Biggest baddest SUV tow vehicle for under $15k?

[wakesetter8796]

And won't be $15k based on the GC pricing, ouch! $57k for a loaded diesel

[Tims]

Ram got motor trend truck of the year, and they said that the hemi had more "reserve power" going from 60 and flooring it than the ecoboost, which they said had almost none. It will be interesting to see the ram diesel.

I don't own an eco and not a fanboy, but you cannot deny the torque curve of that engine. It's a pretty nice tow motor.

[Nitrousbird]

LOLz motor trend. That mag has been a laughingstock for decades.

You got that right. I never trusted them after seeing they gave the 1983 Renault Alliance car of the year. I owned a lower mileage one I bought as a first car in '95...WOW, what a POS. There wasn't a redeeming feature on that car in any way, shape or form even compared to other early 80's cars. I remember getting smoked by a buddy's early 80's Ford Escort at the time. I'm glad Renault died off in the US (though the 5 Turbo was sort of cool).

Other notable Motor Trend car of the year entries from the past few years:

2002 Thunderbird - that turd was a real flop

2001 PT Cruiser - wow....really, that POS was car of the year?!!

2000 Lincoln LS - a flop for Lincoln

1999 Chrysler 300M - not a good car

1997 Chevy Malibu - Yuck

1996 Dodge Caravan - I wonder what it started doing first, having electrical issues or burning massive amounts of oil

1995 Chrysler Cirrus - LOL, who actually owned one of those things?

[Lance B. Johnson]

Ahhhhh the Ecoboost.

Just saw some nasty news on the Ecoboost.... And hundreds of thousands of directed safety recalls from the NTSB.

I'll be a believer in the Ecoboost when we start seeing them routinely making it to 300k miles...

Ha you just ruled out.....EVERYTHING! Pretty funny.

[wakesetter8796]

Ram got motor trend truck of the year, and they said that the hemi had more "reserve power" going from 60 and flooring it than the ecoboost, which they said had almost none. It will be interesting to see the ram diesel.

I don't own an eco and not a fanboy, but you cannot deny the torque curve of that engine. It's a pretty nice tow motor.

Ya it's pretty sweet! They said the 5.0 was a better towing motor but I don't believe that. Maybe the 6.2 but that's a stretch also. I like that these companies are finally stepping out a little, turbos and diesels.

[wakesetter8796]

What's funny is that motor trend took a f150 Eco for their long term test right after the competition and started praising the engine, which is what they should have been doing all along.

I wonder what the average MPG was after that 24 hours of towing on the video.

[UWSkier]

A video about the ecoboost. The show the turbos a few times and they are cherry red hot!

That's what I mean. That's a lot to ask of those turbo bearings. I like the concept of the EB. I want to see what happens when there's a whole slew of them over 100k on the clock that were spent working.

[Tims]

That's what I mean. That's a lot to ask of those turbo bearings. I like the concept of the EB. I want to see what happens when there's a whole slew of them over 100k on the clock that were spent working.

The turbos are pretty reliable. I like the fact that they are using smaller twins insetad of VGT compounds or a single VGT's, (which have been abused in the 3/4T diesels for years with higher EGT's/boost and lasting well over 200,000 miles.)

I would be more worried about the emmisions systems (Cat's and EGR) and how they will last coupled with the DI injection system.

[Malibudude]

It's still a half-ton-based tow rig and a 10 year old design at that. That kind of load at 7k' altitude in 100+ degree heat is a lot to as of any half tonner, especially without forced induction to compensate for the barometric pressure.

Too bad there's no Ecoboost Expedition. Though I'm anxious to see how these trucks hold up. Those smallish turbos on the EB have to be spooling like mad any time there's a load. This means heat. Lots of heat.

Well have a 2013 Escape, great smaller SUV and Furd put a great design and finish. The ecoboost has failed three times. First was they say a water pump after I said the engine compartment smells like coolant after stopping. The dealer said it was a leaking water pump at 20k. Then the smell while never really went away came back again. Then the engine like came on and the Escape ran rough and had a hard time starting. Kept have those issues than it seemed to work itself out w/ a new tank of gas. A few thousand miles later the engine light came on again and now it's overheating. They said coolant was low and what not, right cause I didn't check that and it was fine. Again a few hundred miles later same problems running rough and coolant smell. Back to the dealer and they said the car was leaking coolant but didn't know where. So they checked the head and gasket they were fine. Next they checked the block...bingo cracked block. So replaced engine.....after a month all go to go..... less than an hour after picking it up same problem again.... back to the dealer last week and still awaiting what they are going to do. My guess they are asking Furd what to do now. Oh to top it off the right CV boot is also cracked..... So my opinion of the EC isn't very good. Again like the suv but if it doesn't run or isn't reliable it's of no use.

