Trailer Tires

[csleaver]

The Vault grease levels should be fine as long as the center piston of vault hub extrudes slightly and can be rocked back and forth with your fingers, and there are no signs of excessive leaking from the Vault cover or the rear hub seal.  If there are leaks or if the cover piston is flush and does not move when pressed, then the hub needs to be serviced.

Here is a service guide for Vault hubs.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/vwsx92z1bwu50wukojrvf/The-Vault-Hub-servicing.pdf?rlkey=dsnrgbs9rfbo4cje6zgzcwkmt&dl=0

 

 

[wdr]

I recently checked my Vaults and added some Vault grease. I had some spare zert heads that made greasing them a breeze. There is a threaded hole on the face of the axle shaft that runs the length of the shaft and opens at the inner face of the axle. I hand screwed in the zert and greased it up. It filled and pushed the grease all of the way out to the outer bearing. You will still want to hand pack the bearings to be safe. A rubber mallet safely gets the caps off.

Edited February 11 by wdr
Sp/cl

[CarveItUp228]

OK, got the hubs all done. Thanks for all the tips here.

 

When I removed the caps (some of these took quite a few whacks from the rubber mallet to get loose), there was no Zert fitting in place. Figured out that they were 1/4 - 28 (I think that is 1/4 inch diameter and 28 threads per inch). These were easy to pickup at the auto parts store. Thus I was able to pump the grease into the fitting and watch as the old grease exited around the front seal. Old grease was a bit watery, and I kept pumping until it seemed like there was more robust grease coming out.

 

I then scooped out most or all of the grease in the cups and repacked them to the line inside the cup. I put some of the thread-locker on the shoulder of the cup. Put the cup back on and tapped it into place with PVC piece and 2x4, using the mallet to do the tapping. The little plunger on the end that has the "Vault" logo is then supposed to stick out a bit, like 1/8". I used a thick washer as a guide to see if they were in spec.

 

While doing this, noticed a problem with the port side rear brake pads. The pads were loose from the metal backer. Kind of strange to me. I suspect the others may be like this. Now I need to figure out the right replacement pads.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Nick55]

This should be the pad kit you need. 
https://www.dexteraxle.com/product/2952/97/disc-brake-pad-kit-freshwater

I’d strongly recommend bleeding brakes too if you can.  It’s easy with a pressure bleeder IF the bleeder screws come loose.  If not, you will likely have to replace calipers. When I did my last trailer, I had a caliper sticking, so ended up redoing all the wheel bearings with new seals and grease, replaced 4 calipers, and a master cylinder (there was rust all through the brake system….). I tried bleeding manually with a ratchet strap and it sucked.  I had a power bleeder so just bought the Motive trailer bleeder adapter. This is a complete kit, with the pressure bleeder.  https://www.motiveproducts.com/collections/brake-bleeder-kits/products/marine-power-bleeders-single-adapter-bleeder-kit-classic-car-and-marine-kits-power-bleeders-classic-car-and-marine-kits

I had to use penetrating oil on the actuator pins to press those out to change the master cylinder so if you have to go that far, look at ordering new pins and snap rings (or a complete actuator assembly from Boatmate, they are the cheapest source for that from what I’ve found). 

The other good thing about all this work now is that you’ll have a solid reliable trailer for years with just routine maintenance instead of big repairs. 
 

I really should just compile all this into one master post for all to refer to….. maybe it would be a good sticky.

[csleaver]

You can also pick up brake pads for a 1997-2000 Kia Sephia from your local auto parts store.  Also, make sure you removed the zerk fitting from the spindles before installing the Vault covers.

[CarveItUp228]

21 minutes ago, csleaver said:

You can also pick up brake pads for a 1997-2000 Kia Sephia from your local auto parts store.  Also, make sure you removed the zerk fitting from the spindles before installing the Vault covers.

Thanks. Why do you need to remove the zerk fitting? Best I can tell from measuring, there is no way it would come into contact with the cap/plunger. And isn't it better to have the fitting in place rather than an open hole there?

 

[wdr]

The thought probably is that if they run out of grease you may not know because the height of the zerk will keep the cap from recessing into the hub showing a low grease level. The open hole/passage may allow some grease movement in the axle but I doubt much if any. It is probably a moot point by then but a CYA business decision. Every brake pad I have ever had on any of my trailers BM or Malibu seem to fall apart. Went through and replaced all of them this winter. 

