Shawndoggy '14 LSV Stereo Build

[IXFE]

It's 2 ft3 internal.

Earlier you posted 1.8 cu ft. Did you change dimensions since the schematic posted earlier?

[shawndoggy]

Earlier you posted 1.8 cu ft. Did you change dimensions since the schematic posted earlier?

Sorry, gross vs. net. Driver takes up .1, port approx the same. You want down to the tousandths?

(2.042 ft3)

Edited February 23, 2015 by shawndoggy

[Lance B. Johnson]

Sorry, gross vs. net. Driver takes up .1, port approx the same. You want down to the tousandths?

(2.042 ft3)

Dang, you beat me by a little! I got just under 2. Once I got it in place (not easy) I did realize I could have come forward some. I had another couple inches before it was longer than the left panel under the helm.

Baws calculated the port slot size for me and no huffing as far as I can tell. I think he was spot on, can't wait for him to hear it.

Edited February 23, 2015 by Lance B. Johnson

[nyryan2001]

Not noisy at all. And I am using the unorthodox drain pipe elbow from lowes, which lines up well but not exactly (I need 15.5" length but box is only 13.5" deep internal). Before finally caving and trying the precision port, I've used ABS plastic pipe for a different ported box (different driver) and it huffed and puffed even at low volumes so I know what you are talking about with port noise. The precision port is very quiet. The other nice thing about the precision port is that you can experiment a bit with your tuning by using different port lengths. pretty hard to do that with a slot port.

And yes, much easier than a slot port from the shadetree assembly perspective. At least as far as making sure that you get the length/tuning frequency right.

Thanks Shawn. My new sub will require somewhat a trapezoidal design... the aeroport would make it a ton simpler. I wonder how the metered output is affected in slotport vs aero port.

Edited February 23, 2015 by nyryan2001

[shawndoggy]

Thanks Shawn. My new sub will require somewhat a trapezoidal design... the aeroport would make it a ton simpler. I wonder how the metered output is affected in slotport vs aero port.

Good question. I don't know the answer to that. Prolly a david question, really?

Note if you are super duper paranoid about port noise, precision port makes a dimpled port too.

[martinarcher]

Make 2 while your at it

Explain to me what the HSE was again? I have a Boost Box. Was the HSE just strictly RPM based volume control? Pre-amp voltage bump as well or just a passive volume control device? I can't see why I could design one if you guys have interest.

[martinarcher]

That box looks great Shawn!

[jk13]

I wonder how the metered output is affected in slotport vs aero port.

Good question. I don't know the answer to that.

The answer is: given the same port area the difference becomes wall surface area for aerodynamic drag.

So (for maximum output) wide, thin ports typically don't perform as well as those with closer to 1:1 aspect ratio simply due to the percentage of air moving against the surface walls vs. air flowing free in the middle. Port length also comes into this equation. Shorter the better for maximum output. Not that maximum output should always be the goal...

Looks good so far Shawn!

Edited February 23, 2015 by jk13

[Lance B. Johnson]

Explain to me what the HSE was again? I have a Boost Box. Was the HSE just strictly RPM based volume control? Pre-amp voltage bump as well or just a passive volume control device? I can't see why I could design one if you guys have interest.

It was strictly RPM based. You were able to set the rpm and gain then forget.

[shawndoggy]

finally a little more progress.

got the first coat of resin on the box.

Got my shore charge receptacle installed.

Got the cipa vision 180 mirror and cipa bracket put on (I'm into this for about $90):

And the thing I'm really stoked on.... I figured out how to get a group 29 under the observer's seat along with the two group 24s:

The brackets for this battery have to hang off the edge a bit, but the battery itself is all on the "platform"

Also because the end of the box is under the seat base rail, I needed to customize the end of the lid to allow it to slide under the seat base rail:

This one only gets three corners. The fourth corner butts up against the lip for the observers compartment:

Same for the Group 29 (in a Group 27 box)... the fourth corner is the lip:

[IXFE]

Impressive, Shawn. Looks like a lot of rewiring ahead of you. That makes my head hurt. [emoji15]

[Cory]

Lookin good!

