Tommys vs Malibu

[Cole2001]

Boat storage is huge cashflow. Hundreds if not thousands of boats for a few hundred dollars a month. Tommys has also established such a large cliental they can continue to service and store customers boats without selling a new  malibu and still be successful. 

[bwski]

4 hours ago, Hemmy said:

I have been getting emails from my Tommy's dealer about their "Spring showcase" this weekend.  I received a text yesterday and looks like they are continuing with business as usual, or at least perceiving to be as normal.  Here is the text I received last night.

Greetings from Tommy's Grand Rapids! Come join us this Saturday the 27th 10am-2pm for drinks, snacks and games. We'll have amazing discounts on all models of boats in stock & pro shop gear will be up to 50% off (see our Facebook page for more details). We'll be giving tours of our brand new massive indoor storage facility, if you take the 3 mile ride over there with us we'll have an additional coupon you can use back at the pro shop for even bigger savings! See you Saturday! Txt STOP to unsub.

Sounds like a good old fashioned fire sale to me!  Move as much inventory as possible because it is no longer yours to move.  I currently have my boat scheduled to visit Tommys Walloon for service and I am pretty nervous about leaving it there!  If they were to close up shop, getting my boat could be difficult if it was even still there!  I'm not sure what I will be doing.  

[DAI]

1 hour ago, Cole2001 said:

Boat storage is huge cashflow. Hundreds if not thousands of boats for a few hundred dollars a month. Tommys has also established such a large cliental they can continue to service and store customers boats without selling a new  malibu and still be successful. 

I wonder if their storage business is in a separate business entity.

[The Hulk]

31 minutes ago, DAI said:

I wonder if their storage business is in a separate business entity.

That would get interesting real quick.. lot real estate/price just went to the moon if so! Haha

Honestly I believe they got a deal on that samsclub building.. but over the past two years a lot of that got eaten up by new boats.. storage alone could keep going them going there...

There is not a lot of good indoor storage options around that also service or not enough at least... 

[Horns1]

Doesn’t seem like they are ready to Fire Sale their boats yet.  They are quoting 28-30% off MSRP on leftover 2023’s.  

[texasred]

I found a new $220K MSRP 2023 23LSV for $135K. Looks like the fire sale has begun. Should I take it or wait? No idea what will happen to service in the future.

[Hemmy]

13 hours ago, DAI said:

I wonder if their storage business is in a separate business entity.

That was my thought as well.  I would hope so.  It never makes sense to build under your current entity that you operate the business under.

[Hemmy]

8 hours ago, texasred said:

I found a new $220K MSRP 2023 23LSV for $135K. Looks like the fire sale has begun. Should I take it or wait? No idea what will happen to service in the future.

That sounds like a good deal to me.  I am tempted to go and get more detail on boat prices since I am in the market for a new boat, but most likely a pontoon.
My guess is probably not, but anything about them accepting a trade in? 

Edited April 25 by Hemmy

[Ronnie]

Check the options. I’ve see several boats like that that are low optioned. M5 motors etc. 

[DFW]

Per my Tommy’s sales rep. yesterday.

“Found out today that with everything currently going on we aren't even taking trades in. They said that it will be a temporary thing and hoping that’s the case but as of right now I can’t even get you a number.”

[EchelonMike]

9 hours ago, texasred said:

I found a new $220K MSRP 2023 23LSV for $135K. Looks like the fire sale has begun. Should I take it or wait? No idea what will happen to service in the future.

@texasred If you like the colors and it has the options you want, that's a pretty good price.  I missed a couple good deals on used boats I was looking at when playing the "what if" game, LOL.

I looked at a few leftover 2023s (this was back in January) at Tommy's and a few other places, but they either lacked my must-have options,  were colors that I didn't want, or were too expensive for my budget.  When you are spending six figures on a toy, make sure it's close to what you picture in your mind and not just the cheapest one.  

I ended up with a used 2022 with 20 hours on it for a great deal, with my options, in my colors.  Excited for the season!

Good luck on your search!

 

[Sixer]

11 hours ago, texasred said:

I found a new $220K MSRP 2023 23LSV for $135K. Looks like the fire sale has begun. Should I take it or wait? No idea what will happen to service in the future.