The ecoboost engines have no issues with heat, even with the small turbos and high drive pressure ratio. There have been some problems with moisture build up in the intercooler, but they apparently have a fix. Seems like the eco would be a nice powertrain for the return of the Expedition.

Heat is a problem in these engines.

Ahhhhh the Ecoboost.

Just saw some nasty news on the Ecoboost.... And hundreds of thousands of directed safety recalls from the NTSB.

I'll be a believer in the Ecoboost when we start seeing them routinely making it to 300k miles...

First recall was for a leaky fuel in the rail somewhere that then could make its was down to the exhaust manifold.

OK here's the update.

My tranny gauge has idiot lights. four LEDs. Normal driving I only ever get one LED. Towing, I can get as many as three if I leave it in 4th and let the tranny do the shifting, but now that I've learned to shift it manually on steep grades I never get above two lights.

We didn't end up going over the pass yesterday and instead stayed local. The "nice" thing is that I've got a 2 mile 6% climb to my house where more often than not you start at a dead stop (signal at bottom of the hill). Anyway, nice and heatsoaked, starting from a dead stop, with AC running full blast and holding 4500 rpms in second (50 mph), sure enough, I managed to get the temp gauge to skyrocket on just this three minute climb. Did fine otherwise pulling the boat home and have no problems keeping 60mph on the freeway, etc.

The whole time on yesterday's 98* tow home, I was on "one light" on the tranny temp gauge. While I don't doubt that hot tranny fluid contributes to the heat to the engine, it does not seem to be the decisive factor.

MLA -- great question about stuff blocking the radiator. I do have a front hitch (for putting the boat away in a tight storage garage), but I just checked again and it's mounted well below the radiator, and doesn't block.

UGH. so now do I keep throwing time and $$$ getting this to work. I don't know. Half of me says just turn the ac off and roll the windows down and slow down on the steep grades and suck it up for a while. The car joneser half says boy a new tow rig would sure be nice.

A reasonably priced bulletproofed one owner '03 6.0 excursion with 150k just came on the market in my hood too.

It's the 6.0 and that is a ticking time bomb, over heating problems due top design. Completely repairable and then faik they are fine after that. Certainly would handle our terrain w/o any issue.

[Tims]

Well have a 2013 Escape, great smaller SUV and Furd put a great design and finish. The ecoboost has failed three times. First was they say a water pump after I said the engine compartment smells like coolant after stopping. The dealer said it was a leaking water pump at 20k. Then the smell while never really went away came back again. Then the engine like came on and the Escape ran rough and had a hard time starting. Kept have those issues than it seemed to work itself out w/ a new tank of gas. A few thousand miles later the engine light came on again and now it's overheating. They said coolant was low and what not, right cause I didn't check that and it was fine. Again a few hundred miles later same problems running rough and coolant smell. Back to the dealer and they said the car was leaking coolant but didn't know where. So they checked the head and gasket they were fine. Next they checked the block...bingo cracked block. So replaced engine.....after a month all go to go..... less than an hour after picking it up same problem again.... back to the dealer last week and still awaiting what they are going to do. My guess they are asking Furd what to do now. Oh to top it off the right CV boot is also cracked..... So my opinion of the EC isn't very good. Again like the suv but if it doesn't run or isn't reliable it's of no use.

Heat is a problem in these engines.

First recall was for a leaky fuel in the rail somewhere that then could make its was down to the exhaust manifold.

It's the 6.0 and that is a ticking time bomb, over heating problems due top design. Completely repairable and then faik they are fine after that. Certainly would handle our terrain w/o any issue.

I was referring to the 3.5 Eco. What problem do they have with heat?

On the 6.0, what do you mean by top design?

[Malibudude]

I was referring to the 3.5 Eco. What problem do they have with heat?

On the 6.0, what do you mean by top design?

