perfect pass: paddle wheel vs. stargazer

[skier92]

to those who have driven or skied behind both the Perfect Pass with paddle wheel & the Stargazer GPS based systems, how does the new compare to the old? Which do you prefer?

[VinRLX]

Well, I can tell you I really can't stand SG when turning around at speed for another run. But you get used to it.

[onamission]

Well, I can tell you I really can't stand SG when turning around at speed for another run. But you get used to it.

Thats the only problem I've had with it, you need to back off the throttle and disengage the system while making a sharp turn.

Not having to make all of those setting changes between skiers or having to explaining it to others along, the ability to adjust speeds up and down easy in the practice mode, only 2 magnets to set up and no need to recalibrate the base line constantly are the big pluses that I've enjoyed. As far as skiing I haven't noticed any real difference.

I'm been very pleased with StarGazer upgrade and would do it again if needed.

[ed obermeier]

Well, I can tell you I really can't stand SG when turning around at speed for another run. But you get used to it.

Hands down the StarGazer system way to go. Once you get it dialed in it's almost brainless, just turn it on and go. WAY easier than the previous version and IMO a softer pull to boot. What's not to like? If you have a hand timer to trigger the system you don't even need magnets on the entry gates, just start the timer at the gate and rock on.

The manual does state that you need to disengage the system during turnarounds to avoid the system over speeding (it's trying to maintain speed in the turnaround, which you don't want), which you are supposed to do with the old PP system as well. So I don't see why that should even be an issue.

Ed

[jetskipro550]

I've heard it shouldn't be used on a river with current.

[onamission]

The manual does state that you need to disengage the system during turnarounds to avoid the system over speeding (it's trying to maintain speed in the turnaround, which you don't want), which you are supposed to do with the old PP system as well. So I don't see why that should even be an issue.

Ed

That may be true, but with the old systems the speed increase was not as sever and would settle back in quickly. With StarGazer it takes about a 1/2 mile for it settle in on its own. I find that a need to remind the driver now and again about it. Probably we should have always done it , but never really needed to before. Old habits are jsut hard to break.

[ed obermeier]

The manual does state that you need to disengage the system during turnarounds to avoid the system over speeding (it's trying to maintain speed in the turnaround, which you don't want), which you are supposed to do with the old PP system as well. So I don't see why that should even be an issue.

Ed

That may be true, but with the old systems the speed increase was not as sever and would settle back in quickly. With StarGazer it takes about a 1/2 mile for it settle in on its own. I find that a need to remind the driver now and again about it. Probably we should have always done it , but never really needed to before. Old habits are jsut hard to break.

Agreed, it does seem to take awhile to settle in. It's my understanding that the newest version of SG is (amongst other fixes) supposed to settle in more quickly; I'll be ordering it up come early spring so I should have a better handle on whether or not that's true. I love the SG pull though, made a completely different boat out of my former Supra (much less stiff pull than before) and I have a couple of friends who have it in their 197's and same there, much softer and "friendlier" with near perfect times to boot. Hard to beat that.

Ed

[onamission]

Another winter project, send module back to PP to be reflashed.

Wish I just change the chip like before.

[ed obermeier]

I had heard or read somewhere that future PP upgrades would be on a chip like before. It so happens that I kept the SG module and gauge from the Supra and put the old PP module back in it before selling it (new owner wanted the old PP). I opened it up and looked, no replaceable chip like before so yeah, it will have to be sent back and reflashed. Maybe future production modules will have that feature but mine sure doesn't.

I do my PP business with Max and Dave at Skier to Skier (www.skiertoskier.com) so I'll be sending it to them after the first of the year. Great to deal with and they take care of business.

Ed

[skier92]

Any new feed back?

[ed obermeier]

If you have SG you can get a software upgrade directly from PP, comes on a small circuit board looking thingie that plugs into a port inside the module. Follow the included instructions to upload the update into your module, pretty simple. Cost for the update is I think $70 bucks.

