Will this fat sac idea work?

[Gordo]

My VLX has the tanks above the floor too. I have been trying to mentally work through what would work, since I do not want to remove my hard tanks. Forgot to mention that you would have to somehow hook up the "vent" to the sac. I believe you should be able to hook another "T" into the overflow line from your hard tank to vent the air as it fills. A quick connect there would also be necessary. I have yet to try this, but it should work. You can then make the same plumbing connections to the port (other) side. Then you can use one sac and switch it back and forth in the rear lockers as needed. As I said, I have yet to try this. But it's going to happen this winter.

[notoutenough]

I too was thinking of a way to add sacs with my existing fard tanks, and like your idea, but I have one question on the draining.

If you have the drain lines "T"'d to one pump, what happens when the tank is empty before the sac? Will you loose your prime and suck the air from the tank instead of the water from the sac?

How about just buying seperate pumps for the sacs and use the existing wiring to a relay that powers both pumps.

--Robert

[Gordo]

Since I have not yet tried my brilliant idea, that might be a problem!! Logically, the sac should start collapsing (with both being drained) and that might introduce air....but if there was water left in the hard tank, that should keep the prime. Now if the reverse was true (hard empties first), then the sac might have enough pressure to keep it going. I was trying to figure out a way to use the existing pumps and connections as much as possible. Now if someone will only try this out

[chathamsolutions]

I'm going to try it eventually. Just need people to keep shooting down the bad parts of the idea so I don't have to make too man mistakes on my own.

[hyperlitenerd]

Why do you want to keep your hard tanks?? I would love to take out my hard tanks and put sacs in instead. It would simplify your ballast plumbing, and gives you alot more storage when you are packing the boat up for a big trip. just my 2cents.

Andy if you need help testing your wake after you install those, give me a call.

[chathamsolutions]

I'll definately call Chris.

The reason I want to keep the sacs is becuase I don't want to 'loose' any more weight, I want to increase it. The largest fat sac out there is a 750lber. I want to put one of those in WITH my 250lb hard tank.

I'm happy with the amount of space as it is. Yes, more would be nice, but I'm OK with the way it is. MORE weight is what I want

[Gordo]

Reason I want to keep my hard tanks? If I pull them out and try to store them somewhere (to re-install when I would sell it), they will encounter the "Black Hole" that is somewhere in my garage and/or boat storage. Things just disappear and I can never seem to find them again. Besides, my hard tanks do not leak, and my (limited) experience with sacs says that they seem to leak a lot. So - I am trying for the best of both worlds: keep my hard tanks and supplement when needed (for us thats just surfing) with a sac.

[hyperlitenerd]

I'll definately call Chris.

The reason I want to keep the sacs is becuase I don't want to 'loose' any more weight, I want to increase it. The largest fat sac out there is a 750lber. I want to put one of those in WITH my 250lb hard tank.

I'm happy with the amount of space as it is. Yes, more would be nice, but I'm OK with the way it is. MORE weight is what I want

you can get custom sacs from boarders paradise! get one to fill the entire locker!!!

[Ronnie]

I'll definately call Chris.

The reason I want to keep the sacs is becuase I don't want to 'loose' any more weight, I want to increase it. The largest fat sac out there is a 750lber. I want to put one of those in WITH my 250lb hard tank.

I'm happy with the amount of space as it is. Yes, more would be nice, but I'm OK with the way it is. MORE weight is what I want

You will never get a 750 in there with the hard tank. I have a 550 with the hard tank and I can only fill it maybe 1/2 to 2/3 full between the hard tank and the engine side cover. If we use 300-400lbs on that sac and the 250 lb on the hard tank you are not up to what the 750 is if you can fill it all the way. And HLN is right, the extra storage is worth taking the tank out for that reason alone.

Link to a 1300 lb sac from Inland Surfer. Looks like this one fills up the storage locker and under the seating area.

[chathamsolutions]

I consistently fill my hard tank and two 440lb SL sacs and stick them in the locker. Yes, they are too big to shut the locker door, but just barely. I find it hard to believe you can't fill a 550.

You guys are making this harder than I wanted...

[Ronnie]

I fill it up as much as I can but I don't feel like it's completly full. The bag tries to take the shape of the area it's in but with the bag not fitting the area well it doesn't fill completly because it's longer than the locker.

The 750 lber's are 20"X20"X50", even bigger than the one I'm using. You'll probably have to cut the carpeted wall in the front of the locker that the dampening shock is attached to for the sack to go under it to fill completly.

Just go ahead and do it. There are many more people besides me on here that would love to see it work. Your going to get the 750's either way aren't you?

[chathamsolutions]

Ya, either way the 750's look like the way to go. Worst thing that could happen is it doesn't fit and I take out the hard tanks to make more room.

I figure I'll give it a shot this winter.