[shawndoggy]

Impressive, Shawn. Looks like a lot of rewiring ahead of you. That makes my head hurt. [emoji15]

yeah man seriously. I thought I'd knock the whole install out today. Just wiring up the batteries / acr / amps is going to take all day tomorrow I think. Maybe if I'm lucky I will get the sub box finished and installed tomorrow too. the amp rack is still a giant, crazy mess. I want to attack it but I really need to have everything else ready first. So I'm just chugging along slowly for now. Realistically it's two more weekends I think.

I am SO slow. Can't believe how fast Fman knocked his out. I swear I spent two hours today just staring at stuff. Not doing anything, just looking at it and imagining what I want it to be.

Finally, a shout out to the factory sub box... It's a really nice source of starboard, and provided ample material to make the extra battery box brackets, sub box spacers, and other misc. doo dads. <--- I made the extra battery box brackets by pulling the factory brackets as a template with a trim bit on my router. worked like a champ!

Edited March 8, 2015 by shawndoggy

[Fman]

Shawndoggy is in beast mode... Seriously, you always do a great job on all your projects, I always like to follow your threads.

Three batteries? Are you upgrading the alternator as well?

[shawndoggy]

Shawndoggy is in beast mode... Seriously, you always do a great job on all your projects, I always like to follow your threads.

Three batteries? Are you upgrading the alternator as well?

No, same alternator. Actually I am going with more battery in hopes of preserving my alternator. We don't run really loud that much... really when someone is behind the boat. On the MB my alternator died at about 280 hours. I only had two group 24s (one for stereo, one for starting / house). I think that the group 24 didn't provide enough buffer for my alternator.... the stereo would be loud, that battery would get hit hard, and the alternator would see a big load. I'm hoping that with a bigger stereo bank, I'll see less voltage drop and thus not such a hard load on the alternator.

For now the plan is a group 24 on the starting/house side, and a group 24 and group 29 in parallel for the stereo.

all with a blue sea add-a-battery to keep it simple.

[Fman]

Ah that makes sense, will be a nice set up too. I am hoping my three amps with a factory dual battery setup wont kill my alternator. Brian thought it would be fine, so time will tell. We only run loud when someone is riding, but the stereo is pretty much turned on all day for the most part.

[Bawshogg]

A better than average on board charger is a MUST if you rock a healthy system . If you don't have one , despite what batteries you have, you are nuts at this level.

[shawndoggy]

A better than average on board charger is a MUST if you rock a healthy system . If you don't have one , despite what batteries you have, you are nuts at this level.

Prosport 20 enough?

[David]

ProSport 20 enough?

Maybe not.

Actually nyryan prompted me to get into this a bit deeper.

The 'distribute on demand' feature (all capacity to a single bank based on demand) is a bit misleading to some and you can take that too far.

The ProSport 20 specifically states in the owners manual no more than one battery per bank. So no more than a group 31 or 105/110 amp/hours per bank. Or, two Optima group 34s would be the same collective amp/hours.

The wire gauge, drive transistors and heat dissipation were not intended to handle more. This is a sealed charger without a fan versus a dry-mount convertor-class of charger. A great value charger but very limited in its build just the same. You can easily run it into the ground.

Whether or not you can reliably exceed its recommended capacity is circumstantial. If you have additional battery capacity per bank and you place those batteries into storage with a full charge then you are using the charger mostly as a maintainer and this would be okay. However, if you are placing well depleted batteries into storage then you should stay with the ProMariner clear instructions.

[David]

Port noise?

A shorter port with less surface area can tune at the same frequency as a longer port with more surface area because the effective port resistance can be the same.

I do not believe there is a noise difference or an efficiency difference between a round port and a rectangular port if both are designed and constructed properly. You can go too far with a slot port though. If that port becomes too narrow in one dimension then there will be more wall surface drag, more potential for noise and less port efficiency. If the dimensions of a rectangular port are within a reasonable balance and the narrowest dimension is applicable to the size of woofer being used, you should have no noise. If you radius the interior and exterior openings of any port, this will help reduce noise at high output levels, whether round or rectangular.

I would avoid using a triangular port. That's promoting noise.

I would avoid using a round port that has too small of a cross section just to make a round port fit. A port that is too small of any shape is definitely on a path to port noise.

