Replace Delaminated MTC With Manual Switch Panel on 2013 TXI

[4skinuts]

My boat had a delaminated Malibu Touch Control (MTC) screen that Malibu or Medallion should have already repaired through a recall.  This is a longtime known problem with no solution presented by Malibu or Medallion.  This picture was taken earlier in the summer.  The delamination progressed after this picture until the MTC was no longer functional.

After installation:

Yes, I could buy a new MTC; but, they are expensive and there is no guarantee that the new one will not delaminate in a couple of years.  I decided I would convert my boat to an inexpensive manual switch panel and hope that someone will eventually develop a reliable touch panel replacement for the MTC at a reasonable cost.  My son was the brains behind the wiring for this modification.  We made no changes on my boat that can’t be undone in just a few minutes.  No wires were cut.

Disclaimer – Do not attempt this modification unless you have a good understanding of circuits and how to make safe wiring connections.  We accept no liability for you attempting this modification and damaging your boat or possible harm to someone.  There are multiple options for completing this modification.  I am simply sharing how we resolved this issue and completed this modification on my TXI. 

Tools and Supplies Needed:  Wire cutter, wire terminal crimping tool, knife, Phillips screwdriver, socket wrench with ½” deep well socket, heat gun, label maker, 16-gauge red wire, 16-gauge black wire, .250” terminal connectors, 1 set T-Tap terminal connector, .250” female flag terminals right angle electrical connectors 16 Ga., zip ties, and heat shrink tubing. One ¼” stainless steel Hex nut.

Estimated Time to Complete: It took us a couple of months working sporadically to investigate circuitry, locate and order switch panel, wire switch panel, install, and troubleshoot.  Plan on a month lead time to order and receive the switch panel. (They do offer expedited production for an extra fee.)  If installing a second switch panel it would probably take 4 hours to wire and install.

Difficulty Rating: The project is not physically difficult; but, it requires a lot of thought.  The circuit designs are not consistent between functions. 

Preparation:  We reviewed the functions controlled by the MTC to decide which switches to order on the new switch panel.  We decided if the switch should be an on-off switch or an on-off-on switch.  For instance, I chose an on-off-on switch for navigation and anchor lights.  In the down position the switch turns on the anchor lights.  In the up position it turns on both the bow and anchor lights. My boat does not have a wedge or ballast.

The fuse panel has a sticker on it with a diagram of what the fuses control. 

We moved fuses to the bypass location one at a time and observed what they control.  We also disconnected the red wires at the top of the fuse panel one at a time and tested to see what each of them controlled. 

After determining what we wanted to control by switch and how the circuits worked, my son drew a diagram to follow when wiring and installing the switch panel.  We wired the switch panel at the house before taking it to the lake to install.  We added labels to the wires to make installation easier.

 

Description / How-to Section

The replacement switch panel was ordered from New Wire Marine (newwiremarine.com)  I used their E-Panel Builder to design the switch panel and then sent notes for them to make some spacing adjustments that I could not control through the E-Panel builder.  I ordered the panel without the wiring.  Their wiring is designed for “homerun” applications.  We wanted to utilize the wiring already in place that ran to the fuse box, so we wired the switch panel ourselves. 

New Wire Marine will send a wiring diagram that includes each type of switch upon request.  They offer a pdf proof for $20.  The proof allowed me to see an obvious mistake that I had made that could then be corrected before production.

Proof:

New Wire Marine has a variety of colors and designs of panels and switches.  I chose the carbon fiber design because it blended with portions of the steering wheel.  I chose the red lights on the switches because the gauges are red when lit.  I chose the rocker switches because that was what I was used to in my prior boats.  I chose a circuit breaker for each switch for added safety.  The switch panel as designed with one proof cost $185.  I spent about $30 - $40 more on wire and terminal connectors.  Below is a picture of the wiring diagram that my son drew for us to follow during the installation.

 

 

We used heat shrink on all the terminal connections added.  The wire is slipped through the heat shrink tube; the terminal connector is crimped onto the wire; the heat shrink is moved to cover the terminal connector; and then heated with a heat gun to shrink it into place.  The wires were then connected to the switch panel following the above diagram.

