Possible Project Boat

[lundbladc]

I have been thinking about starting this project for a while now but I am not sure where to begin or even if it is a good idea to undertake such an endeavor. I have the opportunity to purchase a boat that, let’s just say, has seen much better days. It’s a 1999 Malibu Response LX, and it certainly has a lot of history with it. It used to belong to a friend of my fathers on the lake that I grew up on, it was on this lake that I learned how to do most water sports including barefooting and it was behind this very boat. He was a nice guy to be around and was a good mentor to me when I was young. Unfortunately he fell on hard times and the care and up keep of this boat definitely went on the way side. It was during this time period that he did not treat his stuff very well. What I am about to describe to you will definitely make any respectable boat owner cringe.

This boat has been though a hellish life, it started out being well cared for, and I even at times remember helping him detail the boat, but that is long since passed. This boat has been sunk at least two times such that only the windshield was showing (conveniently this size boat is designed to float). However there was once time where the boat was sunk so bad that there was no easy way to pump the water out without getting it somewhat out of the water. And it was during this tow behind my father’s ski Nautique that the boat keeled over and took a nose dive to the bottom. Acting quickly since he did not want this boat to pull down his or damage the Nautique he quickly tied a buoy to the end of the tow rope and just let it go. The next day we towed a floating dock that had a lifting davit on it up to the buoy to pull the boat off of the bottom. At this point the boat clearly did not want to float due to how waterlogged and saturated the boat become. We finally get it to the launching ramp and put it on its trailer, pump out the water and return it to him by just shoving it in his driveway. We heard later on that they did indeed get the engine running shortly after.

So my question to you all, is it even worth the attempt to try and repair it?

Imgur Gallery:

https://imgur.com/a/4wq1Q#0

Here is what I know:

• It has been sunk at least 3 times, with one time it was under for about 3-4 days.
• The hull has some issues and does leek due to the drain plug being left in one winter, the two hulls have separated a bit and as such the boat continually leeks from the area near the drain plug. But too fast but fast enough that it is a problem
• the gauges and electronics are probably all bad.
• The starter is probably also ruined.
• The upholstery needs work, it is not super bad but needs to be done.
• The floor needs to be replaced as it is squishy and I would want to rip out the old blow foam and add in new non waterlogged foam.
• It is missing at least one seat cushion.
• It is missing the engine cover

What I plain to do:

• Start by making sure the engine works, I have a good mechanic friend who will assist with this. Then I will repair the hull… somehow.
• Then repair the floor/foam
• repair gauges and electronics
• then the aesthetics.

I am new to what the costs of this are but I plain to do most of the work myself as a good project for the fall / winter, I will probably pay someone to-do the engine work if I must and the upholstery. But the rest I would like to do myself with my mechanic friend’s guidance.

I am heading to see the boat this Saturday and will take photos and report back.

So do you think I am crazy?

Is this worthwhile if I can get it for the right price?

Really any guidance you can offer would be greatly appreciated!

**edit** Spelling

Edited April 16, 2015 by lundbladc

[Steve B.]

That was an excellent first post ! It's great to see your optimism and energy. Sounds like me debating project boats oh so many years ago.

But this boat. No. Rare that I'd say a boat is too far gone, but this one is. However, I guarantee there is some perfect project boat for you somewhere nearby. Getting this one up and running would be monumental. Find one that the goal is more easily reached.

Let us know your general area, maybe we can help find a cool project ?

Steve B.

[lundbladc]

Thanks!

If you don't mind me asking, what would this model boat be worth if it was in good condition? I never really see any of them for sale :-/

Let us know your general area, maybe we can help find a cool project ?

I am located in Fairfield County Connecticut.