I was reffing to the 1.6L not the 3.5L.

The 6.0 iirc it was the EGR that caused the overheating and requires a top breakdown to repair.

[Lance B. Johnson]

Well have a 2013 Escape, great smaller SUV and Furd put a great design and finish. The ecoboost has failed three times. First was they say a water pump after I said the engine compartment smells like coolant after stopping. The dealer said it was a leaking water pump at 20k. Then the smell while never really went away came back again. Then the engine like came on and the Escape ran rough and had a hard time starting. Kept have those issues than it seemed to work itself out w/ a new tank of gas. A few thousand miles later the engine light came on again and now it's overheating. They said coolant was low and what not, right cause I didn't check that and it was fine. Again a few hundred miles later same problems running rough and coolant smell. Back to the dealer and they said the car was leaking coolant but didn't know where. So they checked the head and gasket they were fine. Next they checked the block...bingo cracked block. So replaced engine.....after a month all go to go..... less than an hour after picking it up same problem again.... back to the dealer last week and still awaiting what they are going to do. My guess they are asking Furd what to do now. Oh to top it off the right CV boot is also cracked..... So my opinion of the EC isn't very good. Again like the suv but if it doesn't run or isn't reliable it's of no use.

Shouldn't you lemon law that thing? I don't know anything of the legality of it but seems like your there?

Heat is a problem in these engines.

First recall was for a leaky fuel in the rail somewhere that then could make its was down to the exhaust manifold.

It's the 6.0 and that is a ticking time bomb, over heating problems due top design. Completely repairable and then faik they are fine after that. Certainly would handle our terrain w/o any issue.

[Malibudude]

Well have a 2013 Escape, great smaller SUV and Furd put a great design and finish. The ecoboost has failed three times. First was they say a water pump after I said the engine compartment smells like coolant after stopping. The dealer said it was a leaking water pump at 20k. Then the smell while never really went away came back again. Then the engine like came on and the Escape ran rough and had a hard time starting. Kept have those issues than it seemed to work itself out w/ a new tank of gas. A few thousand miles later the engine light came on again and now it's overheating. They said coolant was low and what not, right cause I didn't check that and it was fine. Again a few hundred miles later same problems running rough and coolant smell. Back to the dealer and they said the car was leaking coolant but didn't know where. So they checked the head and gasket they were fine. Next they checked the block...bingo cracked block. So replaced engine.....after a month all go to go..... less than an hour after picking it up same problem again.... back to the dealer last week and still awaiting what they are going to do. My guess they are asking Furd what to do now. Oh to top it off the right CV boot is also cracked..... So my opinion of the EC isn't very good. Again like the suv but if it doesn't run or isn't reliable it's of no use.

Shouldn't you lemon law that thing? I don't know anything of the legality of it but seems like your there?

Heat is a problem in these engines.

First recall was for a leaky fuel in the rail somewhere that then could make its was down to the exhaust manifold.

It's the 6.0 and that is a ticking time bomb, over heating problems due top design. Completely repairable and then faik they are fine after that. Certainly would handle our terrain w/o any issue.

To be considered a lemon it must be in 3 times for the same problem....no define what the same problem is. Water pump was one, new engine two, over heat in new engine and yet to hear what the problem is. The dealer is waiting for Furd to tell them. Yes at this point use it for a jaws of life exhibit.

[Lance B. Johnson]

To be considered a lemon it must be in 3 times for the same problem....no define what the same problem is. Water pump was one, new engine two, over heat in new engine and yet to hear what the problem is. The dealer is waiting for Furd to tell them. Yes at this point use it for a jaws of life exhibit.

Actually some get donated to training programs like mine. I've got a couple lemons and one flood car.

[Malibudude]

Ultimate tow rig....really come on even the most elementary driver can surely see this isn't safe or functional. No the setup isn't cropped or was there a problem, other than the obvious.

[85 Barefoot]

Doggy, the obvious answer is, find your old beloved odysssey, put in 6.2, add heavy duty bags all the way around and have fun

[shawndoggy]

I've got a couple of excursion candidates locally. Knowing that I only drive 7-9k miles a year, is diesel (at say a $3k premium) worth it over a v10, especially after considering the maintenance burden of the diesel?

I'm not sure I ever break even economically? I should be able to live with the v10's 400 ft pounds of torque right?