Remove the two nuts that hold the MTC in place.  I used a socket wrench with a ½” deep well socket to remove the nuts.  Cut the zip ties (Be careful not to cut any wires.) holding the MTC wiring harness in place so that the MTC can be relocated and mounted somewhere under the dash.  I found the back of a bolt high above the kick plate to the left of the heater vent that is probably from the back of the front seat that I mounted my MTC to using a ¼” nut. 

When I first installed the manual switch panel without the MTC connected, I received a flashing error message on the Malibu In-Dash display.   

Leaving the MTC plugged in eliminated this error message.

Install the new switch panel on the mounting studs on the back of the dash where the MTC unit was removed.  I was about 1/8th inch off on my measurement of the mounting post width.  I drilled the holes out to a 5/16” hole and then the posts fit into the holes.  You may see a small gap between the new switch panel and the dash at the bottom.  (See the second picture in this post.)  My measurement for the height was a little too large.  The switch panel is catching on the curved part of the back of the dash before it is snug to the opening area.  I will remove it this winter and trim it too fit better. 

We would turn the red battery selector switch off before making wiring changes and then turn it back on to test.  Note: The red battery connector switch does not disconnect power to the automatic bilge feature.  We did not learn this until after we had ordered the switch panel. Nothing is wired to the auto side of my bilge switch.  I may order a new bilge switch that is an on-off switch to replace the on-off-on switch that I have.

For most functions, we removed the red wire female terminal from the fuse box male terminal for the applicable switch circuit and connected the wiring for the switch circuit between these two points.  The fuse was moved from the current location to the bypass location for the applicable function.  This method worked for Interior/Cabin Lights, Bilge, Bow/Nav Lights, and the Blower. 

The dash and anchor lights were powered by the same red lead feeding the fuse box, so we used a T-Tap to connect to the anchor wire in the plug that is plugged into the fuse panel. 

If you look closely at the wires, you will see that these wires are labeled.  I believe the anchor light was labeled stern.  The ground wires were then connected to the ground terminal block using a Phillips screwdriver to remove and reinstall the screws.

Remove the anchor fuse.  This fuse joined the Dash/Panel and Nav/Anchor switches together due to the shared red wire feeding the fuse panel. The anchor light circuit is still protected by the circuit breaker in the switch panel.

We now use the backup key start located by the driver seat under the throttle control.  The backup ignition switch would not stop the engine when we first tested it.  We discovered that it can be used to start and stop the engine if the MTC unit is unplugged or if it is plugged in and the security code has not been entered on the MTC.

Wrap-Up

I love the simplicity of the rocker switches, instead of placing my finger on the screen multiple times trying to get the MTC to acknowledge me.  The touch screen did not easily acknowledge cold fingers or fingers damp from sweat, sunscreen, or swimming.  The bypass ignition switch is not conveniently located.  I will take a better look at this over the winter to see where I may be able to relocate it to.  The only functionality that I have lost is the 3-minute automatic blower that runs when the dash power button is pressed.

If doing this again, I would:

-          choose an On-off switch for bilge instead of on-off-on for auto bilge

-          request 5/16” mounting holes instead of ¼” holes and remeasure the distance of the studs for a more accurate measurement.

-          extend the notch cut out to avoid the back of the power button to extend ½” lower.

-          shorten the overall height of the switch panel so it would fit the dash without a gap at the bottom.

-          test the terminal connectors to make sure the protective plastic will nest together.  I had to split the sides on the plastic covering of some of the terminal connectors so that the two would mate.

-          daisy chain the ground wires for the switch lights and run one ground to the ground terminal block instead of running a wire for each switch.

When investigating what the bypass fuses control, DO NOT MOVE THE IGNITION FUSE TO THE BYPASS SLOT.  We were trying to determine how to get the ignition key to stop the engine and moved the fuse as a test.  When we powered the system, the engine started.  Neither the MTC nor the ignition key would stop the engine.  Only the safety lanyard would stop the engine.  I suppose moving the ignition fuse to the bypass location would be a solution if your MTC goes out while you are on the lake and you do not have a backup ignition key.

