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iliketoski

Dead Fuel Pump?

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iliketoski

I have an 01 Sunsetter VLX with the monsoon engine.  Two weeks ago after floating while trying to start back up I had the Vapor Lock symptom, but then it started after a brief delay, (less than 5 min).  (I have switched to ethanol free gas, so I was pissed thinking  they were charging more and not actually having it.  This weekend same symptom, starts, backfires can't get it to run, then quits.  It never started again, had to be towed in.  I'm thinking its the fuel pump, there is no initial "pressurizing" when the key is first turned, Acting like out of gas.

Is there anything I should check before replacing the pump?  It's the original pump (01), about 1100 hours.

Thx,

'ski

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jwl019

You can troubleshoot some more, but if you have to get a fuel pump, the one on your boat is no longer made and extremely hard to find. I do remember seeing where someone made a conversion kit or something like that to get something that will work for a replacement though for the years that used the Carter pumps. Do a little research and you will probably find what you will need to replace the current pump you have.

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NHolladay

Filters first.  Not mentioned here

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MadMan
10 hours ago, iliketoski said:

 I'm thinking its the fuel pump, there is no initial "pressurizing" when the key is first turned, Acting like out of gas.

Do you mean you don't hear the pump run for a couple seconds when you key on, or you've measure the pressure with a gauge?

Either way, I'll bet it's the pump.

Edited by MadMan

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iliketoski

I change both filters filters every year, so pretty confident that shouldn't be it, unless there was something significant in the gas, but been buying the good stuff for the last 2 years.

I don't hear the normal run for a couple seconds at key on.  I have not measured with gauge. 

I was thinking there may be something else that could fail that would not allow the pump to energize. (But even an oil pressure sensor or something would allow the key on pressurization?)

 

Hopefully Discount Inboard Marine will have a replacement, IO'll call Vince this morning and see

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MadMan
1 hour ago, iliketoski said:

I was thinking there may be something else that could fail that would not allow the pump to energize. (But even an oil pressure sensor or something would allow the key on pressurization?)

You could always just check with a hand held volt meter to see if it was powered at key on.

That era of pumps is semi-notorious for failure, mine failed.

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Sixball

In the older boats even up to my 07 and I think still being used the oil pressure sender to the ECU. If that unit is not working it will shut the fuel pump down. I have seen the unit hanging up and being intermittent fuel delivery. Its is down near the oil filter on our older boats. A single wire coming off of it.  We had one giving us fits for the better part of a year. Many of the same symptoms. In the long run we pulled it off washed it out and its been fine ever since.  That sensor is not the oil pressure sending unit for the gauges. 

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John I.

Kill switch? Are the dashboard gauges coming to life when key is turned to accessory?

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tvano

there are three relays near ecm. 

all are alike, swap them around and see if you get pump for a few seconds at ign on. 

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Bozboat
4 hours ago, Sixball said:

In the older boats even up to my 07 and I think still being used the oil pressure sender to the ECU. If that unit is not working it will shut the fuel pump down. I have seen the unit hanging up and being intermittent fuel delivery. Its is down near the oil filter on our older boats. A single wire coming off of it.  We had one giving us fits for the better part of a year. Many of the same symptoms. In the long run we pulled it off washed it out and its been fine ever since.  That sensor is not the oil pressure sending unit for the gauges. 

 

08ACECEC-7637-458C-AAD4-552FC2801AF9.jpeg

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iliketoski

Everything else works, gauges etc, it has even sputtered started for just a short period, (I figured some stray gas found its way in).

I don't think it can be an oil pressure sender, as there is no pressure at key on that pressures for 2 seconds, not getting that sound at all.

I hope its the pump, as I just ordered the "kit" to replace since the original is NLA.  $450 poorer 

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Sixball
34 minutes ago, iliketoski said:

Everything else works, gauges etc, it has even sputtered started for just a short period, (I figured some stray gas found its way in).

I don't think it can be an oil pressure sender, as there is no pressure at key on that pressures for 2 seconds, not getting that sound at all.

I hope its the pump, as I just ordered the "kit" to replace since the original is NLA.  $450 poorer 

So I do not know how the ECU is told how to look at this signal. Might have a trip if its been running and not reset it may show up as a fault.  I am not sure all I know is it gave us fits for the better part of a year on one of my bud's boats. It was so intermittent Its easy to pull what Bozboat is showing as the sender off and flush so it has full movement its worth a try. Our symptoms were very much the same in many ways.  A very cheep try!  

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Rednucleus

You can try putting 12v directly to your fuel pump to see if it works

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iliketoski
18 hours ago, tvano said:

there are three relays near ecm. 

all are alike, swap them around and see if you get pump for a few seconds at ign on. 

Can you give more details on the relays, where are they what do they look like?  I want to have this in my back pocket as a next step if the pump doesn't work.  I have a trip next week so I want to turn this around by the end of this weekend

 

13 hours ago, Rednucleus said:

You can try putting 12v directly to your fuel pump to see if it works

This would be a good test, thx

So here is my plan,

  • Test for voltage at the pump
  • If voltage likely pump,  new pump coming tomorrow
  • Put voltage to pump, see if starts
  • If no voltage check sender
  • If no voltage check relays (need to know where they are)
Edited by iliketoski

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MadMan
22 hours ago, iliketoski said:

I don't think it can be an oil pressure sender, as there is no pressure at key on that pressures for 2 seconds, not getting that sound at all.

This is true.

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iliketoski

Sorry, but where would the one for the pump located?  Don't want to get to the boat and not be able to find it.  Interchangable with one of the other 3?  Automotive part?

 

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boardjnky4
40 minutes ago, iliketoski said:

Sorry, but where would the one for the pump located?  Don't want to get to the boat and not be able to find it.  Interchangable with one of the other 3?  Automotive part?

 

It's one of the 3 near the ECM. They are all interchangeable. One is for the starter, one is the for the ECM and one is for the fuel pump. They all also have an accompanying fuse.

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iliketoski
16 hours ago, boardjnky4 said:

 They all also have an accompanying fuse.

(At the helm or in the engine compartment?)

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tvano

near ecm; shown in the pix i'd pm'd

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boardjnky4
53 minutes ago, iliketoski said:

(At the helm or in the engine compartment?)

Engine Compartment.

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iliketoski
6 hours ago, tvano said:

near ecm; shown in the pix i'd pm'd

Thanks, overlooked that at the top of the pic

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iliketoski

Does anyone know, are the relays Car parts or marinized?

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tvano

automotive

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iliketoski

Thanks for all the help and information.  Will be working on later today and tomorrow, will let you know!,

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