Malibu needs to step up its game...bigger ballast ..new boat !

[wakebrdr94]

I honestly have no idea the answer to this question, but how many people from this site (actual Malibu owners) go to other brand sites at talk ish? I can see goin to another and lurking to see what else is out there, but to go on TT and say MC sucks, you should come to Malibu. There are a couple who contribute some good information, but others I just wonder about. I'm totally happy with my purchase and brand, have no need to go to the TT site, except to see pictures of MC owners who have put a wedge or surfgate on their boat.

Edited September 20, 2013 by wakebrdr94

[Lance B. Johnson]

Riiiight. Malibu isnt already selling $130k+ db gaudy "look at me" 15gal/hr rich man or daddy's boy boats....ya its the other boat brands only. Stay tru to da game, hardcore. So this being a Canadian boat, it will only be used to tow tubes 90days a year.

Your stereo types are ridiculous.

Wow thats an awesome looking boat. Looks way better than than the G or the Xstars that have been frequenting our riding area.

[shawndoggy]

bs, moomba and malibu both use indmar. I'd have no reservations about a moomba powerplant, because it's the same one in your boat (with a different plastic cover on top).

There really isn't much that distinguishes one boat from another at the end of the day. Fiberglass bathtub, one of about five GM powerplants, third party manufactured parts (tranny, drive shaft, tracking fins, rudder, prop, steering wheel). What distinguishes the boats are hydrodynamic performance, and how much more extra stuff gets added on top of the bathtub and the motor.

[bamabonners]

Shawndoggy has the right idea. Lets look at a moomba (supra) and a Malibu. Both use Indmar, both use same transmissions, probably the same vinyl vendor (probably even the same weight), probably both use Syntec carpet, probably same fiberglass, gel coat, etc....

So, where is the price difference between brands?

The answer is that there are several factors:

1. The quality of manufacturing (using this as a general term....not saying moomba is not a quality boat)

2. The bling

3. The overhead (marketing, employee benefits, staff size, training, shipping, vendor pricing, etc...)

Edited September 20, 2013 by bamabonners

[Brett B]

The hull design is significantly different between Moomba and Malibu. You cannot discredit the NRE (non-recurring engineering) involved in designing a product like this. Malibu has clearly spent significant time paying engineers to run CFD (computational fluid dynamics) to design a hull for specific characteristics, and then spent lots of testing time with prototypes on the water to validate their models. All of the big 3 do. Moomba, if they do this at all, probably spends a fraction on NRE, and it shows in the boats performance. The sale price of a product must recover the NRE over the life of the product run. So more NRE results in a higher price.

When factoring in overhead, fringe, etc, a mid-grade engineer can easily have a project charge out rate of $100-150 an hour. So that $3k Indmar engine adds the same cost to the boat as about 20-30 hours of engineering time per boat. Labor is almost always much more expensive than materials when designing a new product. So just because two brands use the same engine does not mean they should cost the same.

Bama never misses a chance to bash Malibu now that he is in the MC camp. Moomba and Malibu using the same vinyl? Give me a break. Have you ever been on or ridden behind a Moomba? If you had you would not be so confused at the differences in design and materials. Do you think that MC and Moomba use the same vinyl and hull designs?

Edited September 20, 2013 by Brett B

[windy1]

I ride in Moomba's regularly. they make a fine wake but don't have anywhere near the quality vinyl that my 04 Malibu does. overall a decent price point boat.

[bamabonners]

Bama never misses a chance to bash Malibu now that he is in the MC camp. Moomba and Malibu using the same vinyl? Give me a break. Have you ever been on or ridden behind a Moomba? If you had you would not be so confused at the differences in design and materials. Do you think that MC and Moomba use the same vinyl and hull designs?

I am not bashing Malibu - wasn't my intent at all. In fact, the whole point of my post was that just becaue they MAY use the same vendors for two similar products doesn't mean the boats are equal. I then gave 3 areas where I think Malibu is probably better and why they cost more.

Lighten up, I am not in any "camp" and I am not bashing.

Edited September 20, 2013 by bamabonners

[bamabonners]

Not that I need to defend myself to anyone, but I don't think malibu is a bad boat AT ALL. I love Malibu boats. I have a drawer full of Malibu gear that I still wear with pride. Just wanted to throw that out there.

