'17 21VLX Surf setup

[TSP4]

Has anyone dialed in a great surf set up for the 2017 21VLX? I have tried full ballast, multiple wedge settings....full rear and center with 50% bow, and wedge settings. We haven't been able to get the wave set to ride without the rope. Anyone have better experience?

[skicrave]

What size bags are you running in the rear lockers?

[TSP4]

45 minutes ago, skicrave said:

What size bags are you running in the rear lockers?

The stock ballast setup....is that the problem? What is the exact capacity of the stock ballast?

[teamerickson]

Do you have Plug N Play bags in the rear lockers? Those sit on top of the hard tanks and fill up most of the storage of the lockers when full. You need those.

[TSP4]

11 minutes ago, teamerickson said:

Do you have Plug N Play bags in the rear lockers? Those sit on top of the hard tanks and fill up most of the storage of the lockers when full. You need those.

Nope just running the factory hard tanks. Do you know the factory hard tank capacity throughout the 21vlx? The PNP bags are needed for surfing without rope? 

[teamerickson]

41 minutes ago, TSP4 said:

Nope just running the factory hard tanks. Do you know the factory hard tank capacity throughout the 21vlx? The PNP bags are needed for surfing without rope? 

I can't seem to find that info? I believe the hard tanks are 200? 

You need PNP bags for a better surf experience. Call Wakemakers.

If you go bigger then 550 bags you'll probably want more bow weight also.

[Rceider]

I also have a 21vlx.  Tell me more on rider sizes, crew size, board size and speed? 

I run 10.4 no wedge and full ballast for my daughter (70 pounds)

11.0 full ballast and wedge 3 up from lift (200 pounds)

 

[Rceider]

23 minutes ago, teamerickson said:

29 minutes ago, teamerickson said:

I can't seem to find that info? I believe the hard tanks are 200? 

You need PNP bags for a better surf experience. Call Wakemakers.

If you go bigger then 550 bags you'll probably want more bow weight also.

I also just added 475 sumos to each side. Sorry no pics yet! But it definitely helped in size! 

[95echelon]

2 hours ago, TSP4 said:

The stock ballast setup....is that the problem? What is the exact capacity of the stock ballast?

This is going to sound Mean but who did you buy that boat from? Where did you get the idea that you could surf without ballast?

Anyone working the sales floor who has ever surfed should have told you what you needed to go ropeless. I will save you time right now (this formula holds true for almost all malibus up to 2017 with the possible exception of the M235 and 25lsv)  and has been posted in searchable form here over 500 times:

1- your bow will have sacks in it, get over that prospect as a family right now if you want a wave with any length. You could do lead instead of you want your bow open  do at least 300 and preferably 400 pounds of lead up front. Nose weight = longer wave  

2 - you need at least 2000 and preferably 3000 more pounds of ballast total.  Easiest way is the biggest PnP bags you can find, a throw over pump and a 1000 pound triangle for the bow. 

Why your dealer didn't just add this to the deal is beyond me....

i have met a half a dozen people at the sandbar with new malibus in your situation. It's amazing that we are one of the only families on the lake going ropeless (us and a G23) and we have a 12 year old boat with no surfgate.  

My boat is a bit larger that yours (the VLX used to be 21.5") but the setup should be the same. I have an extra 1000 up front and an extra 960 in each rear locker. Surf side rear full up, and the non surf side at 50-75%. My wedge is manual so I run full wedge  

here is regular side with rears at 50% full. Your wave should be cleaner  and longer due to a better hull design. I can surf 15+ feet back at 200 pounds (with a fast and floaty board).

another pro tip: with a few exceptions most boat dealers carry crappy boards  but once cry once. For less than 2 grand you can get the ballast you need and a couple of high end boards...

 

 

[2017vlxpanda]

I have a 2017 21 VLX and with just the factory ballast and wedge I am able to surf without the rope. Factory preset for surfing is just right on our boat. I am 5'9" 190 lbs and I have no trouble staying rope less. Dealer installed 650lbs bags on each side but have yet to fill them as it has not been necessary. I will post pictures and video of my surf wave later once I have some time to edit them.  Hope you can find and dial in your surf wave. 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8quixutbjtt9fsg/IMG_1079.JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/89rdgnvmifinahr/IMG_1081.JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3absa2yfimkdzm1/IMG_1047.JPG?dl=0

[SCMike]

12 hours ago, 95echelon said:

This is going to sound Mean but who did you buy that boat from? Where did you get the idea that you could surf without ballast?

Anyone working the sales floor who has ever surfed should have told you what you needed to go ropeless. I will save you time right now (this formula holds true for almost all malibus up to 2017 with the possible exception of the M235 and 25lsv)  and has been posted in searchable form here over 5

 

 

I'm sorry, but this is just not true.  I have a 2017 21vlx and surf it ropeless with only stock ballast and wedge.  This is wirh 3 people in the boat, my wife, and 2 daughters (9&10).  A large wake can help make up for the lack of experience, so I'm convinced people think you need PNP, bow sacks, etc just to be able to surf ropeless.  It's just not the case.  I'm not saying adding weight won't make the wave bigger or better, but it certainly is not nessassary to surf ropeless.  

