New to the Forum.. Soon to be owner of 94 MALIBU ECHELON LX BOWRIDER. Have questions

[DIE2SURF]

Some other things to look for:

Steering wheel might be difficult to turn if the cable hasn't been changed. They tend to start wearing down after 10 years. Not too tough to replace, and around $150 if I recall correctly. There is even a very good write up on this site with pics in the DIY section. (from the SwagKing I believe).

Check the risers/exhaust manifolds and water pump for water seepage. Gaskets may deteriorate over time. (though may not be an issue with new engine).

Check exhaust under the floor behind the engine. I've seen some fiberglass exhaust actually warp/shrink/deteriorate due to overheating. That boat may not have fiberglass exhaust.

Some 90's Malibu's came with the HDS (Hydro Dampening System?). I'm not sure if that boat has it, but it's something to look for/at. It's a big rectangular box between the exhaust that the prop shaft goes through. Apparently they are notorious for cracking when the prop hits something (though mine hasn't failed). You can do a search on the HDS to find a lot of info on it.

If I think of anything else, I'll post it.

Others should feel free to add to/correct anything I've mentioned.

[DIE2SURF]

i figure my best bet for now is pull my prop and have it reconditioned as it's got dings on it (explains the rough idle speeds)..we do have a prop shop not too far away that seems very reputable (kevin's prop shop in antioch)

Kevin's is a great shop. I've worked with them a few times.

[jk13]

No HDS to worry about on the '94 Echelon, factory shaft log. Someone mentioned earlier to check drip rate. Rest of the advice is golden.

It'll either have the silent rider fiberglass muffler which is up high behind the engine and crosses over between the two manifolds or it will have two metal mufflers on the floor further back. Check either way for cracks or rust and make sure the rubber flappers on the outside are there and in decent shape.

[chefred112]

what's the characteristic difference between a 4 blade prop and a 3 blade one like in that link?

[jk13]

With the new CNC'd props the surface area of the blades is much more substantial on the 3 blade vs. the old cast props. Very few people are spending the extra money for a 4 blade on our smaller boats because the bottom end is as good or better than an old cast 4 blade and you're not losing any top end performance. Some will say a 4 blade may soften the wake and possibly cause a slight top end loss, but that is a boat-by-boat situation and I wouldn't count on either of those without trying it on your specific boat.

If you run a lot of weight I'd get the 525, if you don't run more than a couple hundred pounds I've been very happy with my 515.

Call Eric at OJ or Bill? at Acme and they can help further.

[AdeL]

It looks like the guys have covered most things. just to be clear, the Computron provided information such as water temp, air temp, it had a stop watch timer on it for pro skiers. So the display part of it you don't need, no worries about it not working. The other aspect however is that all the engine warning signals are fed through the computron. So for instance. I took my computron out and my engine overheat alarm continously beeped. I disconnected it and need to get that working again. I ensure I pay attention to the engine temp continioulsy to avoid any nasty surprises. So the only thing I would ask the owner regarding the computron is why it was disconnected, it doesn't work is the answer, what happened to the engine alarms, did they rewire those. The alarms are engine temp, transmission oil temp and water temp. Mine is a 94 Echelon and it has the same hull scratches due to wear over the years, nothing to worry about. The other scratches are part of owning a boat, again no worries. Someone mentioned the water dripping from the shaft. On an Echehlon LX you can see that by raising the engine cover and looking at the back of the engine, you will see the large brass nut and water dripping when the boat is running. Mine drips once every second, which is probably a little too much, but it's cooling the shaft which is the important point. If you see water in the hull after you test drive the boat, provided it's a result of the dripping shaft nut then don't worry about it, you can always tighten the nut or replace the packing. $8,500 is a good price for that boat, bot that I'm biased but Echelon's after 94 set the hull design standard that is still used today for pro ski boats - It has no wood so you get no rot. The rest will depend on how much effort you want to put into the boat. I replaced the steering cable last year because the steering was stiff and you could turn the steering wheel about15 degrees before the rudder moved. That was a PITA but it was what I wanted to do. Lastly the Echelon sits very low in the water, if there was one thing I could change to the boat it would be to have a higher freeboard (height from water to top of boat hull) other than that I think it's a great boat and the 350 chevy small block engine is famous for being reliable. Goodluck.

[Michigan boarder]

$8,500 for that boat seems to be a good deal. It looks like it was taken good care of. The other guys have touched on the rest.