I wouldn't use a port with a smaller surface area and thus a shorter length just to avoid an internal elbow.

I like longer/larger slot-loaded ports with more displacement...within limits. But they will increase the overall cabinet size. The port wall thickness does not need to equal the exterior cabinet thickness and when part of the initial design, three of four port surfaces can be shared with the cabinet exterior walls, which helps keep the overall displacement down.

[shawndoggy]

yeah I should be fine then. we are by no means rock out at the party cove people. the only time the stereo is going full tilt, so is the alternator. and there are plenty of other times where engine RPMs are up and the stereo isn't. My batteries are by no means being put away depleted.... but a top off/maintenance charge will be great for peace of mind.

Edited March 8, 2015 by shawndoggy

[Lance B. Johnson]

yeah man seriously. I thought I'd knock the whole install out today. Just wiring up the batteries / acr / amps is going to take all day tomorrow I think. Maybe if I'm lucky I will get the sub box finished and installed tomorrow too. the amp rack is still a giant, crazy mess. I want to attack it but I really need to have everything else ready first. So I'm just chugging along slowly for now. Realistically it's two more weekends I think.

I am SO slow. Can't believe how fast Fman knocked his out. I swear I spent two hours today just staring at stuff. Not doing anything, just looking at it and imagining what I want it to be.

Finally, a shout out to the factory sub box... It's a really nice source of starboard, and provided ample material to make the extra battery box brackets, sub box spacers, and other misc. doo dads. <--- I made the extra battery box brackets by pulling the factory brackets as a template with a trim bit on my router. worked like a champ!

Oh man. I hear you. I figured I would start my ballast project yesterday. I assumed I would be drilling, screwing, plumbing etc......NOPE. All I did was mock up the pumps in EVERY possible location and weight out the pro's and con's of each location and how I wanted the finished product to look. FINALLY I settled on something and didn't even get to run one screw.

[shawndoggy]

And with ballast or anything electrical, it's the wiring, switches, fuses, etc that take most of the time. Putting holes in the hull, mounting pumps and running hoses is the easy part.

[IXFE]

finally a little more progress.

got the first coat of resin on the box.

Shawn,

Can you say more about the box? Maybe even post more pics from different angles?

1) How are the corners held together? Glued and screwed?

2) What do you use to seal the seems?

3) Where did you buy the port and how is it secured in place?

4) If you could make it a touch bigger (i.e. no heater to contend with) which direction would you grow it? Towards the rear?

5) How do you plan to secure the box in place under the helm?

6) I'd you'd used a material like baltic birch, would you still be covering it in resin?

7) When looking at box requirements for a given driver, what the difference between "normal" and "spl?"

Any thing else that comes to mind...

Thanks!

Edited March 8, 2015 by IXFE

[shawndoggy]

the joints are all rabbeted and glued. I used a nail gun (18 ga brads) to hold it together initially, but once clamped you see how little those brads do (way more glue comes out the joints once you get the clamps on).

With the rabbet joints you don't really NEED to seal the seams because you've got glue on two planes. If there's a leak, I did it wrong. Nonetheless, I did seal inside with silicone. I don't think it added anything tho.

The port is from parts express. Just google up "precision port". It's held in with screws.

Yes, I would go back if I could make it bigger. But there's a maximum depth in there somewhere where it may fit in place but you couldn't get it in past the steering wheel, driver's seat and walkthrough wall. I'm sure I could've gone "out" a bit (towards the wall of the hull), but that presents the same problem with actually fitting it in. Definitely mock up with cardboard first.

If I ever manage to finish I'll post some pics of what I'm doing to secure in place. It will have blocks underneath to hold it off the floor (cut up pieces of factory speaker box) and then I'm gonna use my idea of tongue and groove in the back to keep the box from sliding backwards or coming up. In the front I will mount the two blocks that held the factory wall in. That's going to entail drilling through the carpet I think, unfortunately.

I think I would try to seal baltic birch with something. But I've never used it and cannot say whether it's necessary or not. The reason I didn't use baltic birch this time is (a) it's not as easy to find void free baltic birch as mdf, and (b) I don't like that you can't screw into the ends of it. Plus its more expensive and I invariably end up messing up a piece of my box and needing to do it over.