On a 2024 23 LSV msrp 244 they were down to 168.  ~31% off but their markup on dealer prep and delivery seemed high to me. (that was included in the msrp) 

[Raimie]

On 4/23/2024 at 11:11 PM, IXFE said:

You can take the dealer out of Skier’s Pier…

But you can’t take the Skier’s Pier out of the dealer… 

100%. Picked up my boat yesterday and it is the SAME OLD SP kind of issues with the warranty work done over winter. Once this last round is corrected (for real) I am absolutely done with that place regardless of what happens with this lawsuit. A blatant disregard for attention to detail has plagued that place for the 20 years I have been their customer and I am finally over it. I am disappointed in myself for not reaching this decision sooner.

[Slayer]

55 minutes ago, Raimie said:

100%. Picked up my boat yesterday and it is the SAME OLD SP kind of issues with the warranty work done over winter. Once this last round is corrected (for real) I am absolutely done with that place regardless of what happens with this lawsuit. A blatant disregard for attention to detail has plagued that place for the 20 years I have been their customer and I am finally over it. I am disappointed in myself for not reaching this decision sooner.

I reached that point a couple of years ago.  When I ordered my 2021, I nearly went to another dealer.  Effectively, Tommy's said don't bother calling us for service or warranty work if you buy out of territory.  Looking back, I wish I hadn't used them and sacrificed the drive time to the other dealer.  My 2022 has been there for several weeks now.  I dropped it off the last week of February to get the wireless chargers installed that didn't come with the boat when it was delivered.  I also had them replace the skins that were torn at delivery as well as soft deck that was stained at delivery.  It's not getting gel coat repaired and I'm told it will be ready for pick up next week, which is a week later than I was promised.  Next time I need anything done, I'm going to Gull Lake.  

[Bozboat]

If your boat is at a dealership for warranty work and the dealer files for bankruptcy, could there be some delay in getting your boat retrieved from the bankruptcy trustee?  

I remember a Nissan Dealer bankruptcy a number of years ago where people who had purchased but not yet taken possession of the cars got listed as unsecured creditors. (unsecured creditors are low on the list of people to get paid)   Scary stuff.

[Slayer]

16 minutes ago, Bozboat said:

If your boat is at a dealership for warranty work and the dealer files for bankruptcy, could there be some delay in getting your boat retrieved from the bankruptcy trustee?  

I remember a Nissan Dealer bankruptcy a number of years ago where people who had purchased but not yet taken possession of the cars got listed as unsecured creditors. (unsecured creditors are low on the list of people to get paid)   Scary stuff.

Yes, and I will be calling them today as I fear they may soon be declaring bankruptcy. 

Edited April 25 by Slayer

[hawaiianstyln]

56 minutes ago, Slayer said:

Yes, and I will be calling them today as I fear they may soon be declaring bankruptcy. 

Wow I have not been paying attention but just read your last comment and had no idea our Tommy's dealer could be tanking soon??  They sure paid a fortune for that booth they had at the Detroit BoatShow the wife and I went to 

[hawaiianstyln]

1 hour ago, Slayer said:

I reached that point a couple of years ago.  When I ordered my 2021, I nearly went to another dealer.  Effectively, Tommy's said don't bother calling us for service or warranty work if you buy out of territory.  Looking back, I wish I hadn't used them and sacrificed the drive time to the other dealer.  My 2022 has been there for several weeks now.  I dropped it off the last week of February to get the wireless chargers installed that didn't come with the boat when it was delivered.  I also had them replace the skins that were torn at delivery as well as soft deck that was stained at delivery.  It's not getting gel coat repaired and I'm told it will be ready for pick up next week, which is a week later than I was promised.  Next time I need anything done, I'm going to Gull Lake.  

I stopped taking mine to Tommy's Detroit, the MasterCraft dealer in Fenton, MI (Action WaterSports), those people are awesome to deal with.  Devon the service manager is VERY willing to take in Malibus and treats my 08 Wakesetter like it's his own (he actually owns a Malibu).  Take your boat to Action

[shawndoggy]

1 hour ago, Bozboat said:

If your boat is at a dealership for warranty work and the dealer files for bankruptcy, could there be some delay in getting your boat retrieved from the bankruptcy trustee?  

I remember a Nissan Dealer bankruptcy a number of years ago where people who had purchased but not yet taken possession of the cars got listed as unsecured creditors. (unsecured creditors are low on the list of people to get paid)   Scary stuff.

even if unsecured, the difference here would be that the owner of the boat-in-need-of-warranty-work is the owner of that asset, not Tommy's.  So BK trustee / receiver shouldn't be able to assert any interest in the customer's boat.