 

[Cole2001]

Surfing ropeless is so much easier with pnp and maxed out everything, but that doesn't mean things aren't possible. I can go ropeless behind a sportster with 1200lbs of ballast, but it definitely wasn't as easy as a big boat.

[SCMike]

8 hours ago, Cole2001 said:

Surfing ropeless is so much easier with pnp and maxed out everything, but that doesn't mean things aren't possible. I can go ropeless behind a sportster with 1200lbs of ballast, but it definitely wasn't as easy as a big boat.

100% agree.  I learned how to wakesurf behind a DD Tige with just 1 500lb sack (no other ballast). I was able to go ropeless just fine on that.  My VLX is way bigger than the Tige with only stock ballast and wedge.  I'm not saying adding additional ballast won't help you, or make the experience better, but is certainly is not required to go ropeless.  Anyone that says that likely just doesn't have the skill to do it.  

[MadMan]

A smaller person requires less wake to go rope less also.  A 90lb girl can surf wakes that I can't.

[95echelon]

9 hours ago, SCMike said:

I'm sorry, but this is just not true.  I have a 2017 21vlx and surf it ropeless with only stock ballast and wedge.  This is wirh 3 people in the boat, my wife, and 2 daughters (9&10).  A large wake can help make up for the lack of experience, so I'm convinced people think you need PNP, bow sacks, etc just to be able to surf ropeless.  It's just not the case.  I'm not saying adding weight won't make the wave bigger or better, but it certainly is not nessassary to surf ropeless.  

 

I don't know if I agree. The average American man weighs 195.5 pounds... That is getting into the needing weight category if you are new to watersports. If you have surfed before then sure, but if you are a new Inboard owner it's going to be a much steeper learning curve. Add to this that most dealers carry horrifically bad surf boards (slow, not floaty, etc) and you could have significant trouble on stock ballast. The poster indicated they were having trouble, so if they are going to start adding weight they should do it right and the formula is literally the same for every Malibu boat. Asking how to fill the ballasts is a silly question, you fill them all full... If 1250 pounds is all you have I can't imagine a scenario where you wouldn't fill em all. As for the wedge there are only so many settings to try...

SCMike what kind of board and experience level do you have? What do you weigh? 

So a non jerky way to say this is: @TSP4 fill the ballasts all full, place your passengers on the surf side, start with wedge full down or a couple of clicks up (couple clicks up is most popular but use what works for you). If you are having trouble holding the wave with this setup then you need to address one of four things:

1. Ballast
2. Your weight (dropping 20 pounds over the winter improved my surfing all around)
3. Your board (is it big enough, surf/skim/hybrid etc).
4. Your technique (most likely issue)
   1. Stance
   2. Gas and Brake
   3. Carving
   4. Pumping
   5. Recovery
   6. Distance from boat
   7. Boat Speed

If you can't hold on to the wave close to the swim platform at 10.3 and you weight 200 pounds or less on a properly sized board then it's most definitely a technique question you should be asking.

[95echelon]

11 hours ago, 2017vlxpanda said:

I have a 2017 21 VLX and with just the factory ballast and wedge I am able to surf without the rope. Factory preset for surfing is just right on our boat. I am 5'9" 190 lbs and I have no trouble staying rope less. Dealer installed 650lbs bags on each side but have yet to fill them as it has not been necessary. I will post pictures and video of my surf wave later once I have some time to edit them.  Hope you can find and dial in your surf wave. 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8quixutbjtt9fsg/IMG_1079.JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/89rdgnvmifinahr/IMG_1081.JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3absa2yfimkdzm1/IMG_1047.JPG?dl=0

You can make those links show by changing the www to a dl and then taking everything after jpg off, then load into a new browser window. You will notice the link will now be from dropboxusercontent and you can simply copy and paste here:

Posts with beer in them are only accepted if you share what kind of beer it is.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/8quixutbjtt9fsg/IMG_1079.JPG

 

[SCMike]

2 minutes ago, 95echelon said:

I don't know if I agree. The average American man weighs 195.5 pounds... That is getting into the needing weight category if you are new to watersports. If you have surfed before then sure, but if you are a new Inboard owner it's going to be a much steeper learning curve. Add to this that most dealers carry horrifically bad surf boards (slow, not floaty, etc) and you could have significant trouble on stock ballast. The poster indicated they were having trouble, so if they are going to start adding weight they should do it right and the formula is literally the same for every Malibu boat. Asking how to fill the ballasts is a silly question, you fill them all full... If 1250 pounds is all you have I can't imagine a scenario where you wouldn't fill em all. As for the wedge there are only so many settings to try...

SCMike what kind of board and experience level do you have? What do you weigh? 

