I Can't Get Up On The Skinny Ski

[bobofthenorth]

Power is not an issue, I thnk it is more that my drivers use the same amount of power as when I am on the Bertha ski. More power quicker may be just the ticket.

I weigh 225 and I'm on a Triumph so I'm no lightweight but the ski isn't really skinny. It isn't barn-door wide either. What works for us in the power department is for mama to roll the power on firmly until the throttle is completely buried. She doesn't just slam it wide open but she goes fairly quickly and she goes right into the basement. She holds it there until I plane out and then pulls it back to let PP take over. When I get pulled behind a new driver the hardest thing to teach him usually is just how hard he has to pull me. We have a four blade and a Monsoon that tops out at about 42 MPH at 5400 RPM.

[Baddog]

Skied today with Weinrdog (Thanks a bunch WD) on an HO Charger. This ski is a lot narrower than my Big Bertha but wider than the Phantom Truth I want to learn to get up on. Based on today's results though I would definitely say that my drivers in the past have not been feeding enough coal, quick enough. I hope to give it a go on the skinny ski again with new instructions to my ski buds next weekend..

[Baddog]

Oh I see. You're in the area, but you won't come up and ski with me.

That's all right, I'm good, I'll get over it, no worries......

I will and I look forward to it but Weinrdog was a little bit closer. Oh, now I am being picky. Definitely, GT I would love to come all that way. I'll pm you next time I am in Cincy for the weekend.

Edited August 9, 2009 by Baddog

[NorCaliBu]

Do yourself a favor and go ski with GT. I had the opportunity to ski with Bill once when he was out on my end of the country and he gave me a couple of pointers that helped my skiing more than anything else that I have done. I'm now running 22 off / 34 mph consistently and have made 28 off / 34 mph a few times...could not have done it without the advice from Bill.

[Sunsetter95]

Ok, I have an HO triumph 69, I started with it at a heavy 230 and could get up but with a lot of struggling. I knew I was not in good shape so I did something about it. I am now 195 and can almost get up holding on with just one hand, almost. The weight loss and getting in shape made a huge difference. I did three sets going about 1-2 miles each. before I was doing only one at 1 mile. I don't have a course available to ski on to compare but being in shape is the key.

I am also 53 now. P90X.... it works.

Edited August 9, 2009 by Sunsetter95

[Baddog]

Ok, I have an HO triumph 96, I started with it at a heavy 230 and could get up but with a lot of struggling. I knew I was not in good shape so I did something about it. I am now 195 and can almost get up holding on with just one hand, almost. The weight loss and getting in shape made a huge difference. I did three sets going about 1-2 miles each. before I was doing only one at 1 mile. I don't have a course available to ski on to compare but being in shape is the key.

I am also 53 now. P90X.... it works.

Good for you on the weight loss. What's the scoop on P90X?

[Sunsetter95]

Ok, I have an HO triumph 69, I started with it at a heavy 230 and could get up but with a lot of struggling. I knew I was not in good shape so I did something about it. I am now 195 and can almost get up holding on with just one hand, almost. The weight loss and getting in shape made a huge difference. I did three sets going about 1-2 miles each. before I was doing only one at 1 mile. I don't have a course available to ski on to compare but being in shape is the key.

I am also 53 now. P90X.... it works.

Good for you on the weight loss. What's the scoop on P90X?

It is an extreme workout that doesn't need a lot of equipment to do. Search P90X or go to beachbody.com. 90 days and if you stick with it, you will be in great shape for skiing. Just make sure you are in good enough health to do the extreme work out. At my age I can now do sets of 20 push-ups and sets of 8-10 pull-ups through the workouts. Before I was lucky to do 5 and 2 respectively.

Edited August 9, 2009 by Sunsetter95

[jjackkrash]

Ok, I have an HO triumph 69, I started with it at a heavy 230 and could get up but with a lot of struggling. I knew I was not in good shape so I did something about it. I am now 195 and can almost get up holding on with just one hand, almost. The weight loss and getting in shape made a huge difference. I did three sets going about 1-2 miles each. before I was doing only one at 1 mile. I don't have a course available to ski on to compare but being in shape is the key.

I am also 53 now. P90X.... it works.

That's outstanding! I need to try something. I've gotten a tiny bit heavier every week now since May. That has to stop.

I've been watching the wx channel a little bit (noticed you're in AZ), I'll bet its nice being 35lbs lighter now that AZ is on par with the surface of the sun

GT: Skip the P90X and get one of these:

http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/d...PD&pid=1006

EliteFTS is in Ohio so you could save the shipping. 40 mins., three times a week and you can have an extra piece of pie.