You could always remove the tower and store it somewhere, if you don't wakeboard much or haven't progressed yet. Put it back on when you want it, or hang onto it for resale. No biggie.

Edit: On the dings and scratches, don't worry about it. If it had none, they would just be asking more money for it. Mine has some similar to yours.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Michigan boarder

[94malibu]

Some other things to look for:

Steering wheel might be difficult to turn if the cable hasn't been changed. They tend to start wearing down after 10 years. Not too tough to replace, and around $150 if I recall correctly. There is even a very good write up on this site with pics in the DIY section. (from the SwagKing I believe).

Check the risers/exhaust manifolds and water pump for water seepage. Gaskets may deteriorate over time. (though may not be an issue with new engine).

Check exhaust under the floor behind the engine. I've seen some fiberglass exhaust actually warp/shrink/deteriorate due to overheating. That boat may not have fiberglass exhaust.

Some 90's Malibu's came with the HDS (Hydro Dampening System?). I'm not sure if that boat has it, but it's something to look for/at. It's a big rectangular box between the exhaust that the prop shaft goes through. Apparently they are notorious for cracking when the prop hits something (though mine hasn't failed). You can do a search on the HDS to find a lot of info on it.

If I think of anything else, I'll post it.

Others should feel free to add to/correct anything I've mentioned.

I will check all of those things out.. Thank you

No HDS to worry about on the '94 Echelon, factory shaft log. Someone mentioned earlier to check drip rate. Rest of the advice is golden.

It'll either have the silent rider fiberglass muffler which is up high behind the engine and crosses over between the two manifolds or it will have two metal mufflers on the floor further back. Check either way for cracks or rust and make sure the rubber flappers on the outside are there and in decent shape.

Which is better to have? fiberglass muffler or metal mufflers?

It looks like the guys have covered most things. just to be clear, the Computron provided information such as water temp, air temp, it had a stop watch timer on it for pro skiers. So the display part of it you don't need, no worries about it not working. The other aspect however is that all the engine warning signals are fed through the computron. So for instance. I took my computron out and my engine overheat alarm continously beeped. I disconnected it and need to get that working again. I ensure I pay attention to the engine temp continioulsy to avoid any nasty surprises. So the only thing I would ask the owner regarding the computron is why it was disconnected, it doesn't work is the answer, what happened to the engine alarms, did they rewire those. The alarms are engine temp, transmission oil temp and water temp. Mine is a 94 Echelon and it has the same hull scratches due to wear over the years, nothing to worry about. The other scratches are part of owning a boat, again no worries. Someone mentioned the water dripping from the shaft. On an Echehlon LX you can see that by raising the engine cover and looking at the back of the engine, you will see the large brass nut and water dripping when the boat is running. Mine drips once every second, which is probably a little too much, but it's cooling the shaft which is the important point. If you see water in the hull after you test drive the boat, provided it's a result of the dripping shaft nut then don't worry about it, you can always tighten the nut or replace the packing. $8,500 is a good price for that boat, bot that I'm biased but Echelon's after 94 set the hull design standard that is still used today for pro ski boats - It has no wood so you get no rot. The rest will depend on how much effort you want to put into the boat. I replaced the steering cable last year because the steering was stiff and you could turn the steering wheel about15 degrees before the rudder moved. That was a PITA but it was what I wanted to do. Lastly the Echelon sits very low in the water, if there was one thing I could change to the boat it would be to have a higher freeboard (height from water to top of boat hull) other than that I think it's a great boat and the 350 chevy small block engine is famous for being reliable. Goodluck.

I just asked and they said EVERYTHING works except the perfect pass (cruise control)

$8,500 for that boat seems to be a good deal. It looks like it was taken good care of. The other guys have touched on the rest.

You could always remove the tower and store it somewhere, if you don't wakeboard much or haven't progressed yet. Put it back on when you want it, or hang onto it for resale. No biggie.

Edit: On the dings and scratches, don't worry about it. If it had none, they would just be asking more money for it. Mine has some similar to yours.

Damn.. That is a good looking boat man!

I'm gonna drive down there and look at it Saturday, just to make 100% sure this is what I want and not waste anybodys time. Then i will go for a water test.. Crossing my fingers everything works out.. I really like this boat compared to the others i have looked at

[94malibu]

No HDS to worry about on the '94 Echelon, factory shaft log. Someone mentioned earlier to check drip rate. Rest of the advice is golden.

It'll either have the silent rider fiberglass muffler which is up high behind the engine and crosses over between the two manifolds or it will have two metal mufflers on the floor further back. Check either way for cracks or rust and make sure the rubber flappers on the outside are there and in decent shape.

