2018 Supra SL & 2018 Malibu 23LSV

1,816 · November 16, 2017

9 hours ago, teamerickson said:

Closed on Friday’s or Just Veterans Day observed?

AFAIK, Bu, MC, and SC are all closed on fridays for production. Production works 4- 10 hour days. Only office folks do the 5x8.

December 16, 2017

On 9/15/2017 at 5:10 PM, NorrisMike said:

What are some of the pros versus cons for those of you who have contemplated both brands?

Ran across this and wanted to chime in as it is my purple LSV you have pictured haha. A demo will be the ultimate decision maker but I few things I saw reading through this thread. The SL has bags sub floor not hard tank ballast, ballast fill time is not much different between the two models, autowake keeps pumps running pretty much the entire time and still has to list the boat. Both great boats, demo demo demo.

1,329 · January 15, 2018

Here you go Mikey. Surf review of the SL.

January 15, 2018

chiming in here late ... as my search has come to an end this weekend ... Supra SL it is ... interior color exactly as the pics on page 4 of this thread ... few answers to various questions on this thread (not going to collect the quotes over 9 pages - sorry )

Skiers Choice production numbers according to sales rep on Saturday: 1800 boats (6 per day currently - capacity there to go to 7 but quality concerns)

Base price is 124900 as you can get from the configurator ... I skipped a few options:

prop change to ACME 2277 (120)
gunmetal flake (690)
docking lights in the front (730)
Seadek (820)
Steering control for ballast, stereo etc. (790)
PTM mirror (190)
Audio package with 2 subs - no tower speakers (1580)
Heater (970)
Surfpipe (750)
Trailer upgrade to Fulton F2 jack (130) and transom straps (180)
shipping cover (330)

So total is 132180 ... comparing that to the 2017 23LSV I bought last year is about 6K less (and in fairness - most of the money was spent on the custom color) - so give or take this is a wash ... I don't think it's worth to compare electric seat booster as an example but I'm also no longer splurging on tower speakers ... However if I compare the 2018 23LSV build for this year then the difference would be 7000 and this time the exact same options (no tower speakers but seat heater, PNP still extra).

Except I keep my lockers (and don't have to deal with PNP), getting a roomier cabin (not just feeling - actual measurement - the 6 inches in length difference are in the interior cabin.

IXFE will likely chastise me again for buying a boat not fully tested - so I'm mentally preparing for that one

I will though gladly report back on lack of bow rise (if applicable), fuel consumption (as this is another hot topic as of late), overall handling (like not having to hold on to the steering wheel for dear life if someone is actually surfing regular), prop damage (hopefully not) and the overall approval from my 4 legged crew. Spray date is early March so if our lake is ice out by April we're back in business ...

oh and before I forget ... I will list this boat for sale by July. As I said last year selling a boat in the 100K range isn't easy regardless of what brand. It took me 2.5 months to sell the LSV (may have not done enough advertising on CL outside of MN but won't make that mistake again). I will pay attention to connollycrew how long it will take him to offload his 2018 ... and if we will ever know at what price ... will report back myself in time

Edited January 15, 2018 by Monkeybutt
add on

1,816 · January 15, 2018

3 hours ago, Tims said:

Here you go Mikey. Surf review of the SL.

What?!? Ragboy thinks his boat is the best surf boat ever?? I don't believe it......

Every year I listen to how his new boat is the absolute best wave, best efficiency, best boat ever. And it's never just "it's a darn great boat". The thing always has supernatural powers. If you are keeping up with the GPH thread, ragboy should put his data in to the mix, and he'd put that centurion to shame. His old Tige used to only burn like 2-3gph, and put out the biggest baddest surf wave ever produced by a boat...... any boat.

On a side note, I've spent a considerable amount of time in and behind the new SL. It's a pretty sweet boat. Glad my buddy upgraded from his Mondo.

Edited January 15, 2018 by TenTwentyOne

1,851 · January 16, 2018

Can the subfloor bags be easily accessed in case of leaks ?