I am still meeting with the owner this weekend, perhaps it is not as bad as I remember. :P

[oldjeep]

Quick search says that you could buy a few of them for around 12-14k

Edited April 16, 2015 by oldjeep

[braindamage]

I agree with Steve B. The boat in good shape is prob $15k(ish). The hull is the worrisome part. Electrics will be shot and probably will never be fully without issue. New upholstery and engine will be close to $8-9k

Move along. Even if you get it for free it won't be worth it. It sounds like an emotional attachment but let cooler heads prevail and you will be better off.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jonredcorn]

I am voting no as well. If I were to get it for free and had a mechanic who could help me fix the engine, I would guess it would still cost me $7-8k out of pocket to replace everything.... as well as every weekend for the next 2 years.

[Sunscape fan]

I would agree with all above. The boat's structure has been compromised too much...just not worth it.

[Bturner]

The only way to make that boat work is if you had a donor boat or were using this as a donor boat for parts. This one is toast.

[Ndawg12]

Is this worthwhile if I can get it for the right price?

There was a slight glimmer of hope until you asked this question. I was expecting it to be gifted to you. Most people won't consider a boat thats been even partially sunk once let alone fully sunk 3 times. You would have way more than it's value invested in it in order to make it reliable, safe and seaworthy.

[bradfr]

I think it depends on how much you care about little things not working or not looking accurate. If it were me and I was into the sport more than having a top notch boat I would leave the upholstery alone and focus on getting the mechanics working. However, if you don't feel like your mechanically inclined enough to do your own motor work the potential to sink too much money into it is too high.

[Falko]

Not worth it. Could it be a great boat all said and done? yes. But it would be cheaper to buy one that is ready to go AND you get probably 2 years of extra fun out of it.

[Michigan boarder]

I say go for it. But it's gotta be a free boat. Here's what I would do:

1. pull the engine & tranny

2. remove carpeting and entire interior

3. repair hull issues and floor issues. Sounds like just the part near the drain plug? This is a critical point. If you can repair any hull issues, then move forward. If not, time to bail - give it back to him or sell the parts (trailer, drive train, etc.) and split the cash. Hopefully you can make repairs. Remember - there is absolutely NO wood in this boat.

4. Replace guages and any bad wiring

5. Rebuild engine

6. Finish interior

7. Repair any issues with trailer

Simple stuff.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Michigan boarder

[2014Skier]

I'd say it all depends on what you are looking for. If you want a project cause you love building things, if you don't mind spending more than it may be worth once finished, if it's got sentimental value to you, if you've got the time, etc etc then who's to tell you, you shouldn't do it. Go for it. I think the biggest thing is to be aware of what your getting yourself into. There is some salvage value to the boat, hell I know somebody that would be interested in some parts from it

[Michigan boarder]

Check out 2014's project, man that's a heck of a thread. That boat is going to be a true one-of-a-kind in so many ways.

The biggest thing is make sure that hull can be repaired. If you can fix that, then the rest is simple. Do it in a way that at any point if you say "OK, enough of this. I'm in over my head" you can sell what you've done and recover what you've spent. Save the engine rebuild for last, cuz that's where most of your money will be (which might put you above the value) and you can make choices about how far you go with it then based on your budget (stock/upgrades).

I love my Echelon and put over $6k into an engine with a rebuild and lots of upgrades, in a boat that is worth about $13k. And I still have a dash upgrade to do.

[Asmodeus2112]

No way this will be financially worth it. But if it's special too you, or some other circumstances then maybe. Responses are a dime a dozen, and just not that special IMO. When done it will just be another "meh" ski boat. If I were going to devote the kind of time and effort this would require I'd want the outcome to be pretty special, like a skier with a LSx , an early Correct Craft, Century or something. YMMV.

http://macon.craigslist.org/boa/4979104724.html

http://denver.craigslist.org/boa/4975212824.html

Edited April 16, 2015 by Asmodeus2112

[jk13]

I dig it as a resto mod, but sourcing all factory parts will take a lot longer and eat up a lot more budget. GPS speedometer, new gauge pack, check all wiring over, scope the cylinders rather than a complete tear down and if it checks out, run it, etc. Take your engine buddy with you when you check it out. Another set of eyes is never a bad thing.