[Baddog]

GT: Skip the P90X and get one of these:

http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/d...PD&pid=1006

EliteFTS is in Ohio so you could save the shipping. 40 mins., three times a week and you can have an extra piece of pie.

One of these?!?

Dude I like the way you think.

Only three times a week?

Edited August 10, 2009 by Baddog

[Sunsetter95]

Ok, I have an HO triumph 69, I started with it at a heavy 230 and could get up but with a lot of struggling. I knew I was not in good shape so I did something about it. I am now 195 and can almost get up holding on with just one hand, almost. The weight loss and getting in shape made a huge difference. I did three sets going about 1-2 miles each. before I was doing only one at 1 mile. I don't have a course available to ski on to compare but being in shape is the key.

I am also 53 now. P90X.... it works.

That's outstanding! I need to try something. I've gotten a tiny bit heavier every week now since May. That has to stop.

I've been watching the wx channel a little bit (noticed you're in AZ), I'll bet its nice being 35lbs lighter now that AZ is on par with the surface of the sun

Yea, it's a dry heat! July was pretty hot for us, but I would rather be hot then in Ohio in Jan or Feb. I use to live in Toledo. When I use to drive truck for a food service company, I could get into the zero degree freezer to warm up, had drifts break over the hood out in the country delivering to the schools, and the rain and bugs.... had enough! A month or two of hot is way easier to take.

Tony Horton also has a 10 min trainer that is suppose to get good results also. Check it out also. Me, I'm sticking with what I am doing, it works!

[GreenMan]

I'm 54, skiing for about 10 years. Love it! About 200lbs, have a Jobe Edge 67", LFF rope on right.

Anyway, went through a few spells of real difficulty getting up. Wondered why it seemed like I could pull one of my freinds up on a piece of cotton - turns out he starts with back foot out of the ski. Means that with the back leg stuck out behind you, your ski, your torso and your back leg are all at the same sort of angle leaning forward in the water and all of those bits are automatically create 'lift' as soon as the boat starts to pull. Completely removes the tendancy for your torso area, surrounded by your arms, from daming all that water and acting like a sea anchor. At least, that's how it seemed to me... For me it has been fantastic.

So, lean forward, handle out in front over the tip of the ski, chest on front knee, push back leg back behind. Hold the ski forward with your front foot (so that you don't go over the front of it) until the ski is planing then poke your back foot in the RTP. Took me a few days to get it sorted and fluent.

Might not suit everyone and no good with double boots(!) but this old bloke's in love with it!

I can hardly believe what a difference it's made. Even if you topple over and miss the start, you've expended such a small amount of energy trying, it's no problem to have a few goes and does not tear your arms off.

Edited August 11, 2009 by GreenMan

[jjackkrash]

GT: Skip the P90X and get one of these:

http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/d...PD&pid=1006

EliteFTS is in Ohio so you could save the shipping. 40 mins., three times a week and you can have an extra piece of pie.

One of these?!?

Dude I like the way you think.

Only three times a week?

I'm thinking 3 times a day until dead.

I was referring to the standard sled without upgrades. If you guys think that you can handle and afford the deluxe model, more power to you.

[ricar116]

The skinney ski has less surface area and will require the boat to do more work. You will be accelerating slower..drug further until you reach a higher planing speed. Planing speed is faster on the skinny skis...less surface area. Planing speed higher + smaller surface area + big skier = boat doing a lot more work. If your getting up on your fat ski with no problem were you full of fuel or low on fuel. On the skinny ski were you full of fuel or low on fuel. My 71 Triumph (wide body) will be planed befor I hit the swirl with average fuel . I am 6"6" and 230 #. My 69 Senate (skinny ski) is a hard long pull to get up when low on fuel and very challenging to say the least with full fuel. I am old and don't drag as eagerly as I used to. I contacted Malibu and told them we deepwater start the lsv told them my weight, typical boat load, and current prop set up and asked if there was a downside to taking out some prop pitch. He chuckled and thought I was asking alot from the prop I have. He suggested dropping some pitch and adding some diameter. I went to thier recomended high altitude prop specs for my 23 lsv wakesetter. Said the prop he recomended is a real stump puller and should make the boat accelerate quicker under the heavier loads. I will lose top end, but I dont use top end anyway. I am waiting on the prop now will tell you how it goes. If you are satisfied with your technique and you are just not reaching planing speed fast enough, and you believe the slow planing and lenght of pull is keeping you down you may want to consider your prop setup. I think enerything is designed around the average 167 pound human being. Good luck Rick