1,329 · January 16, 2018

4 hours ago, TenTwentyOne said:

What?!? Ragboy thinks his boat is the best surf boat ever?? I don't believe it......

Every year I listen to how his new boat is the absolute best wave, best efficiency, best boat ever. And it's never just "it's a darn great boat". The thing always has supernatural powers. If you are keeping up with the GPH thread, ragboy should put his data in to the mix, and he'd put that centurion to shame. His old Tige used to only burn like 2-3gph, and put out the biggest baddest surf wave ever produced by a boat...... any boat.

On a side note, I've spent a considerable amount of time in and behind the new SL. It's a pretty sweet boat. Glad my buddy upgraded from his Mondo.

He’s probably on the Supra payroll. It did sound over the top. Good catch.

1,816 · January 16, 2018

28 minutes ago, The Hulk said:

Can the subfloor bags be easily accessed in case of leaks ?

Ya. There is a removable panel in the lockers to access the bags.

1,851 · January 16, 2018

1 hour ago, TenTwentyOne said:

Ya. There is a removable panel in the lockers to access the bags.

Malibu couldn't have bags the jaged sub floor fiberglass would make bags look like Swiss cheese

January 16, 2018

It may cut into some of the G sales , I know we went with the Sl , ours shows up this week.

14,085 · January 16, 2018

17 hours ago, Monkeybutt said:

Skiers Choice production numbers according to sales rep on Saturday: 1800 boats (6 per day currently - capacity there to go to 7 but quality concerns)

The SC rep I recently talked to recently said 300 Supras + 900 Moombas per year.

Honestly, I was shocked so few Supras.

January 16, 2018

1 hour ago, IXFE said:

The SC rep I recently talked to recently said 300 Supras + 900 Moombas per year.

Honestly, I was shocked so few Supras.

I could see with the new Moomba max and mojo and the Supra Sl that they are picking up steam and are getting closer to the 1800 boat mark.

1,851 · January 16, 2018

1 hour ago, IXFE said:

The SC rep I recently talked to recently said 300 Supras + 900 Moombas per year.

Honestly, I was shocked so few Supras.

wow i would also have thought higher qtys as well etc.

14,085 · January 16, 2018

53 minutes ago, shockthis said:

I could see with the new Moomba max and mojo and the Supra Sl that they are picking up steam and are getting closer to the 1800 boat mark.

I should have clarified... I heard those figures just two weeks ago. Just goes to show you, don't believe anything these guys tell you.

14,085 · January 16, 2018

12 minutes ago, The Hulk said:

wow i would also have thought higher qtys as well etc.

Think about it this way... Malibu could build 3x as many 23 LSV's this year than SC will build Supras.

It also means Supra builds about as many boats as MB. I would have guessed higher.

January 16, 2018

15 minutes ago, IXFE said:

I should have clarified... I heard those figures just two weeks ago. Just goes to show you, don't believe anything these guys tell you.

and I should have clarified - the rep was not making a distinction between Supra and Moomba ...

Not that I cared - the discussion eventually turns around if the boat can be flipped after a few months or not. From what I can tell - it will get more and more difficult except you'll get into the 30% discount range and even then after you pay taxes you end up now with any of the regular (not the value line) boats in the 100K range. A comment made earlier that the Gs hold up their value - true but ... here again - this is what I was quoted at the Chicago boat show as I went there to look at MB Sports. The Boat house of Chicago had 2 trades coming in - both 2017 G23s - one with and one without trailer - 450 engine. Was quoted for either one around 139K before taxes and with trailer ... if they go for that much good for them ... the one in CA for 123K with trailer and supercharged engine would be a sweet deal compared to that ...

When talking to MB - one thing also became apparent: MB hasn't raised their prices in a while but did a massive jump for 2018. So a used 2017 MB B23 is now commonly listed at the price or close to the price it was originally sold to the original customer - so they 'benefit' from the price increase. I wonder when the market becomes saturated enough that flipping boats will become difficult or only at a steep loss ...