That said, it wouldn't be unreasonable for a BK trustee to need some time to get up to speed and during that time lock down the facility (with warranty boat inside) while they figure out who owns what.  But a top priority would be to get a list of storage/repair/warranty vessels and to contact the owners and arrange time for pickup.  At least that's how it has worked in my area under similar circumstances when the local RV dealer goes belly up every five years or so.

The actual warranty/repair work may not get done but the boats will get back to their owners in relatively short-ish-but-not-immediate order.  That can be an issue where the customer's boat is substantially disassembled waiting for a part (like an "opened shoebox" waiting for a ballast tank replacement or something like that).  Not that the BK trustee will assert that the disassembled boat is owned by the BK estate, but rather may not be able to actually get the work done timely (if at all).

(scratch head... wonder if owner's casualty insurance covers "damage" resulting from incomplete repair?  Or maybe shop's liability insurance, assuming premiums get paid at edge of insolvency?)

 

[Bozboat]

1 hour ago, shawndoggy said:

even if unsecured, the difference here would be that the owner of the boat-in-need-of-warranty-work is the owner of that asset, not Tommy's.  So BK trustee / receiver shouldn't be able to assert any interest in the customer's boat.

That said, it wouldn't be unreasonable for a BK trustee to need some time to get up to speed and during that time lock down the facility (with warranty boat inside) while they figure out who owns what.  But a top priority would be to get a list of storage/repair/warranty vessels and to contact the owners and arrange time for pickup.  At least that's how it has worked in my area under similar circumstances when the local RV dealer goes belly up every five years or so.

The actual warranty/repair work may not get done but the boats will get back to their owners in relatively short-ish-but-not-immediate order.  That can be an issue where the customer's boat is substantially disassembled waiting for a part (like an "opened shoebox" waiting for a ballast tank replacement or something like that).  Not that the BK trustee will assert that the disassembled boat is owned by the BK estate, but rather may not be able to actually get the work done timely (if at all).

(scratch head... wonder if owner's casualty insurance covers "damage" resulting from incomplete repair?  Or maybe shop's liability insurance, assuming premiums get paid at edge of insolvency?)

 

I agree, if you left a titled boat for repair you should get it back, maybe not immediately. We had a local seaplane repair company (yes in North Central Texas 🤷🏻‍♂️) that went bankrupt in possession of a Grumman seaplane, when the trustee tried to grab the incoming money from the seaplane owner for the repairs, the airplane miraculously became disassembled overnight. 

 The other situation I was asking about is where I leave my trade in and sign all the papers and agree to come back for delivery of my new XX, the dealer files bankruptcy before the title application hits DMV and now I’m an unsecured creditor. Personally I would take delivery on the day I signed the purchase agreement in order to lessen that risk.

Edited April 25 by Bozboat

[oldjeep]

3 minutes ago, Bozboat said:

I agree, if you left a titled boat for repair you should get it back, maybe not immediately. We had a local seaplane repair company (yes in North Central Texas 🤷🏻‍♂️) that went bankrupt in possession of a Grumman seaplane, when the trustee tried to grab the incoming money from the seaplane owner for the repairs, the airplane miraculously became disassembled overnight. 

 The other situation I was asking about is where I leave my trade in and sign all the papers and agree to come back for delivery of my new XX, the dealer files bankruptcy before the title application hits DMV and now I’m an unsecured creditor. Personally I would take delivery on the day no signed the purchase agreement in order to lessen that risk.

That is good advice for anything.  Even on cars and trucks, if they want to do the - oh we have to prep it and you can pick it up tomorrow then I say fine I will be back tomorrow to buy it.

[Cole2001]

Years ago had a local dealer go under for numerous legal reasons involving nearly 2 million in fraud. Owner was selling customers boats that were in for service or consignment boats not getting paid out, or refusing to give back boats when customers came to pick them up. Eventually led to a search warrant of the dealership and everything was seized, wasn’t pretty and took a long time to resolve. Customers without boats waiting for until charges were placed on the dealership. 
 

I doubt Tommy’s will get to that level but you never know. 

[Horns1]

23 hours ago, texasred said:

I found a new $220K MSRP 2023 23LSV for $135K. Looks like the fire sale has begun. Should I take it or wait? No idea what will happen to service in the future.

You mind saying which location this was? Or DM me.  Definitely a way better deal than they showed me, maybe I should counter around that level.  

[dalt1]

Here is what Knoxville sent me on a 2024 LSV23. $183,700 out the door.

Edited April 26 by dalt1

[Nick55]

Dalt, is that an order boat or something they already have on the lot?