[krakdaddie]

for your drain scenario i think u will find the pump will have issues priming if they are not connected directly to the tank or sac...just a thought...and the addition of a t/y wont help much either

-krak

o and to comment on the 5 year olds drawing...id use some shutoff valves between the hard tank overflow and sac fill...and i dont see anything about a new overflow from the sacs...they will just be getting air pumped in them while the tank fills

Edited September 13, 2006 by krakdaddie

[krakdaddie]

Link to a 1300 lb sac from Inland Surfer. Looks like this one fills up the storage locker and under the seating area.

how do we get a better deal than the $399 i was told today...from the looks of my search on the net this is a custom that inlandsurfer bulk orders...does anyone have any input on how BI quotes custom sacs...maybe we could design one w/out the 'bubble' in the storage locker and go for more of a ramp design...my thoughts r this would decrease the cost due to easier to construct and only losing a minimal amount of weight from the other design...just thinking outload here

-krak

[chathamsolutions]

for your drain scenario i think u will find the pump will have issues priming if they are not connected directly to the tank or sac...just a thought...and the addition of a t/y wont help much either

-krak

o and to comment on the 5 year olds drawing...id use some shutoff valves between the hard tank overflow and sac fill...and i dont see anything about a new overflow from the sacs...they will just be getting air pumped in them while the tank fills

Aaaaah, air pumped in. That's the kind of info I needed. I'll definately have to put in an overflow.

Thanks.

[chathamsolutions]

OK, for real this time, I'm about to buy the Fly-Hi 750's

Reading this thread again, this is what I'm thinking.

I'm looking to try and keep the hard tanks - again, looking to ADD ballast, not take it away.

I'm going to attempt to use the existing FILL and DRAIN pumps as well as lines / holes in the boat.

I'm thinking I can 'T' the Fill / Drain / Vent lines.

Any reason why this WON'T work?

Tracie did a great job of providing a shopping list for what I'd need if I pulled my hard tanks and just installed the 750's.

Any thoughts on the hardware I should purchase from BUYWAKE or Wakeside?

Thanks!

-updated drawing-

[jetskipro550]

I just re-read this whole thing and by getting rid of your hard tanks and adding 750's you will not be losing any weight. You will be gaining at least 100lbs. Why not make your life a lot easier and ditch the hard tanks? Either buy a HUGE custom sack or stick the 750's in there.

[chathamsolutions]

750 + 200

Don't see how I'm loosing weight. Even if the entire tank doesn't fill, I will be gaining weight.

[smedman]

Chatham -- seems like the latest drawing has what it takes to make it.

I'm not familiar with your boat, but on the 06 Vride, there are the 250lbs above the floor, and we put a 750 fat sac, plus a partially full 400lb sac in the locker. Since your boat is longer, it would seem you have plenty of room as outlined in your drawing.

The only downside to this plan is that it is going to take probably 10-15 minutes to fill or empty depending on the pump. (But it looks like from your first post you are going to replace the stock pumps with something beefier) -- Anyway, I wonder if it would help if you put a cut off valve just after the spot on the red line where it splits. That way, once the hard tank is full, you can redirect the full pump pressure to filling up the sac and not the hard tank. (I have no idea on plumbing terminology, so hope this makes sense).

I'm very interested to see how it turns out.

Edited November 17, 2006 by smedman

[jetskipro550]

750 + 200

Don't see how I'm loosing weight. Even if the entire tank doesn't fill, I will be gaining weight.

I thought the consensus was that the 750 + hard tank wouldn't fit? If your 440 sack barely fits how is the 750 going to? Is it longer?

Edited November 17, 2006 by jetskipro550

[smedman]

750 + 200

Don't see how I'm loosing weight. Even if the entire tank doesn't fill, I will be gaining weight.

I thought the consensus was that the 750 + hard tank wouldn't fit? If your 440 sack barely fits how is the 750 going to? Is it longer?

If I understood correctly from his first post, Andy said he cant get the locker to close with two 440lb fat sacs back there. I had the same prob on the Vride. -- Now we put the 750, plus a partially full 400 in the back (just enough so the locker will still close).

[jetskipro550]

So the 750 must be narrower and longer then the 440.

[WakeGirl]

I would guess that it should work fine, but my concerns would be 1) that as mentioned, the filling times would be really slow, & 2) that unless you put some inline valves, you won't be able to control whether or not the bag fills. I think that to address that second issue, I would redirect the plumbing rather than splitting it. So I would take the hose off of the vent for the tank & put that on the top valve for the bag, then put a line from the other top valve on the bag & run that to the vent. Because you'd be filling the bag from the overflow of the tank & it would fill after the tank is completely full, you should be able to see when the tank is full & cut the pump if you don't want to fill the bag. There's no way that I can think of right now to do that for the empty, so I think that you would end up splitting that line, & you'll probably need to put a valve on that line to prevent backflow into the bag.

It's still going to be pretty slow, both for empty & filling.

[SacRiverRat]

You'd be surprised at the extra space w/out the hard tanks. Lots of stuff fit back there w/out the tanks

[Beau]

Okay, early in this thread some electric valves were mentioned. EXACTLY what I've been looking for. I have not been able to find a 12volt electric valve for a 3/4 inch pipe size.. Where on God's green earth would one find such an animal?