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TJP

Quick Thermostat Question

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TJP

My winterization process is basically as follows: Run engine using garden hose to get engine up to temp, drain all hoses, plugs and sensors, run engine again using FlushPro, bucket of A/F and an old bilge pump. However, I am always concerned that the thermostat will close back up before I can get the A/F through the system. As such, I was planning on pouring some A/F directly into the engine prior running it with the FlushPro/bucket 'o' Antifreeze combo (extra piece of mind step).

Question: Where would you suggest I add the A/F so that the state of the thermostat is not a concern? My though was that if I add through the heater feed line (top of intake manifold, astern of the thermostat housing, slightly starboard), I will bypass the thermostat completely. Am I anywhere near correct on this? I guess what I'm asking is, will a closed thermostat allow some 'blow-by' anyway, therefore a non-issue, or does it close the system entirely. I hope this made some sense. Thanks in advance.

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SunriseH2OSkier
My though was that if I add through the heater feed line (top of intake manifold, astern of the thermostat housing, slightly starboard), I will bypass the thermostat completely.

That's what I do. I've got a quick connect in line in the heater supply hose, then I rigged a funnel with a mating quick connect. Works perfectly.

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Pistol Pete

TJP,

I really think you're going overboard with adding the A/F.

As long as you completely drain the block, manifolds, and heater system, there is no reason to add antifreeze. Draining all of these areas gets out a lot of water. Whatever is left inside will have so much room to expand when and if it freezes that it's not a concern.

BTW, I think it's a bad idea to let the engine run and get nice and hot and then suddenly drain out all of the water in the system. Once any engine is turned off it goes into a heat soak mode. This means that since there is no coolant flowing through the engine any more, the engine will become approx. 20 degrees warmer while it is sitting.

If there's suddenly no coolant/water in there to allow the heat to dissipate, bad things might happen. Just my two cents. I'm an ex-car mechanic.

But, to answer your question. If the engine is good and hot, the t-stat will stay open for approx. 10 mins. So, you've got about 10 mins. to get your A/F in there.

Edited by Pistol Pete

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VinRLX
Once any engine is turned off it goes into a heat soak mode. This means that since there is no coolant flowing through the engine any more, the engine will become approx. 20 degrees warmer while it is sitting.

Probably not too much of an issue when it's 40° outside. Biggrin.gif

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M3Fan
TJP,

I really think you're going overboard with adding the A/F.

As long as you completely drain the block, manifolds, and heater system, there is no reason to add antifreeze. Draining all of these areas gets out a lot of water. Whatever is left inside will have so much room to expand when and if it freezes that it's not a concern.

BTW, I think it's a bad idea to let the engine run and get nice and hot and then suddenly drain out all of the water in the system. Once any engine is turned off it goes into a heat soak mode. This means that since there is no coolant flowing through the engine any more, the engine will become approx. 20 degrees warmer while it is sitting.

If there's suddenly no coolant/water in there to allow the heat to dissipate, bad things might happen. Just my two cents. I'm an ex-car mechanic.

But, to answer your question. If the engine is good and hot, the t-stat will stay open for approx. 10 mins. So, you've got about 10 mins. to get your A/F in there.

I agree completely... I can't tell you how many boaters who I have talked to who are like "when she's got pink stuff coming out the exhaust I shut her down"... HELLO, the exhaust runs on a BYPASS SYSTEM ... you could have NO AF in the block and still have AF coming out the exhaust. DUHHH. Probably 9/10 boaters don't understand this concept. I say screw the AF- just drain that baby. AF invites errors and is needless overkill.

Edited by M3Fan

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88Skier

I've always used anti freeze. We get occational temps of -35. What I'm considering now after all these years is, is it better to drain the anti freeze after I've filled the engine? The point of the antifreeze is to protect from water that might be trapped. Draining the antifreeze would protect from the unlikely event of the anti freeze freezing.

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jgouveia3

get FWC - no worries for us New Englanders!!

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TJP

Pete - Excellent point on the 'heat soak mode'. I had noticed this on the temp gauge numerous times (after water had been drained) on many different boats and always wondered if it could cause damage.

88Skier - I know the A/F drain or not to drain has been covered many times on this board. I just like the added corrosion protection (I use the automotive green stuff). The boat actually sits in a somewhat heated garage over the winter. However, if I ever lost power or heat during a storm, and damage occurred, I'd never forgive myself.

