fogging the engine question

[jkendallmsce]

why go the trouble of paying for an oil stablizer and adding it to the engine, so the engine can sit all winter with dirty/contaminated oil...cause that oil traps metal chunks, water, condensation, etc.....why not change the oil, so there is fresh oil over the winter???

[Nitrousbird]

why go the trouble of paying for an oil stablizer and adding it to the engine, so the engine can sit all winter with dirty/contaminated oil...cause that oil traps metal chunks, water, condensation, etc.....why not change the oil, so there is fresh oil over the winter???

Exactly. I always change my oil when I winterize, and change the oil and filter in the spring. Makes sure any condensation over the winter is removed, plus helps flush out any debris that may have been left from the previous oil change. Cheap insurance to ensure your motor always has clean, fresh oil...these motors are pushed hard and should be given every chance they can get for a long life.

[jkendallmsce]

Exactly. I always change my oil when I winterize, and change the oil and filter in the spring. Makes sure any condensation over the winter is removed, plus helps flush out any debris that may have been left from the previous oil change. Cheap insurance to ensure your motor always has clean, fresh oil...these motors are pushed hard and should be given every chance they can get for a long life.

I agree...but why wait and change the filter in the spring? or did I read it wrong?

[Nitrousbird]

I agree...but why wait and change the filter in the spring? or did I read it wrong?

No reason to change it twice and I just happen to do it in the spring. Doesn't really matter.

[gorilla]

No reason to change it twice and I just happen to do it in the spring. Doesn't really matter.

So you change oil in the fall and the change oil and filter in the spring? You are changing oil twice? Wow, never done that before.

[jkendallmsce]

No reason to change it twice and I just happen to do it in the spring. Doesn't really matter.

NOw I am even more confused...do you change oil and filter in the fall or spring or both?

[skistud1]

I change mine in the fall right before I winterize. Why spend money on a product to "stabilize" the oil for the winter just put off changing the oil in the spring?

Edited September 13, 2012 by skistud1

[Nitrousbird]

NOw I am even more confused...do you change oil and filter in the fall or spring or both?

Change the oil in the fall, leaving the old oil filter. Change the oil AND filter in the spring.

So you change oil in the fall and the change oil and filter in the spring? You are changing oil twice? Wow, never done that before.

Think about it. If you leave it over the winter, you are leaving worn, old oil in your boat for say 6 months. If you change it in the fall, by the end of the season you are rocking oil that has been in there for a full year. Also, if it gets any condensation from extreme temp changes over the winter, you will be running with that condensation in the motor for a full season.

Further, it makes sure you have the freshest oil available in the motor come the start of the season. Any old oil that doesn't drain out of the pain, in the rocker valleys, and other various parts gets dilluted out then drained. These motors take a lot more abuse than a passenger car application. Oil isn't THAT expensive. I wouldn't do this with a full synthetic, but for on-sale dino oil, why not?

[jkendallmsce]

Change the oil in the fall, leaving the old oil filter. Change the oil AND filter in the spring.

Think about it. If you leave it over the winter, you are leaving worn, old oil in your boat for say 6 months. If you change it in the fall, by the end of the season you are rocking oil that has been in there for a full year. Also, if it gets any condensation from extreme temp changes over the winter, you will be running with that condensation in the motor for a full season.

Further, it makes sure you have the freshest oil available in the motor come the start of the season. Any old oil that doesn't drain out of the pain, in the rocker valleys, and other various parts gets dilluted out then drained. These motors take a lot more abuse than a passenger car application. Oil isn't THAT expensive. I wouldn't do this with a full synthetic, but for on-sale dino oil, why not?

I think I got ya! I agree with the oil being cheap compared to a new LS3 or a new monsoon...yikes. I change oil and filter in the fall...but our off season here in CA is pretty short. And GM/Indmar recommend Mobil 1 synthetic, so thats what I have been using..catch it on sale at Costco. The boat is only outta the water about 3 months. Nov, Dec and Jan....maybe part of Feb depending on the weather. I used to water ski out on the delta all year, and enjoyed the winter months the most, as all the chuckleheads were off doing other things...so ya had the whole delta to yourself outside of a few bassholes. Getting longer in the tooth, and cold water shooting up the arse is not as enjoyable as it used to be.