[CarveItUp228]

I found these on Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0CRM7VX8C/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2X4VF9VAJQVA3&psc=1

 

Guess i am buying two sets and replacing all of them. I hope I can get these installed before opening weekend, which is coming up soon. And it sounds like I will need to bleed the brake line too, which is not something I have done before. This is starting to feel like a complete trailer overhaul, but maybe it was due.

 

All of the pads look like they have very little wear on them. Seems like, for a boat trailer, we need pads that are more durable in water versus having lots of material on them (Hey Dexter, are you listening to this thread?!). 

 

7 minutes ago, wdr said:

The thought probably is that if they run out of grease you may not know because the height of the zerk will keep the cap from recessing into the hub showing a low grease level. The open hole/passage may allow some grease movement in the axle but I doubt much if any. It is probably a moot point by then but a CYA business decision. Every brake pad I have ever had on any of my trailers BM or Malibu seem to fall apart. Went through and replaced all of them this winter. 

 

I did some quick measurements and it looked like a half inch or so clearance between the cap all the way down and the top of the zert (the zert was pretty small). Maybe I will pull a cap back off and do a more precise measurement, and report back. I have a set of calipers to help with that.

 

 

 

[wdr]

I ended up with a set pads out of the 4 that were still service able. I went a bagged them up and put them in my possibles bag in the truck in case myself or a friend needs a trip saver set of pads. With the boat off the trailer it is crazy easy to swap pads if the need arises. 

[rockbottom]

Good thread.  My takeaway is The Vault is a bearing buddy with no zerk fitting on the outside.  I am now looking to replace the cap with bearing buddies so I can more easily maintain grease levels with no mess - 30 seconds per wheel and done.

[DRB10SEVEN]

22 minutes ago, rockbottom said:

Good thread.  My takeaway is The Vault is a bearing buddy with no zerk fitting on the outside.  I am now looking to replace the cap with bearing buddies so I can more easily maintain grease levels with no mess - 30 seconds per wheel and done.

The Vault system uses a grease/oil hybrid instead of regular grease, so not quite the same. I have had both and prefer The Vault. When they are set up correctly they are service free. I haven't had to touch mine for 3 years after replacing them on my trailer and they are still in good shape. I trailer an hour each way every weekend so I put a decent amount of miles on the trailer.

I also had good luck with the Bearing Buddy's, but I needed to grease them regularly and I just prefer not having to mess with them.

Edited March 7 by DRB10SEVEN
grammar

[CarveItUp228]

OK, I replaced the break pads for three of the wheels (one had new ones already) - both on the port side and the back one on the starboard side. Both of those old sets on the port side had pads that had separated from the metal back-plate. So I ended up with two spare sets - one new and one old (with something like 90% of the pad still there).

The two new tires I bought, and had mounted on two of the rims, were both put on the front axle. What I couldn't believe was, when I was looking at the remaining old tires trying to decide which ones to use, I noticed that the height was different across all 3. And no, it was not an inflation issue. Yes, tires can vary. But not this much! These were all Trailer Kings and all from the original set that came with the boat in 2018. The two most different were 1 3/4 inches different in diameter. The widths were also a bit different (I think maybe an inch). Side by side, they almost looked like completely different tires.

 

 

I guess, maybe next year, I will get two more of the Goodyears and put them on them on the back axle.

 

 

 

 

 

[wdr]

While you are at it check the torsion bars for wobble on all 4 axles. If the retaining nuts are not crimping the bar onto the splined axle tight enough you will get a lot of play and prematurely wear out a set of tires! My rear ones were spot on tight but both fronts were loooose and created wear. I originally thought it was from the front tires taking abuse in turns. When I first lifted the the whole tire and wheel assembly I was convinced that it was a bad bearing until I grabbed the whole assembly w/o the tire and it is was flopping around. I shouldn’t have to check something like this, but kind of kick myself now for not checking it. 

[ahopkins22LSV]

You sure those aren’t different model tires? The tread pattern looks different to me.

[Nick55]

I agree, those are not the same tires. Are you sure the sizes are the same?  If you check on the sidewall, they should indicate the size.  I personally would not mix and match tires, definitely not sizes if that’s the case.  Also, thinking about torsion axle loading and making sure the trailer is balanced, I’d get the whole trailer up on jack stands, make sure the torsion arms are all clocked the exact same (you should be able to see the axle at the same distance from the frame rail).  When the trailer is set up correctly, the frame should be level with the ground.  You will likely need to adjust the hitch ball height to achieve that (I don’t have any trailers that use the same height ball, and it often changes based off trailer/truck cargo loading as well). Do you have any pictures of your boat and trailer attached to your tow vehicle?  A side view picture would tell us a good bit about how it’s riding too. 