What rubber flappers on the outside?

[Slayer]

You've been given great advise so far. It's the same good advice I got when posting about my first Malibu purchase.

For $8500....I'd be all over that thing! Since you're mechanically inclined, you'll have no issue servicing the boat. Good luck, and welcome to the crew!

[jk13]

Which is better to have? fiberglass muffler or metal mufflers?

Fiberglass silent choice is quieter and was an upgrade, longevity should be similar. Either is fine. My brother has the fiberglass and I have the metal. Both boats are 20 years old.

What rubber flappers on the outside?

Where the exhaust exits the boat on the outside under the platform there should be rubber flappers that keep some things out with the engine off and quiet it down a bit.

[chefred112]

..see the 2 black circular openings at lower rear of boat..look closer and there are flaps on them...

[Woodshed]

I have a 96 Echelon LX I bought two years ago. It was the best purchase I made for the family,, EVER! That boat is worth about 10-11 so that boat at 8500 is a great deal in my opinion.

My buddy just bought the same boat, same tower, same color, not as nice shape as this last fall for 10k ish.

The computron on mine was bad as well. It is very very rare to find one that works and the company that made it is out of business... ya think??? their product was terrible!! So you cannot get parts to make it work. Most disconnect it as yours and mine are or just ignore it. The problem with mine was that everytime I started the boat it let out a god awful high pitched tone that made everybody in the boat look at me like "what the heck was that???"

I agree with the engine warnings post,,, but if everything else in it fails,,,, why would you trust it when it gives you an engine warning?? Mine was going off everytime I started and the depth finder,,, with no readout would warn me at random times with the same squeal. I wouldn't trust anything about it. It's not a critical tool to have anyway. The speed control on it was a just display to let you know if you are faster or slower to a speed you desired to be at. It wouldn't actually "take control" of the the throttle as Perfect Pass does. No loss there either.

I was the one that got Cory from Evolution covers to pattern the Echelon LX. They are fairly expensive but WELL worth the money. For a high end custome fit cover his are in the right price range. If you get an "el cheapo" for half the money,, you get what you pay for. It'll prob. work well but wont last as long. The cover and Cory are very very quality product. I highly recommend bucking up for his cover if you can swing it. If you think you'll keep the boat long term it'll be cheaper as you wont need to replace anytime this decade. Anybody that knows Malibu's knows his cover and I would think would be a big positive for resale.

The vinyl on the seats are in excellent shape. A new interior for seats and carpet will run you 3k at least prob. closer to 4 when it's all done. That is a big deal!

You will be surprised how easy that boat will be for a guy with your skills to work on. They are much simpler than a car and have much better access to parts. No worries there for you.

I wouldn't hesitate at all about a 20 year old boat having a new motor!! If it was a new motor. That is a good thing I think. Why would you want the old one.... With that few hours,, it could be much worse to have the original. At 300 hours,,, that motor has just broke in is it.. That's a great! As one poster said,,, the guy prob. screwed up and didn't winterize the motor,, it froze and he cracked the block. It happens every year to some folks. That's a huge expensive fix that they did and now you get a new motor... not bad.

Alot of the surface scratches can be buffed out. You'll be amazed what a solid afternoon with a buffer and compound, then polish will do to that boat. The deep ones,,, live with or have fixed by a fiberglass guy. Personally I only get the ones fixed that go down to the fabric in the glass so they don't cause further damage. A gel coat gouge looks awful,,, but will not affect the boat entegrity. It happens.

I don't know if you were torn on this style of boat vs. a runabout inboard outboard V hull style boat, but this is WAY better! I would much rather have an older more used inboard competition boat than a runabout anyday! The performance is hands down significantly better as is the "cool" factor. This boat will serve your family in every way as a tow boat. They are less comfortable, have less room, rougher ride in chop, take waves now and again if your not careful,,,, but it's a totally awesome ski boat. Lots of muscle, lots of performance, great wake for skiing, fast, and most importantly,,,,, LOOKS COOL!! Runabouts are like a station wagon an Echelon LX is a Corvette.

I'd buy it! Have fun! Your family will love it.

Feel free to call me if you have more specific questions I can help you with. If so PM me and I will send you my number.

Woodshed

[D-GOOSE]

Not true unless I'm missing something. Please fill me in. Delta Props price is cheaper and has free shipping as well!!

I've said it once and I'll say it again. Wakeprops.com , Better than the group buy!