I purchased a MC because they had some features and design elements that my family was looking for that Malibu didn't have. Which comes back to this thread - OP posted some thing features he would like to see in a Malibu.

Why do some owners (myself included, at times) take it upon ourselves to "defend" our brands when someone critiques it, offers a suggestion, or has an unfavorable opinion?

[rennis]

Why do some owners (myself included, at times) take it upon ourselves to "defend" our brands when someone critiques it, offers a suggestion, or has an unfavorable opinion?

It's a good question. It's really prevalent I've noticed with boats, and I think it has a lot to do with how much personalization goes into this hobby. A boat is much more an extension of ourselves than the average car or truck, mostly due to upgrades and how much time and equipment we throw at them. I am on a lot of automotive forums and it's a bit different there. Mostly it's defending a certain model of a specific brand, and defending its relevancy against newer/different models from within the same brand, as well as the competition.

That said, I see guys WAY more willing to critique their own car's shortcomings on auto forums, as compared to the boat gang, and that includes very expensive cars that are right up there in cost with a new Malibu, MC, or Nautique. They get downright hostile sometimes!

(not saying members don't critique Malibu boats here)

[bamabonners]

I only get my panties in a wad when someone spouts misinformation.

its not just boats, that with politics or religion as well. That's the debate side of me coming out.....

[thtrog]

Wow, What was this Tige owner thinking posting this today! Yes, I owned a Tige and respect the community...less members and sometimes have similar debates, but most times respectful of each other.

sandm

Junior Member

Join Date Jul 2012 Location De Pere, WI Posts 161 Boat '12 22ve

congrats and glad it all worked out. I spent some time a few weekends ago on a z1 and it was a very very nice boat.
now call chpthrl and get the right ballast bags

I am in the same literal boat as gcombe and switched from supra to tige. I still spend a whole lot more time on the moomba site than I do here and have no issues telling people there what I loved and hated about my skiers choice experience, but I don't mention tige there nor mention how much better I like it than my supra nor do I go out of my way to find debates to bash my supra. different boats and def. different pricepoints(supra was an 06). all are great boats and there are many happy people over there just like there are here. I post over there to share the love of watersports in general. I really don't care if you own a bayliner or g25. being on the water with friends/family is what makes it worthwhile.

Edited September 20, 2013 by thtrog

[black06VLX]

I hope a Malibu engineer/sales/designer doesn't read this and say heck people don't know what they want we aren't changing things. They do need to make changes to keep themselves on top and leading the way. This sounds like a peeing match and trying to defend why we have our boats, not a honest discussion about what changes could be implemented to build lets say the ultimate wakesetter.

Many people in here have suggested not to build a boat resembling a G or X-star. I do think Malibu could build a tricked out MXZ or VLX/LSV with additional factory weight and some extra free board and find a good market corner for the more serious surfers/boarders that will accept with open arms. Build something and start getting after the tournaments and contests where people are seeing all the X-stars and G's pulling people. This is why the rich people with no clue want a mastercraft or a nautique as they assume and associate it with being at the top and they want the best.

I would put my VLX wake with extra weight up against a lot of these boats. Heck the G23 wake is like a very very heavily weighted VLX(its why I love the wake behind it) I seriously hope designers and engineers are frequenting these forums. I think they need to start having a look where the sport is going and what people are doing with the boats. If they do I am sure they are smart enough to find a few hundred lbs more worth of ballast room in the boats without adding 2ft of freeboard! No one on here that I have read is happy surfing a stock weighted wakesetter. With that simple point it means in my mind that Malibu needs to add some extra ballast.

And for the record idiots will find a way into any brand of boat so trying to say one brand is more full or rich retards is a moot point. I suspect a lot has to do with who the bigger dealer is in the area and what brand of boat they are carrying. For us up here its Malibu's so I can assure you all I see more Malibu's pulling tubes, surfing than actually pulling a person on a board that can clear the wake.

Edited September 20, 2013 by black06VLX

[happypappy]

Riiiight. Malibu isnt already selling $130k+ db gaudy "look at me" 15gal/hr rich man or daddy's boy boats....ya its the other boat brands only. Stay tru to da game, hardcore. So this being a Canadian boat, it will only be used to tow tubes 90days a year.

