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23 to 25 LSV....Should we?


yotaisgame

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53 minutes ago, tjklein said:

 

The 23' will most likely continue to be the #1 boat in the line for a few reasons. One of them being some people don't want a monster boat again for a variety of reasons. Also, let's not act like the 23' boats don't put out a really good wave. Is it a 25'? No, but blows it away? That's like the person who always says "it's not even close".  And yes, I've been behind both sizes, multiple times. How you set up the boats makes a big difference.

#1 sold boat alone will keep resale high.  I definitely agree that 20, 21, and 22' boats are declining.

I completely agree on these points.  We've been able to get outstanding performance from our 2021 23 this year.  It's much improved over the previous generation's hull.  There's also a market dynamic in play here.  Some regions are not friendly to larger boats.  Some lakes even have size restrictions.  This is a consideration for some as well.  

 

  

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1 hour ago, Slayer said:

I completely agree on these points.  We've been able to get outstanding performance from our 2021 23 this year.  It's much improved over the previous generation's hull.  There's also a market dynamic in play here.  Some regions are not friendly to larger boats.  Some lakes even have size restrictions.  This is a consideration for some as well.  

 

  

Curious, do you weight your bow? And how is the new hull for taking on any waves?

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Part of the fact the 23 is bestseller is the fact that for a LONG time (since the sport started) u basically needed a 23 to surf without dangerously overloading your boat.. or if u wanted to drop a rope.. 

If you are into the sport u don't go smaller than 23 period.. anything less than a 23.. well.. just ain't all that great for surfing.. sure there have been a ton of improvements.. but at the end it the day...it's not a great surfboat unless it's 23+.. Keep in mind previous to surfing 23s we're BIG! 

unless forced to by lake size restrictions, financial situation or budget, garages space etc.. you don't go less than a 23 for surfing.. I'll catch heat for saying it but it became the go to for good reason over the years...

Simply put bigger is better and the trend will continue.. just look how much bigger and heavier a 23 is compared to a 23 when surfing began.. 

Edited by The Hulk
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6 minutes ago, TwoMargaritasPlease said:

Curious, do you weight your bow? And how is the new hull for taking on any waves?

I have about 150# up there.  I also have some on the port side to offset prop torque.  If we have our normal crew, there are usually 3 kids up there.  

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1 hour ago, The Hulk said:

just look how much bigger and heavier a 23 is compared to a 23 when surfing began.. 

I see this with our current 2013 23lsv. Clearly not a boat designed for surfing but does have surfgates. Honestly I like the wave ours make but I have nothing to compare it to. "What you don't know you don't know"

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1 hour ago, yotaisgame said:

I see this with our current 2013 23lsv. Clearly not a boat designed for surfing but does have surfgates. Honestly I like the wave ours make but I have nothing to compare it to. "What you don't know you don't know"

Not designed for surfing? In 2013 I bought a new 23lsv. When weighted right it threw an amazing wave. In 2019 I bought a new 25lsv. I paid twice what I paid for the 23, but I don't have twice the wave. Boat prices are going up exponentially, while waves are improving incrementally. If you have your wave dialed in, go demo all the competition, you'll see what I mean.

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6 hours ago, The Hulk said:

IMO not needed with newer 1/2 tons with 10speed and larger engines such as the bigger ford Ecoboost. handles just fine for "most people who tow hardly ever". Granted if you tow every time or if your in the mountains yea get a 3/4 and never look back. For the in/out once a year folks not needed.. Granted you should have a higher end 1/2 ton with larger engine 10-speed and max tow pkgs which can easily cost as much or more than a moderate equipped 3/4.

also the triple ax trailer has far less tounge weight than the dual ax, but PIA for tight ramps so consider that option based on truck, ramps, needs etc.. 

 

 

 

 

I wonder if with the trend to the bigger, heavier boats,  people might start looking at the electric over hydraulic breaks for these heavy boats and backing them down ramps?  I don't want to derail the topic here and there is a dedicated EOH thread in the Trailer and Tow Rig forum, but I thought it might be worth mentioning here.

