Directions for adding Fly High Pro X sacs to exising pumps?

[tparider]

After speaking with someone VERY knowledgable at Wakeside today, I have everything 100% figured out, even the issue with the center tank on the floor. The way I'm doing it, I can even have a long enough hose to fill a front FlyHigh sac to put in the bow that will run off the mid-ship ballast pumps.

I'll give you the whole run down later tonight when I have some time. It's pretty interesting...

[thestockbroker]

Maybe I'm doing something wrong here! Enlighten me!!!! I have a '04 23 LSV Wakesetter. I run stock ballast(1250), Fly high triangle(1000) in the middle, (400) in the bow, and a (350) in each locker in the back, with a 14.25 x 14 OJ Prop and NO wedge and the boat will hardly get out of the hole. Granted I do have the 340 Monsoon but damn, more weight than that and with the wedge.............on a stock prop????

Just let me know what I'm doin wrong or what is wrong with my boat!

[tparider]

Maybe I'm doing something wrong here! Enlighten me!!!! I have a '04 23 LSV Wakesetter. I run stock ballast(1250), Fly high triangle(1000) in the middle, (400) in the bow, and a (350) in each locker in the back, with a 14.25 x 14 OJ Prop and NO wedge and the boat will hardly get out of the hole. Granted I do have the 340 Monsoon but damn, more weight than that and with the wedge.............on a stock prop????

Just let me know what I'm doin wrong or what is wrong with my boat!

That's about what I'm running and I don't have too much of a problem on the hole shot with the stock prop. Have you added more weight to the front to see if that helps? Have a couple of people sit up there during WOT from a dead stop a couple times and see if that does anything... (fyi - I have the 340 too...)

[tparider]

Okay, so here's what I'm doing:

For adding the sac to the existing rear hard tanks:

Fill:

- Disconnect overflow (from thru-hull) that goes to stock hard tank and trim hose

- Connect trimmed overflow hose to W740 ---> W736 and into the sac. This goes into the bottom opening of the sac.

Overflow:

- Use W736 ---> W742 to new hose coming out of the top of the sac and have it exit the existing factory overflow thru-hull.

Empty:

Hit the empty switch. No connections. When I hit the empty, the sac will gradually drain into the factory hard tank by way of gravity, and as the sac empties into the stock tank, it continues to empty itself.

Done. No Tee's, no valves, nothing crazy. The guy from Wakeside has used (on a 2005 VLX) and recommended this exact set-up for many Malibu owners doing the exact same procedure. Hopefully there won't be any siphoning back through the fill pump - we'll see. If it happens, at least it's an easy fix.

Now, for the elusive center sac on the floor with quick connect hoses:

Fill:

Fill pump ---> barbed 3/4 tee ---> 1 side to stock tank

other side ---> to small length of hose ---> 3/4 barbed-threaded coupler ---> 3/4 ball valve ---> W736

Then, I'll have a longer hose that I'll keep in storage that will connect to the W736 (attached to the 3/4 ball valve) via a W740 - once connected, it will go like this:

W736 ---> W740 ---> 6-8ft of hose ---> W740 ---> W736 --->W730 ---> sac

Empty

Same exact static set up to the empty pump in the center floor bilge area

Fill pump ---> barbed 3/4 tee ---> 1 side to stock tank

other side ---> to small length of hose ---> 3/4 barbed-threaded coupler ---> 3/4 ball valve ---> W736

Then I'll just use the same hose with the quick connects on it and attach it to the same W736 for the empty.

Hope this works - wish me luck.

I'll take some pics for the archives....

Edited July 28, 2006 by tparider

[thestockbroker]

That's about what I'm running and I don't have too much of a problem on the hole shot with the stock prop. Have you added more weight to the front to see if that helps? Have a couple of people sit up there during WOT from a dead stop a couple times and see if that does anything... (fyi - I have the 340 too...)

I'll try that but with the 400 in the front and stock front full, my boat sits so low in the front and the back tends to sit up, maybe I'll try that set up with the wedge down??? I don't know. Right now my boat is at the shop , FOR 3 WEEKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! . I hit something, bent the prop, strut and spider cracked some of the hull.

[chathamsolutions]

TPA - excited to see how it all turns out. I'm very interested. I'm looking to do this myself sometime this season.

stockbroker: I've got an '04 LSV w/ the 340 Monsoon. I've never had problems getting out of the whole, no matter how many people or how much weight I'm running. Full ballast and Wedge + lots of adults.

