Tommys vs Malibu

[John I.]

What would the purchase of a Malibu from Tommy's look like right now? Presumably, the boat could be located at any of Tommy's 15-16 locations. Would the buyer be dealing directly with an individual from M&T bank? Seems unlikely, but I don't know, hence the question. Would there be a boat sales person / broker involved? Does Malibu corporate have any say in the disposition of Tommy's inventory? 

I have purchased foreclosed real estate before and there was still a real estate agent representing the bank/owner. And in the late 90's I almost purchased a Nautique from a dealer in the pacific northwest (I am in SoCal) that lost their dealership arrangement with Correct Craft and was looking to unload the last 8-10 boats they had in inventory in advance of that effective date. The dealer provided me with their invoice and supporting details of their floor financing as assurance that the prices were rock bottom. But that dealer was not in default with their lender. 

Just curious.

Edited April 18 by John I.

[JeffK]

This may feel like an unpopular opinion, but I've been on both sides of this and have seen 3 dealerships up close and personal, including my own at one point. 

The dealers don't always get reimbursed for work that is viewed as warranty in the customer's eyes. Dealers will often have to "eat" a lot of the cost and labor associated with warranty work, which is why they have to make money on the sale of the boat. And in order to quickly get you back out on the water, will often do it by purchasing parts in advance to swap out knowing they might get questioned and fought on the claim. Imagine the flip side if the dealer decided to sit on your boat for a week in July just trying to get an authorization approved before they would even touch your boat for fear of not getting reimbursed. If you went out somewhere to find a killer deal, then arrive at a different dealer expecting them to do all the warranty work for you, some of which would likely cost them money to do, you'd view it a little differently. While there are some dealers that have shown themselves to do some shady things, there are also plenty out there just trying to make an honest living in an industry that constantly paints them as criminals.

Everyone want their dealer to have 30 techs just sitting at the shop waiting to turn your new boat in and out for service the same day in the middle of the summer, but also wants to be able to buy it at 3% over invoice. That just isn't a sustainable business model for a seasonal, luxury item that requires stock in the showroom.

For cars, you are correct. They make most of their money on service and warranty claims are much smoother and consistent. Not the case in the marine world.

 

[Nick55]

Typically, in a bank owned sale like this, the dealer (or some other entity if repossession was to occur) would retain possession of the items (under close scrutiny of the bank) and someone would be available to show the product to potential buyers with the understanding the bank will reimburse the selling agent if that isn’t a bank employee.  The financial discussions will happen with the bank instead of through F&I at the dealership.  Realistically, you would very likely be able to take financing out on your own for this boat too.  I doubt you could do a trade in on it because the bank isn’t in the boat business and they are offloading assets, they don’t want another.  The dealer is definitely not going to take it on trade, they would have a harder time selling it.  
 

Jeff, you bring some interesting points up.  I had no idea dealers had to get preapproval for warranty work.  I’d have hoped they would be empowered to make that call for most things and just document it in the warranty claim.  Seems less efficient to have to adjudicate a blame before it’s completed. 
 

Full disclosure, I work for an automotive OEM as a service engineer and deal with warranty spend as part of my daily activities. 

Edited April 18 by Nick55

[MikeR397]

2 hours ago, JeffK said:

This may feel like an unpopular opinion, but I've been on both sides of this and have seen 3 dealerships up close and personal, including my own at one point. 

The dealers don't always get reimbursed for work that is viewed as warranty in the customer's eyes. Dealers will often have to "eat" a lot of the cost and labor associated with warranty work, which is why they have to make money on the sale of the boat. And in order to quickly get you back out on the water, will often do it by purchasing parts in advance to swap out knowing they might get questioned and fought on the claim. Imagine the flip side if the dealer decided to sit on your boat for a week in July just trying to get an authorization approved before they would even touch your boat for fear of not getting reimbursed. If you went out somewhere to find a killer deal, then arrive at a different dealer expecting them to do all the warranty work for you, some of which would likely cost them money to do, you'd view it a little differently. While there are some dealers that have shown themselves to do some shady things, there are also plenty out there just trying to make an honest living in an industry that constantly paints them as criminals.

Everyone want their dealer to have 30 techs just sitting at the shop waiting to turn your new boat in and out for service the same day in the middle of the summer, but also wants to be able to buy it at 3% over invoice. That just isn't a sustainable business model for a seasonal, luxury item that requires stock in the showroom.

For cars, you are correct. They make most of their money on service and warranty claims are much smoother and consistent. Not the case in the marine world.