Ed

[edwin]

I recently made the upgrade from v6.5ng to SG...once getting it set up and dialed in, I couldn't be happier. We were able to get consistent times in the original PP but it took some tweaking. At our club, the crew in the boat changes often, size of skier varies from 138lbs to 225lbs, the head tail winds are often strong enough to require + / - rpms, some skiers want a 'soft' 34.2 (closer to the low end of the tolerance),etc. I could make all the changes to give everyone the pull they were looking for, but that became a challenge when others were driving my boat. Trying to walk someone thru all the changes from the platform was an ever present PITA.

With SG, nearly all of those issues have gone away. Set the baselines, adjust the crew weight somewhere in the area of where it's supposed to be, set the speed and ski. We watch the ball times and it's just unreal to see how consistent the system performs. My ski partner and I were talking last night after skiing...commenting how fantastic the system is working in my boat. I wouldn't hesitate a bit to do the upgrade again.

[Malibudude]

After spending two weekends w/ Stargazer I agree it’s a great system. It took some tweaking and the last to get figured out was the need to invert the tach signal. Once we got everything dialed in and ran the base lines the times became very consistent, with one caveat we do still enter the crew weight as in our experience it provides a most consistent pull. The greatest difference in the CG verses the older system is the pull up, you need to be careful to not overshoot the desired speed setting. This will create havoc w/ the times slowing and speeding up to compensate, not that I’ve done it myself….lol Overall a worthwhile upgrade and more consistent than ZO.

[sacskier]

Stargazer hands down. The pull is awesome. The times are the same pass after pass, regardless of skier weight or ability. I have pulled tournaments and the boat pulled actuals all day.

[SunriseH2OSkier]

The manual does state that you need to disengage the system during turnarounds to avoid the system over speeding (it's trying to maintain speed in the turnaround, which you don't want), which you are supposed to do with the old PP system as well. So I don't see why that should even be an issue.

That may be true, but with the old systems the speed increase was not as sever and would settle back in quickly. With StarGazer it takes about a 1/2 mile for it settle in on its own. I find that a need to remind the driver now and again about it. Probably we should have always done it , but never really needed to before. Old habits are jsut hard to break.

Agreed, it does seem to take awhile to settle in. It's my understanding that the newest version of SG is (amongst other fixes) supposed to settle in more quickly;

Pulling out an older thread, as I just updated to SG over the weekend, but didn't get a chance to ski it yet. Has this issue gotten better with the updated software?

Edited May 25, 2010 by SunriseH2OSkier

[ed obermeier]

Pulling out an older thread, as I just updated to SG over the weekend, but didn't get a chance to ski it yet. Has this issue gotten better with the updated software?

Yes. The most important thing to remember is when pulling up your skier to not overshoot the baseline rpm for the speed. If you overshoot it takes longer to settle in. If you don't overshoot the baseline it settles right in. Same on turnarounds; IF you throttle back to slow down in the turnarounds, when you throttle back up DON'T OVERSHOOT THE BASELINE. FOLLOW THIS GUIDELINE AND YOU'LL HAVE NO ISSUES GETTING SG TO LOCK INTO SPEED PROPERLY AND QUICKLY.

Plus on the turnarounds if you don't throttle back it doesn't overspeed nearly as much as it used to with the previous software. Overall much better.

Ed

Edited May 27, 2010 by ed obermeier

[SunriseH2OSkier]

Cool. Looking forward to running it all weekend - weather finally looking good! Thanks Ed.

[ed obermeier]

One more tip. When you go to calibrate the speeds using the Quick Calibrate or whatever it's called (no course needed method) - go into the menu to find the rpm adjustment and set the initial baseline setting close to where it ultimately needs to be for each speed (use the baselines you had with your old PP as a starting point) before you ever start trying to calibrate. If you're close to begin with it will only take a few tries for the gps calibration thingie to nail it down. The closer you start to where it needs to be the faster it will find the correct rpm via gps. Hope that made sense.

Ed

[onamission]

After the software upgrade and resetting all of the baselines last year I had a problem with the speed picking up if we didn't turn right around and go back through the course. After taking with PP they had me manually drop by baseline by 50 RPM's to stop the surging. Surging would only happen if the timing started.