The worst issue for me is when I'm surfing, with full ballast, 800Lbs extra on one side and 5+ adults - my nose wants to dive. I have a really hard time keeping the nose out of the water. Hole shot isn't an issue.

I'm running the 537. I've got a 857 as a spare, just haven't tried to put in on and try it. I'm headed to Trinity in a couple weeks. Maybe I'll do it half way through the week to see how it goes.

[WakeGirl]

Andy,

What technique do you use to turn around?

stockbroker,

I don't think that anyone's properly welcomed you, so welcome to the site. Is it possible that the prop isn't correct for your setup?

[chathamsolutions]

Andy,

What technique do you use to turn around?

...

Wakeboarding -

Slow and let wake pass by. Do a turn to the right and pass the downed rider with them on my right.

Surfing -

Depends on the weight. But slow to neutral and let wake pass. Depending on side that's weighted, let weight determine whether I make a right or left turn. Get rope to rider and usually start in an arcing circle to get the rider up.

[WakeGirl]

For surfing, do you arc with the weight on the inside or outside of the turn? Riverrunner had me drive for him in Texas & I got to see what a weighted down 23' handles like....not well, especially with a Texas-sized person in a sling off of the tower.

[smedman]

we generally turn towards the side of the boat with the weight and definitely bring the throttle back to neutral as soon as the surfer falls and let the waves pass. turn slowly as well.

i've seen too many people who crank it to turn quickly and at speed when the rider falls and two things happen:

1. they usually swamp the front of the boat

2. they send huge rollers up and down the lake chopping up the water even more

have fun!

[tparider]

we generally turn towards the side of the boat with the weight and definitely bring the throttle back to neutral as soon as the surfer falls and let the waves pass. turn slowly as well.

Why would you want to turn towards the side with the weight?

If you are weighting the port side (for surfing a forehand wave for a regular footed rider), you want to make turns to the right so that you are turning with the high, unweighted side of the boat on the inside of the turn. If you turn left in that situation, and while turning there are any rollers, another boat going by, or whatever the case may be, you are toast.

[eubanks]

Okay, so here's what I'm doing:

For adding the sac to the existing rear hard tanks:

Fill:

- Disconnect overflow (from thru-hull) that goes to stock hard tank and trim hose

- Connect trimmed overflow hose to W740 ---> W736 and into the sac. This goes into the bottom opening of the sac.

Overflow:

- Use W736 ---> W742 to new hose coming out of the top of the sac and have it exit the existing factory overflow thru-hull.

Empty:

Hit the empty switch. No connections. When I hit the empty, the sac will gradually drain into the factory hard tank by way of gravity, and as the sac empties into the stock tank, it continues to empty itself.

Done. No Tee's, no valves, nothing crazy. The guy from Wakeside has used (on a 2005 VLX) and recommended this exact set-up for many Malibu owners doing the exact same procedure. Hopefully there won't be any siphoning back through the fill pump - we'll see. If it happens, at least it's an easy fix.

Hope this works - wish me luck.

I'll take some pics for the archives....

This sounds too easy! Let us know how it goes as I might have to copy your ideas. Thanks for the write up. So what do you do if you do not want the rear sacs filled?

[WakeGirl]

I think that's the catch, it overflows through the sacks, so you have to watch the bags & your tank gauges if you don't want your sacks full, is that right TP?

[tparider]

I think that's the catch, it overflows through the sacks, so you have to watch the bags & your tank gauges if you don't want your sacks full, is that right TP?

that's right. I don't think there will be a time when I don't want the tanks and the bags to be full, but if that situation arises more than once, I'll have to re-examine the set up, or like you said, just watch the tank levels and shut the pumps off when they're full.

I think I'm doing the rear sacs tonight (if I get my FlyHigh parts in the mail today), so I'll snap some pics if I end up doing it.

[WakeGirl]

There you go then, it's probably an ideal setup for you. We don't use the sacks for wakeboarding, just surfing so for us that would be kind of a PITA.

[chathamsolutions]

Ya, we only use the sacs for surfing too. Hmmm...

we generally turn towards the side of the boat with the weight and definitely bring the throttle back to neutral as soon as the surfer falls and let the waves pass. turn slowly as well.

Why would you want to turn towards the side with the weight?

If you are weighting the port side (for surfing a forehand wave for a regular footed rider), you want to make turns to the right so that you are turning with the high, unweighted side of the boat on the inside of the turn. If you turn left in that situation, and while turning there are any rollers, another boat going by, or whatever the case may be, you are toast.

