Opinions on Ford 5.4 for towing

1 Boat · January 12, 2015

Hey all,

Looking to pick up a 'new' tow rig. By new, I mean replacing my current 2004 4Runner with something more suited for the task of towing.

Given my limited budget (less than $10,000), I think I've narrowed my search down to 2004 vintage F-150 with the 5.4. What's everyones opinion on this truck/engine combo?

I'm not too concerned about mileage as I have another car to handle the daily driving chores. Realistically, I envision I'd really only need this truck 8-10 a year. In fact, if I could get away with just renting a truck when I needed to tow something, I'd much rather do that. But alas, the rental companies generally frown on people towing with their trucks.

Anyways, the 8-10 tows each year would probably include the occasional trip with the boat to other lakes, such as the SE WoW or other events within a 4-5 hour radius of Charlotte. And I might need to tow the race car every now and then or the periodic Home Depot run when the 2 door hatchback won't cut it.

Here's the basic truck I'm looking for: 2004+ F150 crew cab w/ 4WD

Thoughts? Opinions? Things to avoid?

FWIW, if anyone is looking for a 4Runner. I'm selling mine for a really good price...it does have 214xxx miles. But it's a Toyota!

6,312 · January 12, 2015

Do you want a truck? Best bang for your buck under 10k seem to be American suvs. Denali/escalade can be found cheap with the 6.0 which is a great motor. The tranny's don't hold up very well, but once rebuilt should last awhile. I'm sure you're aware of the spark plug issues the 5.4 had?

1 Boat · January 12, 2015

Do you want a truck? Best bang for your buck under 10k seem to be American suvs. Denali/escalade can be found cheap with the 6.0 which is a great motor. The tranny's don't hold up very well, but once rebuilt should last awhile. I'm sure you're aware of the spark plug issues the 5.4 had?

Yeah, a truck would suit my needs better. I'll be building a house in the next year or two (I hope) and I'm sure the truck will come in handy then. Also, I'm hoping the crew cab will make up for lack of interior space I might need.

No, I'm not aware of the plug issues with the 5.4. Was that all or just the certain years? What was the specific problem?

January 12, 2015

I attached a copy of the 2004 Ford Towing guide but here are the numbers.

Crew Cab 4WD:

3.55 gears - 8200lbs

3.73 gears - 9200lbs

Ford's spark plug issue was that the spark plug construction was new for the Triton 5.4 and they had major problems with spark plugs breaking off when they were being changed due to excess carbon build up because of how the plug was designed. Individually owned and operated mechanics wouldn't touch these motors because you needed a special tool from Ford to remove the plugs without them breaking basically sheering.... which didn't always work. Even dealerships had problems and would charge big labor bills when they had to spend extra hours getting broken plugs out of motors. Ford has said they fixed it in 2009 but that's the skinny about it.

http://www.fleet.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/towingguides/2004_All.pdf

Page 16

2,432 · January 12, 2015

Yeah, a truck would suit my needs better. I'll be building a house in the next year or two (I hope) and I'm sure the truck will come in handy then. Also, I'm hoping the crew cab will make up for lack of interior space I might need.
No, I'm not aware of the plug issues with the 5.4. Was that all or just the certain years? What was the specific problem?

Just on the 3V. Talk to Bawshogg about it, he's the resident expert (absolutely no sarcasm in that statement). Not a big deal if you get someone like him that knows what they're doing. Or find a truck that's already had it done.

1 Boat · January 12, 2015

Just on the 3V. Talk to Bawshogg about it, he's the resident expert (absolutely no sarcasm in that statement). Not a big deal if you get someone like him that knows what they're doing. Or find a truck that's already had it done.

By 3V, I'm assuming you mean a 3 valve per cylinder head design? Per the wiki, looks like the motor was put in the 04-08 F-series. Hmmm, that would support RZR saying the problem was fixed in 2009. I'll definitely ping Mr. Hogg Thanks Tracy!