[wpgskier]

Change the oil in the fall, leaving the old oil filter. Change the oil AND filter in the spring.

If I understand correctly ... the winter oil is never used ? You put it in in the fall, and drain it in the spring, but the engine never turns over in between ? If that is the case, what would be the risk of just leaving the oil pan empty over the winter ? Everything in side would still have a film on it ?

Just a thought ...

[gorilla]

I wouldn't do this with a full synthetic, but for on-sale dino oil, why not?

Yeah, I totally understand. But.....I am running synthetic Mobil 1 (15-50) and it does make for a bit more expensive oil change. An oil change is way cheaper than an engine and I should do it twice, but I don't know of anyone doing that. I could easily put cheap dino oil in for the winter and put the Mobil 1 oil in for the summer season.

[Tims]

Oil companies love you guys.

[Bozboat]

If I understand correctly ... the winter oil is never used ? You put it in in the fall, and drain it in the spring, but the engine never turns over in between ? If that is the case, what would be the risk of just leaving the oil pan empty over the winter ?

Well, there is a chance, however slight, of someone starting the engine in the spring without checking the oil level

[Tims]

Just wondering. Who has had mechanical failures or premature wear due to leaving 50 hour oil in the sump over the winter? I am all about PM but are we going overboard? I am more worried about the electronics on the boat than the engine. How about some electrical PM suggestions?

[BlastRlxi]

Just wondering. Who has had mechanical failures or premature wear due to leaving 50 hour oil in the sump over the winter? I am all about PM but are we going overboard? I am more worried about the electronics on the boat than the engine. How about some electrical PM suggestions?

You may be right about the oil change but I'm to chicken to find out on an expensive boat. That said, I never change the oil in small engine power equipment. My oldest engine is a 3hp Briggs & Stratton on an edger that is 15 years old with the original oil in it. It still starts on one pull and runs great. I bet that eventually I will have saved enough in oil (not to mention my time) not changing it than the engine is worth. Has anyone ever had a lawn mower or other power equipment engine fail due to dirty oil?

[Falko]

At most, I'll take the old oil out in the Fall, but don't refill until spring. I don't see the object of putting oil in an engine and letting it sit all winter, especially to drain it again and re-fill with fresh. That oil only sits in the oil pan, it doesn't do anything for the engine, well keeps the oil pump lubed. I know people who add oil treatments in the last days of running that forms a coating, supposedly, in the engine components so it is sure to be coated over the winter, but I've never done nor plan to. Just my thoughts on it, opinions and boat colors vary....

[Oberon]

Change the oil in the fall, leaving the old oil filter. Change the oil AND filter in the spring.

Think about it. If you leave it over the winter, you are leaving worn, old oil in your boat for say 6 months. If you change it in the fall, by the end of the season you are rocking oil that has been in there for a full year. Also, if it gets any condensation from extreme temp changes over the winter, you will be running with that condensation in the motor for a full season.

Further, it makes sure you have the freshest oil available in the motor come the start of the season. Any old oil that doesn't drain out of the pain, in the rocker valleys, and other various parts gets dilluted out then drained. These motors take a lot more abuse than a passenger car application. Oil isn't THAT expensive. I wouldn't do this with a full synthetic, but for on-sale dino oil, why not?

There is no difference between leaving oil in the container it comes in over the winter and leaving it in your engine. Oil doesn't expire, it breaks down due to acids and sediment from the combustion process. No combustion means no break down. So, when you replace the oil you put in the engine in the Fall you are essentially throwing away new oil. Further, if you are leaving the oil in the filter over the winter it suggests that you don't start the engine after the Fall oil change which means you aren't taking advantage of the new oil by coating the internals of the engine. If you are starting the engine after the Fall change you are coating the engine with dilluted oil. It's better than old oil but not as good as new oil. Old oil on engines means possible corrosion due to the acids suspended in the oil. Any condensation from the winter will evaporate off as soon as the engine gets to temperature. If you want to continue changing the oil twice I suggest changing the filter in the Fall. Edited September 24, 2012 by Oberon

[Sixball]

Put some used oil in a bottle and let it sit for a month or two. Dump it out and see what is left in the jar. The crud left is no different then what will be in your engine .