So a non jerky way to say this is: @TSP4 fill the ballasts all full, place your passengers on the surf side, start with wedge full down or a couple of clicks up (couple clicks up is most popular but use what works for you). If you are having trouble holding the wave with this setup then you need to address one of four things:

1. Ballast
2. Your weight (dropping 20 pounds over the winter improved my surfing all around)
3. Your board (is it big enough, surf/skim/hybrid etc).
4. Your technique (most likely issue)
   1. Stance
   2. Gas and Brake
   3. Carving
   4. Pumping
   5. Recovery
   6. Distance from boat
   7. Boat Speed

If you can't hold on to the wave close to the swim platform at 10.3 and you weight 200 pounds or less on a properly sized board then it's most definitely a technique question you should be asking.

 

Im 5'11 and 190lbs, and i would consider myself an beginner/amateur surfer.  I ride a 5.0 liquid force Rocket (http://www.liquidforce.com/wakesurfers-rocket.html) which is purchased as a boat board, and is the only board I have.  I will say, i'm not a big wakesurfer.  In fact, my lake does not allow wakesurfing, so i'm only able to surf on occasion when I pull my boat to a different lake.  I've only done that 3 times this year, and the main reason i have not purchased a nice high end board.  

A bit of background: Im really much more of a wakeboarder.  In 2005 i started surfing because i broke my Tib-Fib on a backroll while wakeboarding.  This was in the beginning of the season, and Wakesurfing was the only thing i could do.  This is when i learned on my parents old 2001 tige 21i DD.  As soon as i was able to start wakeboarding again, i dropped the surfboard, only doing it on occasion until about 2010.  In 2010 i moved to SoCal and lost access to a boat, until this year when i purchased my 21VLX.  in 7 years i had not been on a wakeboard, or wakesurf and am just now getting back into it.  I did pick up Ocean surfing (longboarding) here in San Clemente, but that is very different then wakesurfing.  Although Im a beginner/amateur wake surfer, I will say, i'm VERY comfortable on any type of board (Wake, Skate, Surf, Snow).  

 

[Beef996R]

I have a '17 22 VLX and found it difficult (but not impossible, or terribly fun) to surf rope-less on the right side.  Wave was tall and not long, so a small sweet spot.  Of note, the left side wake is significantly better.  I called Wakemakers and got 2 x 750lb custom plug n play bags for the lockers on both sides in back, and a 675 lb Sumo triangle for the bow.  Gamechanger!!!  The surf wake with stock "surf right" and "surf left" setting plus these bags is taller, longer, and WAY more fun.  Worth the investment!

[SonicVLX]

Just bought our '17 21' VLX... it has plug and play bags, but I don't need them to surf.  We had 10 people in the boat yesterday and I had to dial out some wedge to get more length out of the wake.  I've bumped up to 10.8 (gps).  One of the things I think is key is the board.  With the boat we got a new board (hyperlite brodcast 4-8), which has made a world of difference!  It's a little small for me, 6' 190 lbs, but I still get drive out of it, we bought it for my son... I was told it was a pretty good all around beginner board, and I have been very happy with it.  

 

Here re are some pics of us riding last weekend with only 4 of us on the boat.

My son on the left side...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/118138284@N07/shares/U802Cn

 

me on the right side...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/118138284@N07/shares/0c4A0C

 

(pardon the pic issue... just realized my photo bucket pics aren't working and I don't want to pay their extortion!!!)

Edited July 16, 2017 by SonicVLX

[2017vlxpanda]

Created a video of the first 20 hours on our boat surfing, wakeboarding and having fun. Setup for every session is full stock ballast and 3-6 people on board. Enjoy 

 

[06vride]

Hey VLXpanda, where were those videos shot? Looks like awesome lake. We go out near Modesto a lot. 

[2017vlxpanda]

@06vride the two lakes shown in the video were Don Pedro Lake and lake Camanche. Both absolutely love both lakes. 

[Koeh0083]

This is stock ballast with 3/4 full PNP at 10.6 with wedge 3 clicks from lift. Great height and push, would not mind a little more length, so that will be next summers playing with. Also surf pipe or FAE will be added over winter here. 

 

Edited October 26, 2017 by Koeh0083

[EricZ28]

On 10/26/2017 at 5:46 PM, Koeh0083 said:

This is stock ballast with 3/4 full PNP at 10.6 with wedge 3 clicks from lift. Great height and push, would not mind a little more length, so that will be next summers playing with. Also surf pipe or FAE will be added over winter here. 

I added a bow sac late in the summer. It made a big difference with lengthening the wave. I think it's an 1100 but I only filled it 1/2-3/4 typically. Also important to me, it allowed me to drive from my driver's seat. We had bad bow rise with full PnP(550lb). 

[SCMike]

11 hours ago, EricZ28 said:

I added a bow sac late in the summer. It made a big difference with lengthening the wave. I think it's an 1100 but I only filled it 1/2-3/4 typically. Also important to me, it allowed me to drive from my driver's seat. We had bad bow rise with full PnP(550lb). 

+ 1 on this.  I added a 600# bow bag after 550# PNP in the rear.  If you run PNP, you need the weight up front.