I attached a copy of the 2004 Ford Towing guide but here are the numbers.
Crew Cab 4WD:
3.55 gears - 8200lbs
3.73 gears - 9200lbs
Ford's spark plug issue was that the spark plug construction was new for the Triton 5.4 and they had major problems with spark plugs breaking off when they were being changed due to excess carbon build up because of how the plug was designed. Individually owned and operated mechanics wouldn't touch these motors because you needed a special tool from Ford to remove the plugs without them breaking basically sheering.... which didn't always work. Even dealerships had problems and would charge big labor bills when they had to spend extra hours getting broken plugs out of motors. Ford has said they fixed it in 2009 but that's the skinny about it.
http://www.fleet.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/towingguides/2004_All.pdf
Page 16

How the plug was designed? That sounds weird. To me a spark plug is a spark plug, there's little variation in the design. However, I could see a problem in the design of the head that could cause the problem you're describing. I'll do a bit more research, thanks!

13,700 · January 12, 2015

I had a 2002 5.4L F150 that I towed a car trailer with for years. The truck wouldn't win any acceleration tests, but towed just fine.

2,083 · January 12, 2015

The 5.4 spark plug problem was two fold. The 2V engine (up through 2003 in the trucks and 2004 in the Expy) had too many threads that entered the combustion chamber. Carbon would foul on the plug threads then tear up the aluminum head threads when backing out. The new spark plugs would typically seat alright but had a tendency to blow out of the head some miles later. Heli coil fix was what Ford recommended to remedy the issue. This was on only like two of the cylinders where there was only enough material to have about 3 threads hold the plug.

The 3V engine had a different problem. The 3 valves left little room for the plug so the electrode was on a pillar that extended down through the head surface into the chamber. Carbon would form around that pillar trapping it in that channel. When removing, that pillar would snap off. I think the Ford tool mentioned was actually designed to remove that pillar.

Both issues had many unsettled owners. Ford did very little to resolve these design issues. Personally, between that problem and a couple other issues with the 5.4, I would stay away from it. Also, the steel Ford used in the 2004 era left a lot to be desired in the corrosion resistance category.

2,083 · January 12, 2015

Oh but to answer your question, my 04 Expy with the 5.4 (2V) towed fine. As OJ stated, no races will be won (got taken off the line by a Lark once). But those engines make their torque down low where it needs to be, no need to spin them up like some others.

1,388 · January 12, 2015

This is now the 6th F150 thread created in the last 2 weeks

3 Boats · January 12, 2015

This is now the 6th F150 thread created in the last 2 weeks

what's a F150?

13,700 · January 12, 2015

This is now the 6th F150 thread created in the last 2 weeks

Yup, I don't understand the appeal compared to the other options - but Malibu people seem to like them.

1 Boat · January 12, 2015

Yup, I don't understand the appeal compared to the other options - but Malibu people seem to like them.

Ford sells a metric a$$ ton of them. So there are alot on the used market. Consequently, they tend to be cheaper than their GMC/Chevy counterparts. I won't touch a Dodge. And I don't know how I feel about the Japanese for this type of work.

Given my limited price range, just about anything under 10K that was decent would probably do.

3,265 · January 12, 2015

Ford sells a metric a$$ ton of them. So there are alot on the used market. Consequently, they tend to be cheaper than their GMC/Chevy counterparts. I won't touch a Dodge. And I don't know how I feel about the Japanese for this type of work.
Given my limited price range, just about anything under 10K that was decent would probably do.

If you want an f150, thats what you should get. For as little as your talking about driving it, your biggest maintenance job will be keeping stuff from growing on it.

Spark plugs might have to be replaced once while you own it and if you do just take it to a dealer. Almost all ford techs are pros at extracting these by now and as Wakegirl said, Its a non issue for those guys.

January 12, 2015

Unless you are towing for a living get whatever you like that has a GVWR sufficient for you're needs. There is some confusion with a lot of "truck" owners. Racing is not a synonym for towing.

I've pulled our A22 with a 2003 F150 and 4.6L V8 a couple times. Didn't break any land speed records but it pulled it fine. At no time did I feel "undertrucked". I could "overtruck" it by pulling it with one of the tridrives and 15L Caterpillar......

