooseneck horse trailer. She has always pulled with a diesel. Well she wanted a new truck as a daily driver. After test driving my 2019 she bought the hemi. She loves it. And she will go into some steep roads.  sometimes when she is headed into her campgrounds with the trailer she is 4low. The point is if you don’t tow regularly the 6.4 Hemi would be great. And the mileage is as good as my diesel.

[shawndoggy]

4 minutes ago, Sparky450 said:

I have 2019 Ram 3500 SRW utility bed with the big 6.4  Hemi and the 8 speed. If I did not tow on a regular basis. I would probably buy one. My sister pulls a 24’ gooseneck horse trailer. She has always pulled with a diesel. Well she wanted a new truck as a daily driver. After test driving my 2019 she bought the hemi. She loves it. And she will go into some steep roads.  sometimes when she is headed into her campgrounds with the trailer she is 4low. The point is if you don’t tow regularly the 6.4 Hemi would be great. And the mileage is as good as my diesel.

And I’m towing more than @Slayer, but not really more than a boat. I’m definitely never pulling a 15k load or anything. 

[Sparky450]

3 minutes ago, shawndoggy said:

And I’m towing more than @Slayer, but not really more than a boat. I’m definitely never pulling a 15k load or anything. 

I bet that A24 is going to push 9-9500 if you add lead. My 25LSV was pushing 10k. And I left all the boards and such at the water. With those/there hills. 😂😂 I would pucker with a F150. As you know it is not the pulling that would bother me. It would be the downhill turns and stopping. Yes, I would probably do it if I had too. 😎 Too bad you don’t still have the Expedition😎

Edited December 28, 2021 by Sparky450

[shawndoggy]

15 minutes ago, Sparky450 said:

I bet that A24 is going to push 9-9500 if you add lead. My 25LSV was pushing 10k. And I left all the boards and such at the water. With those/there hills. 😂😂 I would pucker with a F150. As you know it is not the pulling that would bother me. It would be the downhill turns and stopping. Yes, I would probably do it if I had too. 😎 Too bad you don’t still have the Expedition😎

the f150 tows sooooo much better than the excursion did in all respects.  It's not missed.

[jjackkrash]

24 minutes ago, shawndoggy said:

 I’m definitely never pulling a 15k load or anything. 

If you get the truck you will find things you never knew you needed to tow.    After I got my first diesel it did not take long before I had a 14K dump trailer; and then a while later a 14K flat bed; and then equipment to haul on the flat bed that I never knew I needed or wanted.   Now I can't see living without them.  Hehe.   

 

[shawndoggy]

Just now, jjackkrash said:

If you get the truck you will find things you never knew you needed to tow.    After I got my first diesel it did not take long before I had a 14K dump trailer; and then a while later a 14K flat bed; and then equipment to haul on the flat bed that I never knew I needed or wanted.   Now I can't see living without them.  Hehe.   

 

haha I'd need a house to go with all that.  No room for a big trailer at the current estate.

[Greg_S]

I went from a 2018 F150 towing my 2005 21VLX to a 2021 F250 towing our 2017 25 LSV and couldn't be any happier. Filled with gear for our Powell trip from SoCal I wouldn't want to make that trek in the 150 

[hethj7]

This is one of the most sane threads on towing I have ever seen, with good advice about stopping loads vs just the power to get them moving.  The 3/4 ton chassis are just leap years better than the 1/2 ton versions at handling heavy weights.  The ride is a bit harsher but much improved over older 3/4 ton chassis.  And for those comparing an Escalade to a 3/4 ton truck, pricing is likely about the same, maybe even cheaper to go the truck route with a Diesel.  
 

 

[ThinBuLine]

2 hours ago, hethj7 said:

This is one of the most sane threads on towing I have ever seen, with good advice about stopping loads vs just the power to get them moving.  The 3/4 ton chassis are just leap years better than the 1/2 ton versions at handling heavy weights.  The ride is a bit harsher but much improved over older 3/4 ton chassis.  And for those comparing an Escalade to a 3/4 ton truck, pricing is likely about the same, maybe even cheaper to go the truck route with a Diesel.  
 

 

A fully loaded diesel 3/4 ton and I mean every box checked, is still cheaper than an Escalade. Wife wants a new ride…….

 

if cargo space is the issue, put a shell on the back of the 3/4 ton. 

they really need to bring back the 3/4 ton suburbans…… 

[Rack]

You Mean One of these?

K2500 Suburban  454 cu in Big Block

12 MPG towing

[DFW]

On 12/28/2021 at 12:13 PM, hethj7 said:

This is one of the most sane threads on towing I have ever seen, with good advice about stopping loads vs just the power to get them moving.  The 3/4 ton chassis are just leap years better than the 1/2 ton versions at handling heavy weights.  The ride is a bit harsher but much improved over older 3/4 ton chassis.  And for those comparing an Escalade to a 3/4 ton truck, pricing is likely about the same, maybe even cheaper to go the truck route with a Diesel.  
 

 

This ⬆️
Plus my real world experience towing with 1/2 tons.

15 Ram EcoDiesel pulling 7700lbs. The truck did it, but it never felt safe…

 

19 F-150 3.5L EcoBoost w/Max Tow. A better setup, but still overweight.

Current setup. 21 Ram 2500 Cummins. While much improved, I still think heavy duty diesels are at a disadvantage to 1/2 tons and SUVs as daily drivers (harsh ride, maneuverability, cost to own and maintain, etc.), but once you drop 9000lbs on the tail those trade offs quickly fade away.