Engine box and seat bottom will hopefully be found used, other than that the hull is the biggest question.

But even at that it better be near free to begin with. Although from the seller's standpoint a running boat should bring some money. Don't kill the friendship over price. If it doesn't work out, walk away and be up front why, respectfully.

Good news is you have two more days to look at parts and options before seeing the boat. Write it all down and see where you're at.

[Michigan boarder]

I dig it as a resto mod, but sourcing all factory parts will take a lot longer and eat up a lot more budget. GPS speedometer, new gauge pack, check all wiring over, scope the cylinders rather than a complete tear down and if it checks out, run it, etc. Take your engine buddy with you when you check it out. Another set of eyes is never a bad thing.

Engine box and seat bottom will hopefully be found used, other than that the hull is the biggest question.

But even at that it better be near free to begin with. Although from the seller's standpoint a running boat should bring some money. Don't kill the friendship over price. If it doesn't work out, walk away and be up front why, respectfully.

Good news is you have two more days to look at parts and options before seeing the boat. Write it all down and see where you're at.

Spot on brotha'

[shawndoggy]

I think the problem is that by the time you spend all the $$$ to fix everything, your finished product will won't be worth the investment, and that's giving no value to the boat now and no value to your labor.

Here's an example of someone who thinks his similar boat is worth WAY more than it is, just because he spent a bunch of money on it: http://reno.craigslist.org/boa/4975814333.html

[shawndoggy]

Now that said if you can get it for free and get it rough-but-seaworthy on the cheap, it could be worth doing. Like if you can find used and cheap powertrain parts and gauges, etc. Just leave the interior rough.

[Michigan boarder]

I think the problem is that by the time you spend all the $$$ to fix everything, your finished product will won't be worth the investment, and that's giving no value to the boat now and no value to your labor.

Here's an example of someone who thinks his similar boat is worth WAY more than it is, just because he spent a bunch of money on it: http://reno.craigslist.org/boa/4975814333.html

HOLY cow! He's gonna sit on that one for a while. How can a boat sit in the sun for 1 year, have 143 hours, yet need a new interior, rebuilt tranny, guages, wet sand, blah blah blah??? That's redonkulous.

[oldjeep]

I think the problem is that by the time you spend all the $$$ to fix everything, your finished product will won't be worth the investment, and that's giving no value to the boat now and no value to your labor.

Here's an example of someone who thinks his similar boat is worth WAY more than it is, just because he spent a bunch of money on it: http://reno.craigslist.org/boa/4975814333.html

Similar project here, but they are building it for resale. Not sure that $17K is actually out of line though with a newly rebuilt efi engine and all new upholstery. Been keeping an eye out for the new pictures when they actually finish it. Their descriptions of what things would cost at the dealer are pretty funny though.

http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/boa/4930403770.html

Edited April 16, 2015 by oldjeep

[lundbladc]

Wow, thank you all for the quick responses I really appreciate it. I wanted to touch on a lot of this things that I keep thinking about and that you all touched on. In fact it was actually hard to concentrate on work today with all the responses coming into my inbox. I love it.

With purchasing a used boat that is in a functional condition for between 12K and 14K I will end up with something that is running this season and something I can use right away. But that is not what is so appealing to me. First of all I do not have that much money at the moment to just go purchase a decent condition one outright, I am not someone who likes to take out a loan for a luxury item after all, who really /needs/ a boat? And I would end up with a boat that will probably need heavy maintenance after a year or two due to the boats age. Also that satisfaction of having built it or fixed it is a huge driver for me.