Your stereo types are ridiculous.

MY god, is this puff daddy's new boat or what?? That be one butt ugly boat!! There should be laws against stuff like this!!

[DenverBu]

MY god, is this puff daddy's new boat or what?? That be one butt ugly boat!! There should be laws against stuff like this!!

What are you talking about!? Thats a beautiful boat...if your name is Violet Beauregard :-)

[shawndoggy]

Yeah, I get that........and that's what I thought I was saying: That I bought my boat for it's proven hydrodynamic performance AND it's proven track record of durability.........not just with the motor, but the interior and equipment as well. Moomba does not offer this.

Is that not what it sounded like I was saying?

Oh, I think there's a TON of thoughtful critiques around here regarding Malibu Boats......... And I actually think they are well received, as long as the critique is well thought out. I expressed my concern with Malibu's pricing & direction of design a few months back and IIRC a lot of people agreed and a lot of people disagreed. I thought it was really productive in the end. I learned a lot and had my opinion somewhat* changed.

And maybe you're right about the personalization that goes into the boats. But seriously..... In the end, people just need to get over themselves....I can't imagine reacting the way some people do (about their precious boat) every time an IllusionX tower was slighted OR a Vride's interior was called into question.........or more poignantly: Every time I thought I maybe heard something where someone may have been talking about me or my boat.

"reliability" is to me a mechanical aspect. All indmar boats should be equally reliable (or unreliable as the case may be). That's all I'm sayin'. Carry on.

[TenTwentyOne]

I honestly have no idea the answer to this question, but how many people from this site (actual Malibu owners) go to other brand sites at talk ish? I can see goin to another and lurking to see what else is out there, but to go on TT and say MC sucks, you should come to Malibu. There are a couple who contribute some good information, but others I just wonder about. I'm totally happy with my purchase and brand, have no need to go to the TT site, except to see pictures of MC owners who have put a wedge or surfgate on their boat.

I went through the entire thread, to see if anyone bashed Malibu. Nobody did.

I also went through to see if anyone bashed MC, CC, or their owners........ The results were interesting.

This is a Malibu sight, so I understand why there would be comments like "The XStar sucks. The G23 is the ugliest boat on the water. MC and CC owners are tube pulling rich guys with no ability". But at no place, in this thread, did any "other brand" boat owner, bash Malibu. Some of us suggested that some of the OPs comments had merit, and a few of the current Malibu owners got defensive.

You guys make this too dang easy.

TenTwentyOne:

You are proving my point more with each word you type. Sooooooo, the MC dealer had to order Maristars.....with X2 badging....and an aftermarket tower.....and no ballast..........just to sell them.......at the Boat Show of all places. Why would he need to do this?? Why?

Like you said from the get-go: He had the right idea. And what was that idea? To take all the gaudy crap off the boat and lower the price to compete for sales. But NOW, you're proposing that Malibu add all the gaudy crap and raise the price, in order to remain competitive. Silly. Just silly.

To have a price point MC....... Why oh why is there such a thing as Axis? Or the Vrides? Same reason.

On the Moomba thing: I never said their hulls had failed. I said the Malibu hulls were proven. As in: It's been proven they create a top notch wake/wave..........and it's been proven that the boats themselves (motors/equipment/interior) stand the test of time. I've put over 850 hours riding behind my 2 Vrides in the past 6 1/2 seasons. That's important to me. That's why I bought a Malibu.

Dang right Malibu puts out a great wake. Moomba wakes are pretty darn good as well. Skiers choice has there stuff together in the wake department. Are you really going to tell me that Supra and Moomba have bad wakes?

As far as the 'stereotype'. I never said this is the stereotype for MC owners. I said this it the stereotype for Xstar owners. You know, the boat that the OP is indirectly referencing and we were talking about? Now, is every Xstar owner like this? Of course not. We're adults here. I thought we understood that was a given. Like I said, you can tell me till your blue in the face that it isn't true, but it is what it is. FWIW, this has been my first hand experience too. Proven over and over and over again where I ride. And for the record: The local MC dealer does nothing but perpetuate this stereotype. Person to person, I'm suuuuure he's a wonderful guy. But this is the same guy that told me,when I asked him what the specific differences were between an X1 and a Vride were, "If you want a Malibu, go buy a Malibu". Then he walked away. Apparently he didn't realize I was at the boat show to buy an X1 and was just had a couple questions? All good though because that's exactly what I did. Then I bought another one a couple years later. (and I've heard many other stories just like mine, but I digress......)