Then you will put clean fresh oil in it a cleaning and lubricant. So now you have crud in your fresh oil. Just not a good idea.

[EchelonMike]

Oil companies love you guys.

No kidding! I think some of the winterization work people do is way overkill. I don't have cats on my hammerhead (2002 model) so I spray the fog right down the engine's throat!

Removing every spark plug to fog seems like a lot of wasted time and effort - when you spray fog into the intake, it is coating everything in the intake path down into the cylinders. If cats cannot take fog, then spraying into the cylinders will still get burned when you start her up...and will get into the cats anyway...so what's the difference?

My other list of winterization do and do-nots...YMMV:

I would never leave dirty oil from a season of running in the boat over the winter. Nor would I replace clean oil I just changed in the fall with zero hours again in the spring. You have to drain the old oil and replace the filter. Then start up the engine and work all the new oil thru the engine. Then fog. Then drain the water.

I don't fill the engine with anti-freeze. Again, I think it is unnecessary if you get all the water out of it properly in the first place. Plus, in the spring, you don't fill the yard with poison when you start it - or worse, do the first start when sitting in a lake or river. People talk about corrosion protection with the anti-freeze, but the engine holds water inside it most months of the year - if it is going to get internal corrosion, it will happen being wet vs dry in winter storage.

I do change my transmission fluid every fall even though that is probably overkill - but the tranny works hard and less than 2 quarts of ATF is crazy-cheap insurance, and it takes me 10 min to change it (HINT: get a mity-vac from harbor freight. Measure what you draw out and put back in exactly what you take out).

Edited September 25, 2012 by EchelonMike

[gorilla]

Removing every spark plug to fog seems like a lot of wasted time and effort - when you spray fog into the intake, it is coating everything in the intake path down into the cylinders. If cats cannot take fog, then spraying into the cylinders will still get burned when you start her up...and will get into the cats anyway...so what's the difference?

Actually, not wasted time and effort. When I spray into each cylinder, I spray for just about 2 seconds and crank the motor over with no fuel pump and "coat" the entire cylinder. When you fog through the intake, that fogging oil is everywhere in the intake and heads. That stuff will be constantly sucked into the cylinders in the spring. That's what fouls the cats. The 1-2 second startup smoke from fogging the individual cylinders will do some damage to the cats, but not like it would with the motor sucking the fogging oil for a few minutes to clear out the entire intake tract. I guarantee that I use way less fogging oil that you do. Not arguing, just stating the facts that I have learned last season before I winterized my own boat.

[EchelonMike]

Actually, not wasted time and effort. When I spray into each cylinder, I spray for just about 2 seconds and crank the motor over with no fuel pump and "coat" the entire cylinder. When you fog through the intake, that fogging oil is everywhere in the intake and heads. That stuff will be constantly sucked into the cylinders in the spring. That's what fouls the cats. The 1-2 second startup smoke from fogging the individual cylinders will do some damage to the cats, but not like it would with the motor sucking the fogging oil for a few minutes to clear out the entire intake tract. I guarantee that I use way less fogging oil that you do. Not arguing, just stating the facts that I have learned last season before I winterized my own boat.

True, you'd use less fog - if you have cats I guess that's important.

[gorilla]

True, you'd use less fog - if you have cats I guess that's important.

yup, those are way too much $$$$ to replace.

[augie09]

so just pull the safety lanyard and turn the key for a 2 seconds after spraying fogging oil, but before putting plugs back in?

[Chaabo]

so just pull the safety lanyard and turn the key for a 2 seconds after spraying fogging oil, but before putting plugs back in?

When I pull my safety lanyard (2010 Response) the boat won't turn over at all.

In fact all the engine's electricity and all the gauges are dead.

Just the ZO is working.

I sprayed fogging oil through the spark plug holes and turned the engine over w/o the sparks.

Then I sprayed another small amount of fogging oil into the cylinders and put the sparks back in.

[augie09]

That's what I thought mine did to, no lanyard = no crank.

So you cranked with fuel spraying in an open cylinder? Seems risky, but with spark plugs guess its ok.