Jabsco Pump and MLS

[2011vtxny]

Does anyone know if it's possible to wire in the Jabsco Ballast Puppy Reversible Pump into the MLS?

I know that the MLS typically runs low amp pumps but wasn't sure if there was a way to tie it in for my project of adding on a bow ballast bag.

[Murphy8166]

I wouldn't. There is a significant amperage pull difference b/t aearator pump and reversible pump.

The correct way to do this would be to run 12 awg power and ground from battery or from under the dash, from the main wiring areas and fuse them based on mfgr reccomendations.

[TallRedRider]

What he said.

I have done it and have found it to be very rewarding.

[2011vtxny]

I have a very elementary understanding of proper wiring above typical home outlets and switches but in theory coudln't you run a relay to the MLS that controls the switch for pump and drain of the Jabsco?

I'm sure I'll end up doing it the easy way but I'm kind of into the neat setup (and I'm paranoid that my 4 year old will accidentally bump the fill or drain switch when I'm not right there...)

[Chia]

I wouldn't. There is a significant amperage pull difference b/t aearator pump and reversible pump.

The correct way to do this would be to run 12 awg power and ground from battery or from under the dash, from the main wiring areas and fuse them based on mfgr reccomendations.

do you fill and drain thru the inlet?

[Murphy8166]

The area of concern is the wire gauge. What you currently have for the aerator is not heavy enough to carry the load needed to run a reversible.

You are asking for trouble trying to pull that much current through the existing wiring and fusing.

You have a 60k dollar boat on your hands and it sound like some precious cargo (ie....4 year old). For the extra time and minimal investment you can do it right and ensure that you will not be damaging the current MLS setup nor putting your boat or family in jeopardy due to an electrical mishap.

It is really simple. There is a big ground bus bar up underneath the dash and a big positive power bus bar in the area behind the throttle. You can run your 12 gauge power an ground for each pump from there. Mount your switches in the area over by the throttle and then run you 12 gauge to your pumps. With a little forward planning and patience you can make it look really clean (split loom, screwed cable ties, heat shrink.....etc)

[2011vtxny]

Thanks Murphy. This is the direction I'll go I was just curious if it had ever been attempted. I'm venting the bag so worst case scenario, if she hits the switch, there won't be a rupture.

[Nitrousbird]

What gauge of wire is currently feeding the center aerator pump? The reversible pump needs 12awg wire. I would also recommend saving some money and going with the Johnson pump.

Though the instructions for the reversible pump call for a 25 amp breaker/fuse, I have discovered that is overkill. I have a pump on a 15 amp breaker and have never popped it once, even after multiple and consuctive drain/fills.

If the wire gauge is not sufficient, I would either run a seperate wire to the main panel or relay it, depending on what makes sense for your planned setup.

Edited May 31, 2012 by Nitrousbird

[a92harley92]

I have a very elementary understanding of proper wiring above typical home outlets and switches but in theory coudln't you run a relay to the MLS that controls the switch for pump and drain of the Jabsco?

I'm sure I'll end up doing it the easy way but I'm kind of into the neat setup (and I'm paranoid that my 4 year old will accidentally bump the fill or drain switch when I'm not right there...)

Does your MLS have a bow option? I'm guessing it does.

If so, then yes... you can run relays from the MLS. You will need 2 relays for each pump (a fill relay and a drain relay). You need 2 relays because you need to reverse the polarity on the impeller pump to get it to go in reverse. The question is... Is the wiring already there for the bow pumps? If so... then you will use that wiring to drive the relay coils. You will have to run some bigger wire to drive the pump (12 gauge as Murphy suggested) from under the helm. Use fuses for your 12 gauge wire.

[cowwboy]

I'd personally do it like harley said. Don't mess with the factory wiring and just tie the outputs of the mls to two relay coils and bam your done.

You could build a nice package controller on the bench and only then mount the relays and land your wires. It always looks better when you build it on the bench.

[Murphy8166]

So how do you seperate filling the tank from the bag if you are not adding in another switch.

I prefer to have independent control of each for isolated function

[skibreeze]

I have a very elementary understanding of proper wiring above typical home outlets and switches but in theory coudln't you run a relay to the MLS that controls the switch for pump and drain of the Jabsco?

I'm sure I'll end up doing it the easy way but I'm kind of into the neat setup (and I'm paranoid that my 4 year old will accidentally bump the fill or drain switch when I'm not right there...)

Yes, it is common to use relays to control higher amperage loads.

[a92harley92]

So how do you seperate filling the tank from the bag if you are not adding in another switch.

I prefer to have independent control of each for isolated function

I agree.

When I responded... I first thought he was adding a bag to the rear lockers. Had everything typed up for that and then I read the OP again and realized he was adding a bag to the bow. So I re-typed a response for adding a bag in the bow (without an existing bow tank). However, now that I look at it... it's really not clear what he is doing.

So...If you're putting a bag in the bow (where a tank would normally go), then I would go through the MLS (with relays). If you're adding a bag to an existing tank, then I would have independent controls (as Murphy suggested). However, if you're adding a bag to put on top of the seats, then I would go manual.

Let us know what configuration you have now and what you want to do.

[2011vtxny]

My setup in question is for adding a bow sack in lieu of purchasing a hard tank from the dealer as my boat currently doesn't have any weight (besides my anchor) in the front.

My MLS has a function that is currently turned off for the bow fill so I'd assume that it has the capability. After looking under the helm I found that there are two loose wires with some form of fitting on them. I'll do some more research to find out whether or not they are for the bow or not.