[Bozboat]

I've got a couple of excursion candidates locally. Knowing that I only drive 7-9k miles a year, is diesel (at say a $3k premium) worth it over a v10, especially after considering the maintenance burden of the diesel?

I'm not sure I ever break even economically? I should be able to live with the v10's 400 ft pounds of torque right?

I drove Hertz's V10 excursion 4x4 one week at the Rosebowl. I was really disappointed with power, seemed grossly underpowered compared to the diesel.

[jetskipro550]

I've got a couple of excursion candidates locally. Knowing that I only drive 7-9k miles a year, is diesel (at say a $3k premium) worth it over a v10, especially after considering the maintenance burden of the diesel?

I'm not sure I ever break even economically? I should be able to live with the v10's 400 ft pounds of torque right?

From what you're saying, I don't think it's about economics, but not having to worry about over heating or wondering if your family will make it home safely. Those sorts of things are hard to quantify and put a dollar amount too. So what if you lose 2k over the next 4 years on this deal...is that worth not being stuck ont he side of the road with your family in 110* temps?

The v10 only has 400 ft/lbs? That seems pretty weak for that size engine? Whats the displacement? I haven't driven a v10 Ford, but have heard from plenty of people that its a dog. My good friend drove a newer F250 V10 from Utah - Oregon last summer towing a hot tub...said it felt less powerful then his old 2001 chevy 2500 w/6.0

Is an older 2500 suburban out of the question?

[shawndoggy]

I drove Hertz's V10 excursion 4x4 one week at the Rosebowl. I was really disappointed with power, seemed grossly underpowered compared to the diesel.

yer killing me boz.

Which diesel did you drive, 6.0 or 7.3? Coming from a gasser, as far as pure acceleration goes the 6.0 I drove was very impressive. the 7.3s seem pretty anemic out of the hole (I know, that's not what they're designed for).

[Malibudude]

I've got a couple of excursion candidates locally. Knowing that I only drive 7-9k miles a year, is diesel (at say a $3k premium) worth it over a v10, especially after considering the maintenance burden of the diesel?

I'm not sure I ever break even economically? I should be able to live with the v10's 400 ft pounds of torque right?

Recoup the cost, no. The V-10 will serve you well.

[Tims]

Diesel maintenance is really not that bad if you do it yourself. Sure they hold quite a bit of oil, but you can buy the motorcraft filters and Delo 400 oil at Wallmart for a decent price, and with your annual mileage, perform one oil change per year along with fuel filters. Not much else to do except add a bottle of Stanadyne every other fill up.

The real killer is the fuel premium, but with the V-10 sucken the gas down it will probably be a wash or small advantage for the diesel.

If you go through the hassle of making a switch, might as well get a performance boost out of it. You need at least 500+ pound feet of torque. :-)

Edited June 12, 2013 by Tims

[Bozboat]

yer killing me boz.

Which diesel did you drive, 6.0 or 7.3? Coming from a gasser, as far as pure acceleration goes the 6.0 I drove was very impressive. the 7.3s seem pretty anemic out of the hole (I know, that's not what they're designed for).

6.0, actually was going to buy it with the extended warranty, but didn't. It was the Limited Trim level. I will add some more photos later if I can find them. The 6.0 was fun to drive. It had a good firm heavy ride, yet was nimble enough. The V10 from Hertz was an XLT, both 4x4, but the V10 wasn't much fun to drive compared to the diesel, less power, slow, bouncy.

The thing is you WANT the Diesel. Grab one, drive it this summer, sell it next fall if you aren't happy, but you will enjoy it this summer.

[Malibudude]

6.0, actually was going to buy it with the extended warranty, but didn't. It was the Limited Trim level. I will add some more photos later if I can find them. The 6.0 was fun to drive. It had a good firm heavy ride, yet was nimble enough. The V10 from Hertz was an XLT, both 4x4, but the V10 wasn't much fun to drive compared to the diesel, less power, slow, bouncy.

The thing is you WANT the Diesel. Grab one, drive it this summer, sell it next fall if you aren't happy, but you will enjoy it this summer.

Not the same driving experience with the 496.

[Bozboat]

SD, if you are not sold on the Diesel Excursion, maybe you would consider something on the wild side?

This one has a 383 Stroker

Or how about a 46 Dodge?