1,816 · January 16, 2018

47 minutes ago, IXFE said:

Think about it this way... Malibu could build 3x as many 23 LSV's this year than SC will build Supras.

It also means Supra builds about as many boats as MB. I would have guessed higher.

I would have guessed higher as well..... I mean, the little Supra dealer, on my little lake, in my tiny state, sells 15-20 new supras year after year....

probably half as many moombas, and I wouldn’t have thought this one tiny dealer would sell over 5% of all supras built.

1,209 · January 16, 2018

46 minutes ago, Monkeybutt said:

.... I wonder when the market becomes saturated enough that flipping boats will become difficult or only at a steep loss ...

I think that time is fast approaching for boats that are still selling used at well over 100k.

Edited January 16, 2018 by bamabonners

4,015 · January 16, 2018

13 minutes ago, bamabonners said:

I think that time is fast approaching for boats that are still selling used at well over 100k.

I'm not sure that is true. The economy is strong and I know our local dealer (Nautique) is busy enough with new boat sales that he's turning away some out of market and used boat customers. Not that he likes doing that, but he doesn't have the shop capacity. As long as new boat prices keep going up, used boats won't get much cheaper. Boat show price of the G23 I was just at was $165,970 - if new ones are selling at that price point, used ones will stay over $100K for many years to come. That G has some nice options, but the only one I'd consider deleting was probably the steering assist option. It did not have the SC motor in it at that price.

14,085 · January 16, 2018

2 hours ago, Monkeybutt said:

and I should have clarified - the rep was not making a distinction between Supra and Moomba ...

Not that I cared - the discussion eventually turns around if the boat can be flipped after a few months or not. From what I can tell - it will get more and more difficult except you'll get into the 30% discount range and even then after you pay taxes you end up now with any of the regular (not the value line) boats in the 100K range. A comment made earlier that the Gs hold up their value - true but ... here again - this is what I was quoted at the Chicago boat show as I went there to look at MB Sports. The Boat house of Chicago had 2 trades coming in - both 2017 G23s - one with and one without trailer - 450 engine. Was quoted for either one around 139K before taxes and with trailer ... if they go for that much good for them ... the one in CA for 123K with trailer and supercharged engine would be a sweet deal compared to that ...

When talking to MB - one thing also became apparent: MB hasn't raised their prices in a while but did a massive jump for 2018. So a used 2017 MB B23 is now commonly listed at the price or close to the price it was originally sold to the original customer - so they 'benefit' from the price increase. I wonder when the market becomes saturated enough that flipping boats will become difficult or only at a steep loss ...

I didn't realize you were trying to become a flipper. I could write a book on this topic; instead I'll just say, Good Luck!

1,997 · January 16, 2018

49 minutes ago, hethj7 said:

I'm not sure that is true. The economy is strong and I know our local dealer (Nautique) is busy enough with new boat sales that he's turning away some out of market and used boat customers. Not that he likes doing that, but he doesn't have the shop capacity. As long as new boat prices keep going up, used boats won't get much cheaper. Boat show price of the G23 I was just at was $165,970 - if new ones are selling at that price point, used ones will stay over $100K for many years to come. That G has some nice options, but the only one I'd consider deleting was probably the steering assist option. It did not have the SC motor in it at that price.

Completely agree from what I see around here, and the broader economy. Talking to the Nautique sales manager at the Portland boat show last weekend, he had 3 build slots available for the rest of the 2018 when I was there Thursday night. He was asking custom order folks if they wanted the late March slot or one of the two slots in mid-May. I haven't talked to him after the show but I'm sure those slots all sold during the weekend. Anyone else wanting a Nautique in this area in the next 6 months can buy from limited dealer stock, buy used, or wait for 2019's later in the summer.

I don't know the exact 2018 model year build slots left for Malibu but as of a month ago they were mostly booked through March, and they just sold a LOT of boats at the show.

14,085 · January 16, 2018

1 hour ago, bamabonners said:

I think that time is fast approaching for boats that are still selling used at well over 100k.