Told you I would give you an update. I am 6"5" 230 and was on my Triumph not my skinny ski. Went from the 17 pitch Acme 381 (23 LSV) to the High Altitude spec 14 1/2" pitch Acme 1235. Wow!!! It popped me up like I was on two skis... no dragging at alll I would highly reccomend this for you big slalom guys. My wife was driving and couldn't believe the difference. She wanted to know why they didn't put the prop on originally. I said the original prop was just a good all around prop. My RPM increased at 32 from 3500 to 3825 didn't check top end but would guess loss of 2 MPH to 41. Wished I would have repropped it last year. Oh Ya and the wake was flatter.

Rick

[david_t_hill]

So I know this is an age old post and all sorts of tricks have been discussed, but I struggled for the second morning this week to get up with a new driver, and I am pretty pissed about it. I tend to do best when someone slowly increases the throttle, but that said Im still pretty finnicky, and its annoying to me and the drivers. How do people get out by pegging the throttle? I need to be more flexible to drivers. I am 6'3 ~195lbs skiing on an old connelly attack with double boots. My upper body is fairly stout, but sitting on pair of chicken legs. Any suggestions? I've had this problem for years, and its preventing me from progressing as a skiier, not to mention it ruined my weekend before it started, since I have to go out of town and wont be able to redeem myself till sunday night.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[davemac]

Here is a current thread going on.... help getting up

and another older thread specific to double boots double boot start

Edited July 15, 2011 by davemac

[Sixball]

I am thinking you are missing something small. The driver will also have a big effect on your success.

when you are ready to go put your head down between your arms. have 9+ inches of your ski out of the water. Do not hold it striate up and down. Have a tilt, tip to the boat. as you start have the driver give you about two seconds of moderate throttle and then add power quickly. As you start to move point your tows down in the bindings this will make you push the tip down and forward. Keep your legs sucked up you can stand any time after the ski gets on plane.

Radar and straight line have gloves out that will help the grip. Like the old clinchers .... Called Vice & MASTERLINE PRO LOCK GLOVE

[HollieMac]

WHOA - that wasn't where I was going at all.

I float like a brick. If I wear a slim form fitting jacket I barely float and I have the perfect devil of a time keeping any ski out of the water. That in turn makes my starts really hard. If I wear a jacket that floats me higher it makes a huge difference.

You are right on there, brick man. Put some barefoot shorts on, anything that will float your body higher--really makes a diff.

If you keep your knees in your chest and hold against the pull on the handle, you can let the boat pull you up. You just have to tough it out one second more than on your wide ride.

But if your driver has gotten gun shy because you aren't makin it, he may not be giving you the power you should have. Everyone's advice was right on.

[Klondike]

The boat driver plays a significant role in this process as well! I am tipping the scale at 215 and personally cant stand it when a driver hits me with a full throttle, in fact I dont like it when they hit half cause its simply not needed... To much power will break your body over and force the tip down and drowning begins... Try to be easy on the throttle and try what you may think is a ridiculous slow. I think people assume deep water starts require "all shes got captain". If the boat speed increases faster than my body speed in the water = fail. As the skier I like to stay in control of my body while getting out of the water and stand up when I want to stand up, if the boat is hauling a$$ away from me and all I am trying to do is keep up = fail... My opinion if you can get up on a wider ski you can do it on a narrow ski!!!

[david_t_hill]

I am thinking you are missing something small. The driver will also have a big effect on your success.

when you are ready to go put your head down between your arms. have 9+ inches of your ski out of the water. Do not hold it striate up and down. Have a tilt, tip to the boat. as you start have the driver give you about two seconds of moderate throttle and then add power quickly. As you start to move point your tows down in the bindings this will make you push the tip down and forward. Keep your legs sucked up you can stand any time after the ski gets on plane.

Radar and straight line have gloves out that will help the grip. Like the old clinchers .... Called Vice & MASTERLINE PRO LOCK GLOVE

Sixball, the head down comment was the greatest thing ever. I tried it last night. It was flawless. 2 for 2. To the others that mentioned people pulling too fast, I fully agree. A 200lb man on a 66.5" ski is not coming out easy at full throttle, unless we are talking the old 4Winns or something.

Thanks for all your comments. Now we are on to advice on actual skiing.... I had my fastes rip across the wake last night. Had the hands down standing proud, and went for the offside turn and got mega slack. I thought speed was the key to eliminating slack. Am I missing something? Im running a fairly long rope. Im guessing 15' off, as it came with teh boat.