January 12, 2015

My .02, had an 06 FX4 Crew Cab with the 5.4. Great looking truck (looked great with the boat) great riding truck and towed fine....however it came with $4000 worth of problems....

I ended up selling and taking a loss, then finding a chevy with the 5.3 and couldnt be happier.

Not as good looking rig as the F150 was, but man what a better all around truck IMO.

2,223 · January 12, 2015

I'm in the same situation you are. After towing this past fall with my old 2 door Tahoe / Blazer (SBC 350 - TBI) and then subsequently blowing up the transmission on a steep ramp (lesson learned - use 4 low from now on :/ ) I've been doing a loooooot of thinking about sending Big Ugly to her next home and getting something that tows much better.

If I were to go with a gas burner I'd want a Chevy. Probably an early-mid 2000's Tahoe Z71. I' d have to swap the cam and do the standard "intake, headers, exhaust" - but I *think* it would handle what I needed. Because of the AWD that the Denali has, I don't think I would want that.

My only issue is now I'm super gunshy about the 4L60e now and it's towing (in)abilities.

However - I keep going back to a 99-02 F250 with the 7.3. I'm always stealing my father-in-law's when I need to tow something further than a 45 mile trip to the lake. I like towing with it, I like driving it in the rain because of how steady it is, and I like the fact that throwing 6" of lift and 35's on it is almost a brainless procedure without the ill effects of "breaking front cv axles" and "huge alignment issues."

My situation is a little different. I tow 45-65 miles to get to water. I'll be leaving the boat at the storage unit at lake most of the time, but I'll probably haul the boat (06 23lsv) over an hour, one way, about 20 times a year. Including 3-4 hours to and from Lake Lanier 2-3 times.

And I just can't make up my mind. *sigh*

January 12, 2015

If I were to go with a gas burner I'd want a Chevy. Probably an early-mid 2000's Tahoe Z71. I' d have to swap the cam and do the standard "intake, headers, exhaust" - but I *think* it would handle what I needed. Because of the AWD that the Denali has, I don't think I would want that.
My only issue is now I'm super gunshy about the 4L60e now and it's towing (in)abilities.

Good plan...the 5.3 has soooo much potential

http://www.truckinweb.com/tech/1208tr_5_3l_bow_tie_builds_mild_to_wild/viewall.html

2,083 · January 12, 2015

If I were to go with an older chevy, I'd be looking for the 4 wheel steer option, especially for towing.

2,223 · January 12, 2015

If I were to go with an older chevy, I'd be looking for the 4 wheel steer option, especially for towing.

I don't like things I can't dissect and fix myself. LOL

I do like the 5.3. I want to do a 5.3 swap into Big Ugly next fall, but there are sooooo many different things that will always be going wrong with it.

Although I guess if if I get a 2002-2003 Tahoe I'm just trading my own issues for someone else's issues.

At least Big Ugly has new steering/hubs/rear axle etc. and I know all the demons in the closet. ha

***Edit - sorry, didn't mean to hijack. I'll let you guys get back to discussing the 5.4.

Edited January 12, 2015 by ibelonginprison

4,007 · January 13, 2015

I had the 5.4 in our 09 f150, which my dad still drives. No, it doesn't tow as well as some other newer offerings, but it tows just fine. I have towed my VLX, flat trailers, enclosed trailers, and it handles them all just fine. Everyone knows someone who knows someone who has had problems with just about any brand. Ford personally has never let my family down. I know friends that love Chevy and have good luck with them, but if we are worried about the ford spark plug issue, let's also worry about the Chevy 5.3 burning oil issue.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

January 13, 2015

I drove an 04 SCrew w/ the 5.4 and it towed the 'Bu just fine. I did have some issues w/ the spark plugs and coil packs but it was not a very expensive fix ~$200 IIRC. Definitely a reasonably priced full sized truck.