Now that this discussion has taken off what type of relay would be required for this? I have a Jabsco Ballast Puppy on the way so my wiring setup would be power from battery to helm, into relay and then tied into MLS?

Thanks for the help!

[nuttyskier2002]

^{For anyone who is interested I have developed a system that works in conjunction with the MLS system in my 2006 Vride. It uses a single Jabsco reversible pump to replace the 4 centrifigul pumps that Malibu uses. It also uses 6 solenoid controlled water valves configured in a manifold setup and a control module made from a circuit board with 3 relays and 6 diodes. This eliminates the need to go under the seat cushions and manually open/close the valves in the bilge. It also allow you to transfer water from one side to the other without taking water in or discharging overboard (not sure yet if this part will be as benefitial as the other). All parts can be purchased at local Radio Shack, Auto parts and hardware stores. I will be installing this system very soon and will post results of how it works.}

[West Coast Rider]

Nutty, I'm curious to see a hydraulic / electric schematic for the system you designed. How many ballast tank system are you controlling with the one reversible pump?

[nuttyskier2002]

Just the two in the rear lockers. I didn't mention this in the post above but the reversible pump is only used in one direction in this setup.

[cowwboy]

You would just use two normal double pole single throw relay's.

Wire the fill pump wires from your mls to a "fill" relay coil. The outpuit of that relay will power the impellar pump to fill.

Wire the empty pump wires from the mls to a "empty" relay coil. The output of that relay will be opposite of the fill relay.

The heavier gauge wiring from your fused source would go on to the Normally open and common connectors of each relay.

On the "fill" relay the positive would go to common 1 and the negative to common 2, on the "empty" the positive would go to common 2 and the negative to common 1.

You can tie the normally open of both relays together and from there to the pump.

I know it sounds complicated and if work would get my dang autocad to work I could draw you up a diagram.

Once wired it is very simple.

[a92harley92]

My setup in question is for adding a bow sack in lieu of purchasing a hard tank from the dealer as my boat currently doesn't have any weight (besides my anchor) in the front.

My MLS has a function that is currently turned off for the bow fill so I'd assume that it has the capability. After looking under the helm I found that there are two loose wires with some form of fitting on them. I'll do some more research to find out whether or not they are for the bow or not.

Now that this discussion has taken off what type of relay would be required for this? I have a Jabsco Ballast Puppy on the way so my wiring setup would be power from battery to helm, into relay and then tied into MLS?

Thanks for the help!

You want to use 12VDC relays that have a contact rating of at least 12VDC @ 20 Amps... preferably higher. You can find relays, harnesses, and in-line fuse holders on Amazon at a decent price.

http://www.amazon.co...38575248&sr=8-5

If you go with SPDT (Single Pole Double Throw) relays you can wire it like this:

You can also do the DPST relays as cowwboy suggested.

Edited June 1, 2012 by a92harley92

[2011vtxny]

I came across this very same setup while doing my research. If the draw from the pump maxes out at 20a would you suggest a 20a fuse as mentioned in the diagram?

Now I just need to confirm I found the correct lines from the MLS.

Thanks for the diagram. Looks awesome.

[a92harley92]

I came across this very same setup while doing my research. If the draw from the pump maxes out at 20a would you suggest a 20a fuse as mentioned in the diagram?

Now I just need to confirm I found the correct lines from the MLS.

Thanks for the diagram. Looks awesome.

The Jabsco literature says it has a 12 Amp draw and to use a 20 Amp fuse. Your (total) wire run length will determine your wire size. By "total" I mean from the positive post of your battery (or bus bar) to the motor and then back to the ground post (or bus bar).

[nuttyskier2002]

My setup is a little different and I believe it accomplishes a different task. The drawing above is used to be able to run the pump in either forward or reverse. My setup only runs the pump in one direction only. My boat does not use a control module that Harley has in his. My boat is a Vride and just has the "bare bones" MLS system. The aerator fill pumps leak water from the sacks back out to the lake so i wanted to control that without having to lift seat cushions and turn on/off the manual water valves. Also with this setup I can fill left and right independently or fill both together. I can also transfer from one side to the other without pumping water from the lake or discharging.

The system uses 6 solenoid water valves (3 on the intake side of the pump and 3 on the discharge). Two of the valves on the intake side (of the pump) are for pumping down the bags (one for each). The 3rd is for suction from the lake. On the discharge side of the pump... 2 valves are for filling the bags (again one each) and the 3rd is for overboard discharge. The module that controls the water valves has three relays. One is just used to power the pump. The other two (one each) control the intake and discharge water valves. And there is a matrix of diodes used to isolate power from backfeeding into circuits/switches that are not being used. This allows full functionality on all factory MLS swithes as they operate the same as before....but does away with 4 aerator pumps as the single Jabsco pump serves the purpose of all.

We wiil see if fill/empty times are reduced but that wasn't my main goal. We do a lot of wake surfing and I got tired of asking people to move so i can get under the seat and hand operate the water valves in the bilge.

I will try to get a drawing posted soon if anyone is still interested.

Edited June 1, 2012 by nuttyskier2002

[West Coast Rider]

Nutty please do post an electrical and hydraulic diagram. I'm interested in what you have done. It sounds interesting to not have to flip manual gate valves.

[nuttyskier2002]

So far my drawing is only sketched out on paper. I will try to draw it out in soft copy and upload. May take me a few days. I can see where Harley reversible circuit would be hand too. But for my particular application and what I wanted to accomplish....this works for me.

[nuttyskier2002]

Hey Rider, who are the chicks in your profile pic? Is that body paint?