 

My 24 T220 came with an incorrect manual wedge (vs power) and different surf exhaust and swim platform due to the mix up. It sounds like Malibu is only covering the power wedge and exhaust swap and my dealer says they have to eat the swim platform cost which is absolutely nuts to me they would have to eat that since it was entirely Malibus fault. 

[oldjeep]

4 minutes ago, MikeR397 said:

My 24 T220 came with an incorrect manual wedge (vs power) and different surf exhaust and swim platform due to the mix up. It sounds like Malibu is only covering the power wedge and exhaust swap and my dealer says they have to eat the swim platform cost which is absolutely nuts to me they would have to eat that since it was entirely Malibus fault. 

If I could swap a manual wedge on, I would.  Was not aware that was even an option anymore.  Why swap platform?  Can't live with door?  

[MikeR397]

1 hour ago, oldjeep said:

If I could swap a manual wedge on, I would.  Was not aware that was even an option anymore.  Why swap platform?  Can't live with door?  

Ya the door sticks up so I can’t install the GatorStep I ordered flush. Plus it looks like an excellent spot for people to stub toes on and something to rattle at certain RPM. 

[COOP]

2 hours ago, MikeR397 said:

My 24 T220 came with an incorrect manual wedge (vs power) and different surf exhaust and swim platform due to the mix up. It sounds like Malibu is only covering the power wedge and exhaust swap and my dealer says they have to eat the swim platform cost which is absolutely nuts to me they would have to eat that since it was entirely Malibus fault. 

May not be Malibus fault. Dealer could have ordered wrong. I know from experience. 

[oldjeep]

35 minutes ago, MikeR397 said:

Ya the door sticks up so I can’t install the GatorStep I ordered flush. Plus it looks like an excellent spot for people to stub toes on and something to rattle at certain RPM. 

Might have been saving you from future ram replacements 😉

[MikeR397]

13 hours ago, COOP said:

May not be Malibus fault. Dealer could have ordered wrong. I know from experience. 

I have the build order and carefully checked it, it was not dealers fault. 

ETA: Actually, it looks like I'm incorrect here and it was likely the dealer's mistake (and to some extent my own, although I was clear on which wedge I wanted and not sure how it was toggled back to manual which was never a consideration), and not Malibu's on my wedge mix up. Regardless, the important thing is that it's being made right and I give props to Malibu and particularly the dealer for fixing the situation as you'd expect on a six figure boat and putting the customer first. Mistakes can happen, but how they are handled is more important.  

Edited April 19 by MikeR397

[bamaboy]

On 4/12/2024 at 8:52 AM, Stevo said:

Skier’s pier strikes again….

Beat me to it

[Sixer]

2 hours ago, bamaboy said:

Beat me to it

I missed the story here..........What happened with Skier's Pier??

[MalibuNation]

Didn't Tommy's buy S P?

[The Hulk]

5 hours ago, MalibuNation said:

Didn't Tommy's buy S P?

You just can’t go down this road on TMC! Haha

[bamaboy]

22 hours ago, Sixer said:

I missed the story here..........What happened with Skier's Pier??

What if I told you.....It was always Skier's Pier......

[justgary]

 

[IXFE]

On 4/19/2024 at 7:38 AM, MikeR397 said:

I have the build order and carefully checked it, it was not dealers fault. 

ETA: Actually, it looks like I'm incorrect here and it was likely the dealer's mistake (and to some extent my own, although I was clear on which wedge I wanted and not sure how it was toggled back to manual which was never a consideration), and not Malibu's on my wedge mix up. Regardless, the important thing is that it's being made right and I give props to Malibu and particularly the dealer for fixing the situation as you'd expect on a six figure boat and putting the customer first. Mistakes can happen, but how they are handled is more important.  

It’s almost always the dealer. Not that Malibu doesn’t make mistakes, but I trust them to build what’s in the portal more than I trust a random boat salesman to enter it into the portal correctly. That’s why when I order a new boat I sit down with them and watch as they plug it into the portal with my own eyes.

Funny story… in 2019 I watched as the dealer formerly known as Waterski America entered my 25 LSV order. All was perfect; I even signed a printed copy of the order just before leaving…

Then, unbeknownst to me, after I left they accidentally deleted my order. Rather than call me and own their mistake, in a panic they tried their best to reproduce the order I’d watched them enter just an hour earlier. And they did pretty good! But…

Delivery day came and a few items were  missing / wrong:

* wireless chargers (actually they installed these before delivery without telling me… super honest guys)

* black wheel inserts (they color matched to the boat accents and had to eat the cost to change them to black) 

* PnP w/auto vent (they selected regular PnP)

They never did fix the PnP mix up. It was one of those “we will fix it in the off season.” Silly rabbit, IXFE has no off season! 
 