2,818 · January 13, 2015

You'll hear good and bad about everything. I've had 2 F-150's and an Expedition EL, all with the 5.4L. I had great luck with the engine in all 3 of those rigs. They tow just fine. As others have said, they're not winning any races, but won't let you down. If you find one well maintained that checks all the boxes, then go for it. Brand loyalty aside.

I did have an '04 F-150 that was plagued with little annoying problems, but none of them affected performance....they were all silly interior electrical gremlins and for 2 years and 110,000 miles, it didn't cause me any mechanical malfunctions. I actually feel bad for that truck.....I drove the crap out of it, towed the crap out of it, buried it in the mud, numerous times, and she kept on going.

January 13, 2015

I have a 06 F150 extended cab that I bought in 2009 with 40K miles on it. It now has 65K on it and was trouble free up until this last season. This past year I started seeing some of the typical issues associated with the model and typical problems a vehicle that doesn't get driven enough will experience. I started the season off trying to do a preemptive strike on the sparkplugs. The F150 forums recommend getting the originals out as soon as possible to limit the dreaded broken two piece plug problem and replacing them with the new one piece design plugs (so yes there is a fix to the problem but it involves replacing the plugs). Any shop worth a hoot will tackle this job for you, at least in Michigan. If they won't you may want to find a more competent mechanic anyway. I had my local shop do this for me and they broke 2 plugs in the process. Price for the plug swap was $800.

Got the truck home sitting in the driveway and noticed a couple days later that I had fluid underneath the engine. Stared looking around and discovered that the power steering lines had rotted through. Ended up having to replace the rack and both the low and high pressure lines. Didn't have the gear to do this myself so back to the shop and another $700 later I was back on the road.

Figured it would be a good idea to replace the shocks and struts since the truck was 9 years old. Bought the loaded KYB struts and shocks and did this myself. Still was another $400.

Started hearing a ticking noise from the passenger side of the engine when the truck was first started then went away as it warmed up. The noise got worse as the summer went on. I did some research on the problem and after once again getting under the truck and digging around was able to find a crack on the exhaust manifold. Another $700.

So what can you take away from all this...... All these trucks have known issues (yes the Chevys have their problems too, go to one of their forums if you don't believe me). The F150s with the 5.4's big weaknesses are the plugs, manifolds and cam phasers. The plugs should be a one shot deal as the recommend replacement schedule is every 100K. Both the Fords and the Chevys have manifold issues and once again this should (hopefully) be a one shot deal. Unless the truck has been dogged you really shouldn't experience a cam phaser issue on an under 150k engine. I believe the rotted power steering lines on mine were a result of the care (or lack there of) the previous owner took with this truck and Michigan winter conditions along with a truck that sits for long periods.

So what to look for if you do look for an older F150......

Try to find one that the plugs have been replaced.

Look at the truck when the engine is cold and listen for an exhaust leak. The passenger side is know to go first at the very back cylinder.

Look for rotted brake and power steering lines if the truck comes from the snow belt or where they use salt on the roads.

Listen for a ticking noise coming from the front of the engine. A noise here could be a cam phaser

Go to a forum for any truck you plan to buy. You can find out the weaknesses for any of these vehicles there.

Lastly consider a very low mile lease on a new truck. They had 5K/year leases on F150s here a couple years back for $200/month. After this last year that deal isn't looking too bad.

From a towing perspective I am very satisfied. Coming from towing with an Explorer there is no comparison towing with a more powerful and heavier vehicle. Pulling a 5000lb loaded boat on long trips is no problem at all and the ride is very comfortable.

2,448 · January 13, 2015

I had the 5.4 in our 09 f150, which my dad still drives. No, it doesn't tow as well as some other newer offerings, but it tows just fine. I have towed my VLX, flat trailers, enclosed trailers, and it handles them all just fine. Everyone knows someone who knows someone who has had problems with just about any brand. Ford personally has never let my family down. I know friends that love Chevy and have good luck with them, but if we are worried about the ford spark plug issue, let's also worry about the Chevy 5.3 burning oil issue.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I was always concerned about this on my 05 1500

http://www.gm-trucks.com/forums/topic/139335-castech-cylinder-heads/

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