[Sixball]

Oh ya the slack thing. I fight it often. Some things I find myself doing wrong are. Not skiing with power to the turn or letting off just after crossing the second wake. Keep pulling till you get to the edge change. Also if you are letting up on the turn you will get slack. Stay with the turn you should be well into your angle for crossing the wake again before letting up on the turn. complete the turn.

This is coming from much less than an expert skier.

[85 Barefoot]

Sixball, the head down comment was the greatest thing ever. I tried it last night. It was flawless. 2 for 2. To the others that mentioned people pulling too fast, I fully agree. A 200lb man on a 66.5" ski is not coming out easy at full throttle, unless we are talking the old 4Winns or something.

Thanks for all your comments. Now we are on to advice on actual skiing.... I had my fastes rip across the wake last night. Had the hands down standing proud, and went for the offside turn and got mega slack. I thought speed was the key to eliminating slack. Am I missing something? Im running a fairly long rope. Im guessing 15' off, as it came with teh boat.

It is, but not right before the turn. Speed across the wakes allows you to glide longer (bleed speed) before turning. If you don't ever get enough speed, you're never free of the boat for a nice carve, and if you turn without allowing enough speed to bleed, you'll get slack (because you're moving faster than the boat). Most pros are off edge (already bleeding speed) in middle or at second wake. You won't be able to do that because you're not going to have the angle that they do immediately following a turn but you'll develop a timing with practice....have fun.

[Slayer]

The boat driver plays a significant role in this process as well! I am tipping the scale at 215 and personally cant stand it when a driver hits me with a full throttle, in fact I dont like it when they hit half cause its simply not needed... To much power will break your body over and force the tip down and drowning begins... Try to be easy on the throttle and try what you may think is a ridiculous slow. I think people assume deep water starts require "all shes got captain". If the boat speed increases faster than my body speed in the water = fail. As the skier I like to stay in control of my body while getting out of the water and stand up when I want to stand up, if the boat is hauling a$$ away from me and all I am trying to do is keep up = fail... My opinion if you can get up on a wider ski you can do it on a narrow ski!!!

This is so true. I was having a hell of a time when a driver was giving it "all shes got captain". Then when I get a pull from a driver who better understands that less is more sometimes, I pop right out of the water. Having not skiied 20 years prior to this past father's day and never getting up on the skinny stick prior to that, I've been able to do so regularly by keeping my head down, tips of the toes of my front foot at the water line, both feet in the ski, and holding back on the desire to stand until I know I'm on plane and it's been great! As you state, having your body accelerate at the same rate as the boat is a tremendous help to getting up easier.

[Buwannabe]

This is so true. I was having a hell of a time when a driver was giving it "all shes got captain". Then when I get a pull from a driver who better understands that less is more sometimes, I pop right out of the water. Having not skiied 20 years prior to this past father's day and never getting up on the skinny stick prior to that, I've been able to do so regularly by keeping my head down, tips of the toes of my front foot at the water line, both feet in the ski, and holding back on the desire to stand until I know I'm on plane and it's been great! As you state, having your body accelerate at the same rate as the boat is a tremendous help to getting up easier.

Wow! This has been a great thread. Pulled the old ski out after.... ready... 17 years (and 50lbs) and darn if I could not get my fat a.. out of the water. Couple of problems. One, it's a brand new boat and my wife has no idea what to do and two, it's been 17 years so for the life of me I can't tell her!!! Arrrgggghhh I forgot how scary it is to be behind the boat with a new driver.

After reading this thread, I realize just how many things we were doing wrong. No gloves made grip an issue. I was pushing the tip under, which was probably a combination of bad form and WAY to much throttle. Add in weight and a heaping dose of fear you end up with a fat man stuck in the water

For the time being, think I'll try to drop a ski just so I can get on top of the water again. Baby steps. Then I'll see if I can demo a fat m... I mean shaped ski

[footnlongline]

Make sure you are not wearing a real baggy bathing suit. If I wear certain board shorts, they act like parachutes, try putting on a shorty to see if that helps. The driver should be watching you carefully to see how you need the power rolled on. Keep at it, it will come.

[UWSkier]

Make sure you are not wearing a real baggy bathing suit. If I wear certain board shorts, they act like parachutes, try putting on a shorty to see if that helps. The driver should be watching you carefully to see how you need the power rolled on. Keep at it, it will come.

That's a good point too. I always pop out a lot easier with the shorty on when skiing in the cold water than I do once it warms up and I'm wearing baggy shorts.