Direction of boat design/pricing

[nyryan2001]

That 13 VLX dont need the 450....the new '15 maybe

I wasnt asking you, I was asking Cory... its his boat man. The reason Im asking is Ive never heard anyone wanna upgrade over the 350, interested to see if he thought the $10k upgrade was really worth it. he might recover $3-5k on that 450 when it comes to sell.

[Cory]

You wish you would have went with the 450? that would have been a $10k upgrade over the 350 correct?

Well, that is a more complex question today. If I didn't know they were coming out with a whole new body style for the VLX next year, then yes, with what I know about surfgate today, I would have gone with the 450 in my '13 VLX. I believe my dealer wanted $8500 at the time for it (but I could be wrong, it was a long time ago). Knowing that a new VLX is coming, my regret is muted, cause it becomes an added justification excuse for upgrade and I would be losing more $$$ at trade-in after just two years. So, if the new VLX fits in my garages, then I guess I don't actually regret my decision, though I do want more power in my current VLX so I don't have to play the prop game or feel like I'm pushing the engine really hard when surfing.

Edited July 15, 2014 by Cory

[Afun]

I wasnt asking you, I was asking Cory... its his boat man. The reason Im asking is Ive never heard anyone wanna upgrade over the 350, interested to see if he thought the $10k upgrade was really worth it. he might recover $3-5k on that 450 when it comes to sell.

Ok...don't get your panties in a bunch

[Bawshogg]

Prime example....

The closets centurion dealer in the Portland metro area is 1.5 hr drive each way.

I happen to know the local Supreme dealer and they regularly service UNDER WARRANTY several Centurions . It's the shear convenience factor for owners.

I have NEVER heard of Malibu providing or even offering anything of this sort. They got butthurt even at the mention of Bakes servicing a Malibu .....whom is now an Axis dealer.

[-BS-]

No, value and price are totally different. A higher quality item will often be a better value even though it costs more. It will provide a greater level of comfort convenience and performance for a longer period of time. That is value. Would you buy a 10+ year old Malibu? Yes. ..how about a 10+ year old tige? Not so much. 10+ year old nautique? Yep. There is value in the quality and longevity.

Should soul craft lower their prices because I can buy a liquid force board for 1/2 the price. I can surf both, yet one is a much greater value. I will not outgrow the soul craft in the next year, two years or likely in my lifetime. The liquid force will leave me wanting more so I will likely replace it several times.

These items are priced as high as the market will bear. If they raised the price to $2000/ board a slim few would still pay it, but not enough to keep the doors open. At 800-1200 they are selling enough and maintaining a solid base.

Same thing with boats, as long as they are able to sell every boat they can produce there is absolutely 0 reason to even contemplate lowering prices. Malibu is a premium product the fact that you can buy a lower quality, less featured, boat for 1/2 the price is not relevant.

Will the Cadillac dealer lower the price of the CTSV because you can buy a chevy with crank windows, vinyl interior and no radio for 70% less. No they will tell you enjoy your Chevy. ..

Also remember boats fall into the luxury category, as much as some of us think we could not live without one. They are not a necessity. When you take a luxury segment, and further divide it, performance sport boats for example. This now takes a small segment and makes it even smaller. Then within that category you have a very small total market. Malibu claims 30% market share, they produce 3000 boats per year total...Malibu, Ride and Axis combined. So when you have a customer base that small, you give them what they want. Big touch screens, blinged out trailer's, etc

I think you have a different understanding of the word "value" than I do.

Your Soulcraft example doesn't register with me, sorry. I bought a $200 CWB in 2006 and I'm still riding it. It's never held my progression back one iota. It's had a TON of value for me. An $800 board has zero value to me, as awesome as some of those boards are.

I thought we were talking about the direction of boat design/pricing in general? My point was there are still value/core boats in the market if that what someone is looking for.

I think what you are missing is that Harley had a low cost / high value line of bike that did not sell (Buell). It dragged down their profits, so they sold/ditched it. If the Sportster did not sell, they would ditch it as well. Probably same reason Malibu is ditching the V-Ride. With all the manufactures combined, only around 8000 units are produced. Just simple lack of demand.