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1 hour ago, TwoMargaritasPlease said:

Not designed for surfing? In 2013 I bought a new 23lsv. When weighted right it threw an amazing wave. In 2019 I bought a new 25lsv. I paid twice what I paid for the 23, but I don't have twice the wave. Boat prices are going up exponentially, while waves are improving incrementally. If you have your wave dialed in, go demo all the competition, you'll see what I mean.

We have ours weighted right. Been since 2014 to get that right. Unless the hulls are different the 08-13 are all very similar or the same. Wasn’t until 2015 for a big redesign. Another reason we’ve taken so long to upgrade. In 15 or around there the gates were bigger, faster, and the transmission received a better gear ratio for surfing. We have very defined walls with our boat for surfing and wakeboarding. Never said we didn’t enjoy the wave we have now. The industry has changed a lot since 2013. We’ve held out a long time because we never felt like upgrading was worth it. But when stuff starts frequently failing and the boats have changed enough we felt like it was time. 
 

Twice the money = twice the wave? ….oookay 

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52 minutes ago, yotaisgame said:

We have ours weighted right. Been since 2014 to get that right. Unless the hulls are different the 08-13 are all very similar or the same. Wasn’t until 2015 for a big redesign. Another reason we’ve taken so long to upgrade. In 15 or around there the gates were bigger, faster, and the transmission received a better gear ratio for surfing. We have very defined walls with our boat for surfing and wakeboarding. Never said we didn’t enjoy the wave we have now. The industry has changed a lot since 2013. We’ve held out a long time because we never felt like upgrading was worth it. But when stuff starts frequently failing and the boats have changed enough we felt like it was time. 
 

Twice the money = twice the wave? ….oookay 

I agree with your reasoning, that's why I have a new(er) boat. In 9 years all manufacturers have stepped up with some great improvements. But I've yet to see any truly impressive wave performance improvements.   

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On 10/22/2021 at 3:55 PM, yotaisgame said:

We have ours weighted right. Been since 2014 to get that right. Unless the hulls are different the 08-13 are all very similar or the same. Wasn’t until 2015 for a big redesign. Another reason we’ve taken so long to upgrade. In 15 or around there the gates were bigger, faster, and the transmission received a better gear ratio for surfing. We have very defined walls with our boat for surfing and wakeboarding. Never said we didn’t enjoy the wave we have now. The industry has changed a lot since 2013. We’ve held out a long time because we never felt like upgrading was worth it. But when stuff starts frequently failing and the boats have changed enough we felt like it was time. 
 

Twice the money = twice the wave? ….oookay 

Assuming we are still talking 23LSV, 2014 was the first “big” hull redesign (not 2015) and widely believed to be the first 23LSV hull developed with Surfgate known (2013 had gates but on a hull not developed specifically with gates).   
 

2014 - 2017 same hull

2018-2020 same hull

2021 - current same hull

Malibu never seems to be forthcoming with hull changes, but I believe I got those year ranges right as generally accepted  on TMC as different/redesigned.   Of course, dash/helm, engine options, tranny ratio, etc. are updated throughout all those years and not necessarily on the same schedule as the hull.  2014 to 2015 is an example - same hull, but the 2014 dash was a one and done only offered that year and 2015 got the 12” and 7” screens we have today (although those were slightly refreshed in 2020).   

 

 

 

Edited by hethj7
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46 minutes ago, TwoMargaritasPlease said:

I agree with your reasoning, that's why I have a new(er) boat. In 9 years all manufacturers have stepped up with some great improvements. But I've yet to see any truly impressive wave performance improvements.   

Jack says the 27lsv will be the game changer your looking for 😂

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I thought 14 and 13 had the same dash? I know they had the same viper screens. Exactly my point from earlier. 13 was not a boat designed for gates. We specifically bought a 13 knowing resale would be much better than a 12 and that if we had gotten a 12 would have been upgrading pretty quick. 

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11 minutes ago, yotaisgame said:

I thought 14 and 13 had the same dash? I know they had the same viper screens. 

Nope, dash was different. 2014 has always had a stigma of a one and done design, although the boat performs awesome.  
 


 

 

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