 

[IXFE]

On 4/22/2024 at 7:01 AM, bamaboy said:

What if I told you.....It was always Skier's Pier......

You can take the dealer out of Skier’s Pier…

But you can’t take the Skier’s Pier out of the dealer… 

[Slayer]

8 hours ago, IXFE said:

You can take the dealer out of Skier’s Pier…

But you can’t take the Skier’s Pier out of the dealer… 

There are fewer more accurate statements than this in my experience.

 

We'll see if they stepped up when I pick my boat up this weekend.  It's in for things that were never delivered as well as warranty issues that never got addressed because they couldn't schedule me in without losing valuable water time.  

[dizzygti]

8 hours ago, IXFE said:

Silly rabbit, IXFE has no off season! 

Exactly.  

[RyanB]

9 hours ago, IXFE said:

It’s almost always the dealer. Not that Malibu doesn’t make mistakes, but I trust them to build what’s in the portal more than I trust a random boat salesman to enter it into the portal correctly. That’s why when I order a new boat I sit down with them and watch as they plug it into the portal with my own eyes.

 

I don’t think that is unique to the boating industry. Same applies when ordering a car. 

[Hemmy]

I have been getting emails from my Tommy's dealer about their "Spring showcase" this weekend.  I received a text yesterday and looks like they are continuing with business as usual, or at least perceiving to be as normal.  Here is the text I received last night.

Greetings from Tommy's Grand Rapids! Come join us this Saturday the 27th 10am-2pm for drinks, snacks and games. We'll have amazing discounts on all models of boats in stock & pro shop gear will be up to 50% off (see our Facebook page for more details). We'll be giving tours of our brand new massive indoor storage facility, if you take the 3 mile ride over there with us we'll have an additional coupon you can use back at the pro shop for even bigger savings! See you Saturday! Txt STOP to unsub.

[bcoppess23]

2 hours ago, Hemmy said:

I have been getting emails from my Tommy's dealer about their "Spring showcase" this weekend.  I received a text yesterday and looks like they are continuing with business as usual, or at least perceiving to be as normal.  Here is the text I received last night.

Greetings from Tommy's Grand Rapids! Come join us this Saturday the 27th 10am-2pm for drinks, snacks and games. We'll have amazing discounts on all models of boats in stock & pro shop gear will be up to 50% off (see our Facebook page for more details). We'll be giving tours of our brand new massive indoor storage facility, if you take the 3 mile ride over there with us we'll have an additional coupon you can use back at the pro shop for even bigger savings! See you Saturday! Txt STOP to unsub.

How well do you trust them to join them on this 3 mile ride?!  Will you come back?? HAHA

[Hemmy]

12 minutes ago, bcoppess23 said:

How well do you trust them to join them on this 3 mile ride?!  Will you come back?? HAHA

That is funny you mentioned that.  That crossed my mind.  I also found it odd they are wanting to show off their storage facility with so much pride.  They are one of the Tommy's with a new building and now a massive storage facility.  Lots of debt going on there.

[oldjeep]

Just now, Hemmy said:

That is funny you mentioned that.  That crossed my mind.  I also found it odd they are wanting to show off their storage facility with so much pride.  They are one of the Tommy's with a new building and now a massive storage facility.  Lots of debt going on there.

Storage facility will still be a cash cow for the future - even if they don't sell boats anymore.

[Steve B.]

3 hours ago, Hemmy said:

I have been getting emails from my Tommy's dealer about their "Spring showcase" this weekend.  I received a text yesterday and looks like they are continuing with business as usual, or at least perceiving to be as normal.  Here is the text I received last night.

Greetings from Tommy's Grand Rapids! Come join us this Saturday the 27th 10am-2pm for drinks, snacks and games. We'll have amazing discounts on all models of boats in stock & pro shop gear will be up to 50% off (see our Facebook page for more details). We'll be giving tours of our brand new massive indoor storage facility, if you take the 3 mile ride over there with us we'll have an additional coupon you can use back at the pro shop for even bigger savings! See you Saturday! Txt STOP to unsub.

I don't want to read between any lines, but this sounds optimistic at least. Versus news that could be worse.