Listen, I understand you desperately want to disagree with me because I've obviously offended you personally as a MC owner, but the truth is: We agree on quite a bit. We agree that the G3 is a great tower. Most importantly, we agree that the current Malibu lineup, as is, is fantastic. I'm sure we agree that Mastercrafts are extremely well built boats too? (I've ridden a ton behind the X2 and freaking love that boat! In fact, it would be right at the top of my list if I chose to buy a new boat today) The only thing we don't agree on is whether "Malibu needs to step up" and create an even more lavish boat than they already do in order to compete. I see no need.........and neither do most Malibu owners.......and neither does Malibu themselves. Oh, and I suppose we disagree on the perception of an Xstar owner too. But I might caution you that as a Mastercraft owner, maybe, just maybe, you can't see the forest for the trees.

I own an XStar.....So.... Ya, there's that.

Never, oh never will I bash Malibu. I have always loved them, and I will always look to them for a new boat purchase. At the same time, that ugly power tower (I can leave my boards on, fold flat, drive away, and not have to worry about bug splatter, moving or losing boards, or clearance issues) , aluminum trim (Cars, bikes, boats. doesn't matter. I like aluminum trim) , pop up screen (Which is awesome for night travel. Nothing bothers me more than guage glare at night. Push a button, screen down, nothing in your face) and some other little features, are important to me. They are handy, and they look nice. I also don't need any sacks for riding a huge wakeboard wake, and I always did in the past. Do I need that big wake? Actually no, and I will never be at that ability level, where it makes a difference. Does that mean that I don't prefer riding a bigger wake?? No.

I totally understand your view. None of these things are needed. However, some people like them. That is a fact. Call me lazy, or a poser, or a tube puller. I got my boat because it checked my boxes..... I am secure enough, in that, that I don't have to bash Malibu, and I can still love every aspect of what makes a Malibu a top notch boat.

[gwoods]

Just buy whatever you can afford and then trick it out accordingly. Cant blame anyone for wanting more. We all do. Buy what fits your style and catches your eye. Then go ride!

[nyryan2001]

MY god, is this puff daddy's new boat or what?? That be one butt ugly boat!! There should be laws against stuff like this!!

See I don't thinks its ugly at all... I'd rock it.

My point was showing BS he was spewing nonsense.

[bamabonners]

I am glad this site allows discussions to run the course. Makes for an interesting site with good people.

[Lance B. Johnson]

MY god, is this puff daddy's new boat or what?? That be one butt ugly boat!! There should be laws against stuff like this!!

Compared to the two xstars and the g currently frequenting my area that boat is a work of art. And to throw gas on the fire the green MC with green interior was absolutly pulling tubes all day. the g and the orange mc with orange interior? no one could ride or DRIVE. Had shouting matches with the drivers of both boats. That's how the stereotypes are justified.

[Lance B. Johnson]

See I don't thinks its ugly at all... I'd rock it.

My point was showing BS he was spewing nonsense.

Hmmmm that one up for grabs. From my perspective the nonsense seems to come from a G lover. I still don't get why your here????

[nyryan2001]

You seem really focused on my boat, I'm not. you need a pull?

Are you going to contribute anything or talk tubes and stereotypes?

[teamerickson]

Hmmmm that one up for grabs. From my perspective the nonsense seems to come from a G lover. I still don't get why your here????

It's "you're".

[wakebrdr94]

I am glad this site allows discussions to run the course. Makes for an interesting site with good people.

+1. Also that we are allowed to point out flaws or have complaints without the manufacturer whining and shutting it down.

All of us are critical of of malibu's, and we own them. My thought is it is what helps keep Malibu on point

[roonedoggie]

Sounds like someone should raise some capital and start or buy a boat company. Believe Tige and Mastercraft sound like the first place you should look.