There's nothing magical about the number $100K. It's just a number no different than $99K or $101K. The ability to flip boats will always be a function of a given buyer's ability to buy lower than somebody else and the macro economic health of the boat industry.

That said, if it ends, it ends. I made my peace with it many years ago. Never forget the first two rules of boat flipping...

You do not talk about boat flipping
You DO NOT TALK ABOUT BOAT FLIPPING.

I can honestly say I've never violated either rule.

January 16, 2018

22 minutes ago, IXFE said:

There's nothing magical about the number $100K. It's just a number no different than $99K or $101K.

yup as a number I agree but in our minds ... well ... different story ... I have set my budget 6 years ago at 50K for a wakeboard boat ... exceeded that one by about 7K after taxes with my 2nd Epic.

In 2016 after selling it - I set the budget at 80K before taxes (so about 87K) - this is how I ended up looking at MBs. Had a dealer not offered me the Malibu at the price I got it for ... well I would likely still not be participating on this forum but I'm glad I did ... learned a ton

27 minutes ago, IXFE said:

The ability to flip boats will always be a function of a given buyer's ability to buy lower than somebody else and the macro economic health of the boat industry.

I'm not sure if I'm a 'flipper' by definition. I remember after buying the Malibu - buddies were telling me that I could make money off it ... even the dealer originally told me so and he wouldn't care ... My take was a different one - I had an awesome time with it (172 hours of it) and it was worth every penny I put into fuel, beer etc. Originally I listed the boat at the high end and lowered it eventually to a point where I was able to sell - even though I could have put it up for that price right away knowing that I'm losing about 5K from what the boat with PNP and after taxes was costing me (remember that I have an advantage here in MN as a private sale will not be taxable for the new buyer). So I'm more than happy to fork over my own money for the hours I've used it ... I'm not in this to make money ... I merely want to get a new boat every year if possible because I still think I will take the lowest hit. As soon as I buy a used boat (any of the ones I looked at as well) - I have to keep it until warranty runs out (or close to it) because the next buyer won't be able to transfer it - so one major incentive to buy a used boat is gone.

It gives me some peace of mind in regards of warranty (but I'd rather keep doing things myself as long as I'm able and have the expertise to do so) ...

I may not be able to sell this one for numerous reasons but on the other hand the old saying 'if you can't sell it you're asking too much' holds true - regardless of being below or above 100K. If you get the 30% discount from your dealer you can flip and come out fine (maybe even ahead) ... I have told the dealer that I will be at his door step in August so he can try to sell it and get me into a new one if the numbers work out so it will be up to him in the future to make this happen (and make me happy ). This way I will only have to pay taxes on the difference so there's a chunk of money I will no longer have to fork over and gets me hopefully to the price difference I'm comfortable to pay for the fun on the water ... or I try to sell the boat further south as it seems that the prices are holding up better in Illinois ...

And I haven't joined fight club ...

1,851 · January 17, 2018

4 hours ago, NWBU said:

Completely agree from what I see around here, and the broader economy. Talking to the Nautique sales manager at the Portland boat show last weekend, he had 3 build slots available for the rest of the 2018 when I was there Thursday night. He was asking custom order folks if they wanted the late March slot or one of the two slots in mid-May. I haven't talked to him after the show but I'm sure those slots all sold during the weekend. Anyone else wanting a Nautique in this area in the next 6 months can buy from limited dealer stock, buy used, or wait for 2019's later in the summer.

I don't know the exact 2018 model year build slots left for Malibu but as of a month ago they were mostly booked through March, and they just sold a LOT of boats at the show.

Many boat companies are sold out for the year after Chicago show. Eapecially pontoons some brands sold out pre Chicago! earlier than ever.. economy is strong. Price will rise higher than normal next year IMO .. if u can't make enough price will go up..

Edited January 17, 2018 by The Hulk

2,047 · January 18, 2018

my feeling is in agreement with The Hulk. I think the Trump.economy is just getting started and more people will be buying and will force the boat prices into a "bubble" probably years from now. the rising new prices will drag used prices also.

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2018 Supra SL & 2018 Malibu 23LSV

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