This is exactly what we do. Slow to let the rollers go by, and then turn AWAY from the weight after the rollers have passed.

It really does drive like a sick cow. But the wake is tasty.

[Ronnie]

TPA - excited to see how it all turns out. I'm very interested. I'm looking to do this myself sometime this season.

stockbroker: I've got an '04 LSV w/ the 340 Monsoon. I've never had problems getting out of the whole, no matter how many people or how much weight I'm running. Full ballast and Wedge + lots of adults.

The worst issue for me is when I'm surfing, with full ballast, 800Lbs extra on one side and 5+ adults - my nose wants to dive. I have a really hard time keeping the nose out of the water. Hole shot isn't an issue.

I'm running the 537. I've got a 857 as a spare, just haven't tried to put in on and try it. I'm headed to Trinity in a couple weeks. Maybe I'll do it half way through the week to see how it goes.

Andy, unfortunatly I don't think this will work on our above the floor tanks. With the below the floor tanks the sac will drain into the hard tank. With our sacs and tanks being at the same horizontal level above the floor the sac will not drain into to the tank with this hookup.

I think in our situation we need to remove the hard tanks and replace them with the 750 lb sacs with quick connects on all sac connections to be able to remove them easily.

[WakeGirl]

This is exactly what we do. Slow to let the rollers go by, and then turn AWAY from the weight after the rollers have passed.

It really does drive like a sick cow. But the wake is tasty.

Now that's funny right there, I don't care who ya' are!

I've gotten to where I turn with the weight to the outside of the turn. It feels weird, but the boat turns around a lot faster that way because that's the way that it naturally wants to go. You're not fighting it. Also, when the nose comes around, the high side is to the wake so you have a better shot of not taking water over the bow. RiverRunner taught me this one in Texas & his 23' turned so much better using this technique. He also showed me how to use reverse at the right moment to get it to spin even faster. It takes a boat that is a serious barnyard animal in how it handles to one that is fairly manageable. Of course if you're on a busy lake, prudent use of this method is recommended because of the weight being to the outside, makes you more vulnerable to taking a roller over the side. JM2C

[chathamsolutions]

True dat.

The ease of the turn is why we turn away from the weight. You're fighting the weight and the wake if your turn toward the weight.

Ya Ronnie, you're right. I really don't want to get rid of my hard tanks. I'd like to keep them there AND add the 750lbs. AND keep the pumps in the same location.

Obviously this is going to be a challenge. I'll have to keep thinking about it.

[tparider]

Well, my connections didn't come in today so I didn't get anything done on the boat. FedEx tracking says I should get them tomorrow or Wednesday, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I'm also installing a second Kicker S12L7 sub (in the driver's footwell) and an amp to power it, and moving forward with the Titan 360* tower light as well. Full documentation on the way for each project. I'd like to have all this done by the weekend so we'll see.

[Steck]

Any progress? I am very interested to see if this concept will work out and how fast it works.

[tparider]

Unfortunately, Buywake sent me a bunch of W737 instead of W736 fittings, so I couldn't get anything done with the ballast. I am getting the correct parts today so I should be getting started on the ballast in the next day or two.

I did get the new amp installed and all the wiring done for it and the isolator and 2nd battery, so I'm in the process of designing the box to fit in the driver's footwell for the new sub and I'll have that project wrapped up this week as well.

[eubanks]

Any updates?

[tparider]

Any updates?

The system works perfectly. It took all of 30 minutes to set up the rear sacs. I still have to do the quick connects and the ball valves for what my idea for the sac on the floor is, but the rear is done.

All I did was:

- take the factory overflow hose out of the thru-hull, put a quick connect on it, and attach it the the bottom opening on the sac. This is the new fill for the sac.

- run some 3/4 hose from the top opening (the one right above where I attached the fill hose) out of the boat into the thru-hull. This is the overflow for the sac.

- cap off the 3rd opening of the sac.

So what happens is the stock tanks fill, then they start overflowing into the sacs. Then, when the sacs are full, they overflow out the boat. Then when I hit the empty, the stock tanks start to empty, and then the sacs empty (by gravity) into the stock tanks (keeping them full) until the sacs are empty, then the stock tanks empty, then you're done.

Sweet!

Edited August 13, 2006 by tparider

[eubanks]

Very cool! This seemed too easy to be true but I'm glad to hear how well it worked. Do you have to babysit the sac at all to make sure all the water drains back into the tank? Do you have the side of the sac with the two holes facing forward towards the front of the boat? How long would you say your fill and empty times are now?

Thanks!