The main factors that are driving my decision to look into this one is that:

• All said and done it will /probably/ still cost less than the 12K
• I will learn a monumental amount of things throughout this process.
• I will have, for the most part, new equipment in the boat, be that a recently rebuilt engine, new upholstery, new carpet, new gauges etc that are unlikely to break or fail as quickly verses something that I purchased for 12K leading to an additional expenses once I am done with the overhaul.
• I am in no rush to get it in the water and use it. I have the luxury of time.
• I have a heated garage to work in, and the launching ramp is right next to that, so when testing the hull and after or for key technical steps I am not far away.
• I greatly enjoy working on projects.
• It comes with the single axel trailer.
• I have been told that it was running and has been looked over by a mechanic and was running when they winterized it…but.… I will get a second opinion: P

The factors against it:

• The huge unknown of the hull repair and the foam flotation status.(not sure how to tackle the flotation issue, but the hull separation, I have some ideas.)
• The unknown status of the upholstery at this time. (Some may be in decent shape)
• it is missing the engine cover for sure. But I know roughly where it is underwater: P and I have some diver friends…just power wash it off, add upholstery… so fun project right? (Only 25’ of water there) lol
• needs a good electrical overhaul.
• I will take a bunch of photos when I go and see it on Saturday so hopefully, you’ll can assist me in making a reasonable offer after deducting the ball park expenses of what it will take to repair it.

Given that this boat, should it be in decent condition, is worth approximately 12K
+ trailer $1500

- hull work ????

- Upholstery $3500

- Engine work $3500 - $5500

- Electrical issues $800

- gauges $700

- carpet $1500

- missing engine cover $750 (ballpark?)

-Labor ???

that gives me: $2750 as a offer price... but I really do not think it is worth more than $2000 in its current shape hopefully seeing what shape it is in this weekend will help.

What do you think about my guess work from never having done this before lol

Thank you all for you fantastic feedback, it has been great to find such a great community.

Edited April 16, 2015 by lundbladc

[jk13]

Looks like your estimates are spot on, if not a bit padded being they said it was running again. But they do add up to over 12k as listed.

I doubt it will need everything on that list (at those prices) to be a fun and reliable boat again. I'd be really careful about asking what they did before cranking it over. Engine oil and trans fluid should be changed even before the first crank and a few times more after cranking, plus checked often during shakedown. Run for a minute or two, check oil, change oil, etc. Replace alt., starter, complete tuneup, suspect sensors, and being fuel injected the computer and injectors come into question too. Check prices on those. And a steering cable.

Like you said you can get it working and usable, then decide "what's next" as you go. I think it's a solid plan--depending on that hull situation. Be sure to check running gear too being that it hit bottom and got dragged back off. Tracking fins, struts, rudders and steering boxes are not cheap. Prop repair is pretty cheap but usually not 100% like factory. Mine's been repaired and is good enough for my usage, but not perfect.

Waiting to see how it goes...

Edited April 16, 2015 by jk13

[shawndoggy]

Given that this boat, should it be in decent condition, is worth approximately 12K

+ trailer $1500

- hull work ????

- Upholstery $3500

- Engine work $3500 - $5500

- Electrical issues $800

- gauges $700

- carpet $1500

- missing engine cover $750 (ballpark?)

-Labor ???

that gives me: $2750 as a offer price... but I really do not think it is worth more than $2000 in its current shape hopefully seeing what shape it is in this weekend will help.

What do you think about my guess work from never having done this before lol

Thank you all for you fantastic feedback, it has been great to find such a great community.

You also need to add a substantial "basket case" discount. Just as even the most well cared for salt boat will sell at a discount to a freshwater boat, so too will a boat that's been sunk sell at a discount to a "floater," even if the sunk boat has been refurbished perfectly. Given the choice between this boat for $12K or a boat that's never been sunk for $12K, 99.99999% of buyers are going to go with "ain't never been sunk".

[lundbladc]

Waiting to see how it goes...

OP will deliver :-)

On a side note,

Does anyone have or know how to acquire schematics. Initially I need to know how the hull was manufactured and in what locations the foam is, how thick it is in what location and how the layers are bonded together (inner an outer hull) it will give me a better idea as to where water can get and travel to so that I can think about how to repair the hull separation.

Edited April 16, 2015 by lundbladc