First off, the Vride isn't selling because it costs 65k. That's like Harley pricing the Sportster at 20k.

And you're saying Malibu doesn't make any money when someone orders a Vride? Hmmm. Or you're saying there's not as much profit margin?

Think Harley makes as much on a Sportster as they do on a custom UltraGlide?

Harley embraced the luxury market and still makes and sells affordable QUALITY bikes to their "other" customer base.. Malibu's isn't doing that.

And I find it hilarious you guys are like "eehhhh, go buy a Supreme". Oh, ok.

Also think it's pretty telling that even Afun, a guy who bought a brand new VLX last year is scratching his head on pricing.

Anyway......I'm off to ride behind my cute little Vride.......on my $200 board

Edited July 15, 2014 by -BS-

[85 Barefoot]

Prime example....

The closets centurion dealer in the Portland metro area is 1.5 hr drive each way.

I happen to know the local Supreme dealer and they regularly service UNDER WARRANTY several Centurions . It's the shear convenience factor for owners.

I have NEVER heard of Malibu providing or even offering anything of this sort. They got butthurt even at the mention of Bakes servicing a Malibu .....whom is now an Axis dealer.

ehh, is it the same? If a BMW dealer will service a mini with mini factory support if there's no close dealer (which makes sense) is it really the same as a mini dealer servicing a BMW across town from a BMW dealer?

Let's face it, if Centurion had a dealer in Portland, they would let Rick know their gripes if the Supreme dealer was doing their work.

...but soon they'll all be cross-dealers anyway so that example will soon be moot.

[Lakenut]

This thread has been an interesting read for sure. I guess I fit into the crowd that can't imagine paying 6 figures for a toy that will get used less that half of the year (dang you that live in warmer climates ) I have often wondered how many new Malibus, MCs, CCs(and boats in general) are being financed for long terms vs how many drive off the showroom paid for.

My 01 was bought new in 02...so it is turning 12 this year. I can't imagine still having payments left on it.

[Deven]

That's a great point. The VLX at $78-80k was a hell of a value looking back to '13. If it really does creep up to $95-100k as the rumors have it then I think you're right.

I guess the unknown is what upgrades they are making to justify the increase. But, I think they will sell less volume regardless. If it's G21 v VLX at a similar price point and performance, fine. But both are then out of my range.

And Malibu will actually not have a boat that is in my range if this is really how it goes. (Other than the VTX I already have). That'd be a bummer.

Oh well, the market will either absorb it or reject it. All of us hacks will probably find a way to stay on the water.

If you want to take this a step further, the MSRP on my 2012 VLX was 74K. That is big jump in 3 years.

[Bawshogg]

Ehhhh, correct me if I am wrong, but Malibu and Axis are from the same nut too right?

I know for a fact they don't want or won't support the Axis dealer for warranty repairs on a Malibu, even one out of warranty. They just don't want to be THAT helpfull.

[bcoppess23]

MSRP on my 2011 23' LSV - 104k

MSRP on my 2014 VLX - 106k

Both optioned within a few things of each other ('11 had extra board racks, '14 has heater, color wrapped dash, ptm windshield mirror, surfgate, PNP) Of course, that is not what I paid for them. From 2010 when I purchased the LSV to 2014 for the VLX, the vlx is now more than what I paid for a bigger boat with very similar features.

[Tims]

I think you have a different understanding of the word "value" than I do.

Your Soulcraft example doesn't register with me, sorry. I bought a $200 CWB in 2006 and I'm still riding it. It's never held my progression back one iota. It's had a TON of value for me. An $800 board has zero value to me, as awesome as some of those boards are.

First off, the Vride isn't selling because it costs 65k. That's like Harley pricing the Sportster at 20k.

And you're saying Malibu doesn't make any money when someone orders a Vride? Hmmm. Or you're saying there's not as much profit margin?

Think Harley makes as much on a Sportster as they do on a custom UltraGlide?

Harley embraced the luxury market and still makes and sells affordable QUALITY bikes to their "other" customer base.. Malibu's isn't doing that.