ACME 515 3 Blade 13" x 12" Propeller

Wakemakers price

Availability Price Qty

Ships in 1-2 days

Was: $477.00

Now: $389.99

Delta Props

Price: US$381.60
Retail Price :US$477.00

[Steve B.]

Overall, I'd say a good buy too. As long as it runs good and nothing major hidden.

Let us know how it goes,

Steve B.

[TrickyNicky]

Not true unless I'm missing something. Please fill me in. Delta Props price is cheaper and has free shipping as well!!

ACME 515 3 Blade 13" x 12" Propeller

Wakemakers price

Availability Price Qty

Ships in 1-2 days

Was: $477.00

Now: $389.99

Delta Props

Price: US$381.60

Retail Price :US$477.00

My experience:

1939:

Wakeprops: $430

Delta: $488 (no discount), Came out to more than $430 when I used the code (now expired).

Shipping was the icing on the cake for me.

Don't mean to argue, but my results worked out better for me before and after shipping. The only way I would have saved was if I was getting my old prop fixed AND lived in the US and it would still have been negligible. Feel free to PM me if you'd like to discuss further.

[chefred112]

"I don't know if you were torn on this style of boat vs. a runabout inboard outboard V hull style boat, but this is WAY better! I would much rather have an older more used inboard competition boat than a runabout anyday! The performance is hands down significantly better as is the "cool" factor. This boat will serve your family in every way as a tow boat. They are less comfortable, have less room, rougher ride in chop, take waves now and again if your not careful,,,, but it's a totally awesome ski boat. Lots of muscle, lots of performance, great wake for skiing, fast, and most importantly,,,,, LOOKS COOL!! Runabouts are like a station wagon an Echelon LX is a Corvette."

Here is a funny thing...I own 2 boats, a 93 Echelon LX and a 95 190 Four Winns Horizon runabout. I bought the Echelon because the runabout broke down 8 years ago and I was quoted 7k to fix and decided to let it sit. Earlier this year an opportunity came up to buy the Echelon for 4k (a total steal...with only 250 hours) and I did. I've always wanted a ski boat but could never afford one. Then while looking to get rid of the runabout I found someone to fix it parts and labor for $1500 and I was all over that too. Alot of the points you bring up are valid..the Echelon looks more sexy than the Horizon and the performance is better. But, when I'm doing anything with the family or friends where skiing isn't involved, hands down we take the Horizon. It rides like it's on pillows compared to the Echelon and we never have to worry about the low freeboard that the Echelon has as well. I'm keeping both boats because we love to camp with my other siblings and their families and having 2 boats is always better than 1

Edited June 5, 2013 by chefred112

[94malibu]

Alright.. update for you guys.. and it's bad news.. I was suppossed to be going this Sunday to buy the boat.. Have the cash in my hand.. The lady text me this morning and said.. '' I just sold the boat last night''... I was thinking.. WTF?? I can't be mad though... On to the next, I guess.

Now that i have heard so many good things this is the particular boat i am looking for now... either this or a 90-91 master craft pro star 190..

I actually found a nice 95 malibu response.. Could you guys tell me what you think about it for around $8500? Are they similar.. obviously it's not open bow, but would it be a good boat to own as well? He mentioned about having to have some kind of shaft repacked? Not sure....

here is the ad:

http://louisville.craigslist.org/boa/3807916547.html

[BlastRlxi]

Alright.. update for you guys.. and it's bad news.. I was suppossed to be going this Sunday to buy the boat.. Have the cash in my hand.. The lady text me this morning and said.. '' I just sold the boat last night''... I was thinking.. WTF?? I can't be mad though... On to the next, I guess.

Now that i have heard so many good things this is the particular boat i am looking for now... either this or a 90-91 master craft pro star 190..

I actually found a nice 95 malibu response.. Could you guys tell me what you think about it for around $8500? Are they similar.. obviously it's not open bow, but would it be a good boat to own as well? He mentioned about having to have some kind of shaft repacked? Not sure....

here is the ad:

http://louisville.craigslist.org/boa/3807916547.html

Looks like a pretty good deal to me.

[MountainRob]

Those are great boats. A lot like a Skier. Packing the shaft is easy, and regular maintenance. It's just a packing "rope" that you cut and feed in under the nut on the shaft in the bilge.

Keep in mind it's a pretty small boat. If you're skiing or boarding, there's not room for more than a few people.

[CumminsBu]

I like the response better the the echelon, looks clean.