I've seen local marinas do their engine winterizing two ways, and plan to model my method as such:

1) Run engine on water through FlushPro up to temp to open t-stat. Switch over to bucket 'o' A/F and run engine until A/F comes out the exhaust. Shut down and leave A/F- water mixture in engine. They will usually then test the A/F that was expelled out the exhaust to judge it's freeze protection. If it's over -30 C, good to go.

2) Drain all raw water from cold block/hoses/accessories. Place a large bucket of mixed A/F and water (50/50 or better) beneath the exhaust ports. Run an old bilge pump from the exhaust bucket up to the FlushPro and start the engine. Let engine run atleast up to temp (5 minutes or so) to ensure t-stat opens. At this point, the mixture in the exhaust bucket is starting to get hot. After all, it is being heated repeatedly as it circulates. They then shut the engine down and leave A/F in. I have seen temp gauges start to creep above the 160 mark (do to warm water recirculating) but they always shut things down well before 180.

Apologies for the long post. Unnaturally quiet at work this morning. Yahoo.gif

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HRemington

Harsh winters are not my problem here, but I still winterize like a yankee...just 'cause. I do run til up to operating temp, then add the pink anitfreeze, then drain, so no worries after that. I know it's not necessary, but neither are the many other anal things we do for our boats, and the extra $10 outlay is really not a big deal. I keep telling myself that if nothing else, I'm kind of giving the engine a good flushing out and then adding some corrosion protection while it sits through the cold, damp winter here.

Pete, does the pink stuff really add any corrosion protection, or is there a product that does?

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vette-ski

Don't worry about how long the stat stays open. I ran mine up to temp, fogged it untill is died, then started draining and adding A/F. It was probably half hour or more before I got to the A/F, so I know the stat was closed. I just poured into the heater hose on top of the manifold and it found it's way to the block. If you doubt, leave the block plug out and you will see pink stuff run out.

Now on to the drain the A/F vs. leave it in debate. I left all of mine in, but I know others that drain it. I didn't worry about what I did until I did the A/F in the freezer test. I put some of the -50 degree pink stuff right out of the jug into my freezer and after a week, well it's not liquid any more. It's not solid ice, so I'm sure nothing would crack, but it's more solid than I was expecting for being in a freezer probably running somewhere around zero. I would say it all looked crystalized, with no liquid consistancy at all. I need to check the temp of the freezer, but it has me wondering if I should drain it. Has anyone in cold northern climates had a problem keeping an engine full of -50 pink stuff?

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TJP

I have always been under the assumption that the pink stuff has no corrosion inhibitors. As a matter of fact, the pink stuff I see on the shelves around here states right on the label: "Not for use in gasoline or diesel cast iron engines".

I have always used the green automotive stuff. It's made for cast iron blocks. Yes, it's more expensive, however: 1) I water it down to a 50/50 or 60/40 mix so I don't have to buy as much, I re-bottle my exhausted leftovers for next season (I usually only have to buy an extra gallon or so each fall), I can always find some on sale at Costco or Walmart.

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88Skier
I have always been under the assumption that the pink stuff has no corrosion inhibitors.  As a matter of fact, the pink stuff I see on the shelves around here states right on the label:  "Not for use in gasoline or diesel cast iron engines".

I have always used the green automotive stuff.  It's made for cast iron blocks.  Yes, it's more expensive, however: 1) I water it down to a 50/50 or 60/40 mix so I don't have to buy as much, I re-bottle my exhausted leftovers for next season (I usually only have to buy an extra gallon or so each fall), I can always find some on sale at Costco or Walmart.

I used to use that stuff until I read that 1 gal pollutes 750,000 gallons of water. Surprised.gif

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TJP

Wow... that's a nasty number! Not to worry, I drain/flush it all out before heading off to the water in the spring. I imagine I would do the same thing if I ran the pink stuff... just in case.

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Pistol Pete

Hank,

I think the majority if the corrosion happens while the boat is getting it's normal use. Filling the engine with A/F just for the winter while the boat is down probably isn't doing anything to prevent corrosion. I got to admit that when I think it's gonna be awhile before I take my boat out again, I flush the engine with fake a lake. If you think about it, the last time the baot was run was right in the shallow waters of the launch ramp. This water is usually FULL of sediment.

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