[CarveItUp228]

11 hours ago, ahopkins22LSV said:

You sure those aren’t different model tires? The tread pattern looks different to me.

 

Appreciate the input.

 

They all came with the trailer, are the same brand, and have the exact same marking on the sidewall. I can assure you. nobody is more surprised than me that they are so different in size!

 

While changing the brake pads, I didn't notice anything unusual about the torsion bars. I pushed on the wheels once off the ground to check the bearings and there was no wobble.

 

 

As mentioned, I bought two new Goodyear tires and they are on the front axle now. The TK's are on the rear axle. Hopefully the torsion axle will keep the back frame level across the two TK wheels where the tires are not very uniform. I ran with 4 TKs for 5 years, so I suppose it is not too big a problem for the axles to handle - they must self-level fairly well.

 

Below is with the new tires in front.

 

 

Again, appreciate the comments. Hopefully I am good to roll.

 

 

[ahopkins22LSV]

13 minutes ago, CarveItUp228 said:

 

Appreciate the input.

 

They all came with the trailer, are the same brand, and have the exact same marking on the sidewall. I can assure you. nobody is more surprised than me that they are so different in size!

 

While changing the brake pads, I didn't notice anything unusual about the torsion bars. I pushed on the wheels once off the ground to check the bearings and there was no wobble.

 

 

As mentioned, I bought two new Goodyear tires and they are on the front axle now. The TK's are on the rear axle. Hopefully the torsion axle will keep the back frame level across the two TK wheels where the tires are not very uniform. I ran with 4 TKs for 5 years, so I suppose it is not too big a problem for the axles to handle - they must self-level fairly well.

 

Below is with the new tires in front.

 

 

Again, appreciate the comments. Hopefully I am good to roll.

 

 

I think you are missing the point that the tread pattern is clearing different. I’m still almost certain those are different model tires. They may be the same size spec and from the same manufacturer but I’m sure they are a different model. That would explain the different shape. 
 

Either way, you made a good decision on the good years. However, I’d buy two more to have the exact same tire with the same wear on both axles. 

[oldjeep]

They could even be the same model from wildly different years.

 

[CarveItUp228]

 

12 hours ago, ahopkins22LSV said:

I think you are missing the point that the tread pattern is clearing different. I’m still almost certain those are different model tires. They may be the same size spec and from the same manufacturer but I’m sure they are a different model. That would explain the different shape. 
 

Either way, you made a good decision on the good years. However, I’d buy two more to have the exact same tire with the same wear on both axles. 

 

Understood. I will get the new GYs soon and swap them out. And I won't be buying TKs again.

 

Thanks

 

[CarveItUp228]

Anyone know the right Vault hubs to get? I found these:

 

 

 

[oldjeep]

14 hours ago, CarveItUp228 said:

Anyone know the right Vault hubs to get? I found these:

 

 

 

Why do you need to replace them?  Have one fall out?  Best bet is to measure one of your existing hubs.

[CarveItUp228]

Yes I apparently lost one last weekend. I suppose I did not seat it all the way down when I repacked the grease in Feb. Either that or I put too much grease in and the pressure pushed it out, perhaps as the grease heated up on the 15min drive to the ramp.

 

I measured the outside diameter and got 2.070 inches. I wonder if the 1.980 they speak of is the OD where the hub necks down.

 

But yes, I suppose I can remove one. Was hoping to avoid jacking up the trailer and removing the wheel but maybe that is what I need to do.

 

[oldjeep]

2 hours ago, CarveItUp228 said:

Yes I apparently lost one last weekend. I suppose I did not seat it all the way down when I repacked the grease in Feb. Either that or I put too much grease in and the pressure pushed it out, perhaps as the grease heated up on the 15min drive to the ramp.

 

I measured the outside diameter and got 2.070 inches. I wonder if the 1.980 they speak of is the OD where the hub necks down.

 

But yes, I suppose I can remove one. Was hoping to avoid jacking up the trailer and removing the wheel but maybe that is what I need to do.

 

The diameter they quote will be the wheel hub ID.  So if you have a caliper - just measure it on the one that fell out

Edited April 17 by oldjeep

[CarveItUp228]

11 hours ago, oldjeep said:

The diameter they quote will be the wheel hub ID.  So if you have a caliper - just measure it on the one that fell out

OK, not sure I can get in there for a measurement without jacking her up and taking off the wheel. But I can do that.