And I find it hilarious you guys are like "eehhhh, go buy a Supreme". Oh, ok.

Also think it's pretty telling that even Afun, a guy who bought a brand new VLX last year is scratching his head on pricing.

Anyway......I'm off to ride behind my cute little Vride.......on my $200 board

My dealer sat on his V-Rides for a long time, and the last 21ft one he has was selling in the low 50's. They did not sell because no one gave them a second look. Dealer would not order any more as he did not want the inventory sitting around. If dealers don't order Malibu wont build them.

Harley on the other hand, does indeed sell Sportsters, and then takes them back on trade a year later to sell the same person a flashy Ultra.

[Afun]

If you want to take this a step further, the MSRP on my 2012 VLX was 74K. That is big jump in 3 years.

Its too much of a jump...if its true. Thats why I'm scratching my head. Why should I ever upgrade, besides the fact I will be in a shiny new boat. Bottom line...the market is leaving me behind. I got lucky and got into a well priced VLX with Surfgate. It had been mechanically flawless for 135 hours and I got a gnarly wave. What could a new overpriced VLX have in store for me to make me upgrade? This thread is not about me, but just listing an example. Maybe down the line, I will be in the market for a new Vride with surfgate on it.

[Tims]

MSRP on my 2011 23' LSV - 104k

MSRP on my 2014 VLX - 106k

Both optioned within a few things of each other ('11 had extra board racks, '14 has heater, color wrapped dash, ptm windshield mirror, surfgate, PNP) Of course, that is not what I paid for them. From 2010 when I purchased the LSV to 2014 for the VLX, the vlx is now more than what I paid for a bigger boat with very similar features.

MSRP on my 2012 VLX was $94k

[Cory]

There are so many options on these boats. Maybe one of you is including the factory boat show discount and the other is not. Without the actual build sheets its really hard to compare.

[Afun]

^^^^ yes...msrp on mine was 104k I think

[Tims]

^^^^ yes...msrp on mine was 104k I think

Afun,

I bet Brett could get you out of your VLX and into a 15 VLX or even LSV without that much of a hit if you were really in the market because of some cool feature on the new models that you liked. You never know the pricing until you are serious about inking the deal.

But I agree that you have a pretty sweet set-up right now.

[Deven]

I'm holding the factory invoice for my boat. 59K (including trailer and Wetsounds upgrades)

[Afun]

Afun,

I bet Brett could get you out of your VLX and into a 15 VLX or even LSV without that much of a hit if you were really in the market because of some cool feature on the new models that you liked. You never know the pricing until you are serious about inking the deal.

But I agree that you have a pretty sweet set-up right now.

Yes...I agree that it may be even easier than I think to get me into a new VLX with all the new goodies, lol....Our salesman just ordered a Charcoal Flake with Metallic Yellow LSV...New Colors!!

[bamabonners]

Is this a guess or do you have this on good info? If I trade in for a '15 VLX (which it must fit in my garages without significant monkey business for me to do it), I'm expecting to fork out another $30 to $35k (including tax). But, I also would upgrade to the LS3 and maybe purchase a few other additional upgrades (heated seat, clamping racks (if their issues have been resolved), and perhaps this new G4 tower). I may be optimistic on the pricing...

Fwiw, I paid 65k for my 2011 vlx with tons of metallic, bling trailer, stereo, etc.... They have gone up every year with the only major thing changing since then is surfgate. crazy....

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[bamabonners]

My dealer sat on his V-Rides for a long time, and the last 21ft one he has was selling in the low 50's. They did not sell because no one gave them a second look. Dealer would not order any more as he did not want the inventory sitting around. If dealers don't order Malibu wont build them.

Harley on the other hand, does indeed sell Sportsters, and then takes them back on trade a year later to sell the same person a flashy Ultra.

Dealers aren't pushing the vRide. They pushed the wakesetter. My guess is because they weren't making the profit on them. In return, Malibu wasn't filling many orders for them so they dumped them.

No doubt that the vRide had a great hull and coujd perform for anybody from beginner to pro.

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