[bobby83860]

Great post! As a aircraft avionics mechanic I can see the hard work you put into this.  If cuescreens doesn't come through this might have to be my solution.  I would see about adding switches for the power wedge surfgate and ballast pumps.  A lot more research would be needed to figure out how to get the water in and out of the the boat with switches.

[4skinuts]

@bobby83860

The fuse box has fuses labeled for wedge up and wedge down.  You should be able to insert a switch in a manner similar to what I did above for the wedge. I did not see any wiring for surf gate or ballast. These were probably not options on a TXI. The first place I would look would be your fuse box to see if it has fuses labeled for these functions. If not take a look at the print on the wires in the wiring harness plugged in to the fuse box to see if any are for ballast or surf gate. Below is a picture of what I’m referring to.

I expect yours will have more wires than mine did. 

[ahopkins22LSV]

Wow! Good stuff and thanks for such a detailed post!

[Andrew63]

Great solution. Can't say I would be game but through frustration, we do push ourselves.

I have one of the last LXI's before the TXI so I only need the same functions outlined in this post.

I get lost with electrical stuff. Pity it could not be packaged as a simple kit with a wiring harness & the changes second time around for improvement to simplify the install.

I would order a kit & hunt down a local electrition to be the brains trust for the install wit an instruction wiring install sheet.

@4skinuts maybe a sideline business for your son. Count me in from Down under

[4skinuts]

@Andrew63

I agree that this would be a good sideline business for someone.  If they were to source a set of male female plugs to insert at this location with the switches wired into this section it would be simple to install.  My son would be capable; but, has moved away, started a new job, and has no time available  

[windy1]

This is great but over my head. Any crew members know of any electronicts company that could take this on and produce say 100-200 kits with easy instalation instructions and teck support. Then we can all say fork you Madalion.

[justgary]

I'd be willing to kit these up, but I have no access to any boats with this problem.  It seems that one would need several varieties with ballast, wedge, etc. available.  One would also need to be able to carefully measure each style of boat in order to determine sizes and lengths.

@4skinuts- If you put the ignition fuse in the bypass position the engine cranks, right?  Does the engine die if you then remove that fuse?

[4skinuts]

@justgary 

Yes. Fuse in bypass ignition slot will crank the engine. I did not test removing the fuse to kill the engine. 

[justgary]

5 hours ago, 4skinuts said:

@justgary 

Yes. Fuse in bypass ignition slot will crank the engine. I did not test removing the fuse to kill the engine. 

If it does kill the engine, that would make it easy to control the engine with a switch as well.  

[Jhucke]

This is great, I have a feeling there is going to be way more of these types of fixes in the future across all brands.

[Bruises]

Wow @4skinuts, thank you!  Wife and I literally walked out  yesterday for a beautiful fall set in our 12 TXI and she looked at the MTC and you can imagine the rest… takes away from the thrill of brisk morning on glass with lake to ourselves. This is the second screen. Of course we had that “do we just sell it moment”.  Well done!

[Andrew63]

Unfortunatly down under with one replacement screen back in 2015 ($2k AUD then) & another looming ($5k AUD  shipping & taxes Now) I decided enough is enough.

Sold the boat last weekend.

Will leave it for a season & ski with a buddy.

This Covid Tax driving up prices made it a easy decision to sell, but a hard decision to buy with prices an all time high 

[braindamage]

@4skinuts do you have the model number or order reference from NWM for the switch unit? I see Writing on the back of the unit but it’s unclear if that’s a good reference.

[4skinuts]

@braindamage order # NWM43109 It’s shown at the bottom of the proof picture. See the 9th picture of the original post. If you order one, make sure you request the changes that I recommended in the original post. 

[dkscism]

Reviving this thread to see if anyone else has tried this? I would be interested if anyone with a power wedge/ballast/surfgate has attempted it. 

[dkscism]

also, couldn't you just T tap all of the wires like you did the anc lights? 

[4skinuts]

@dkscism As stated in the first post of the thread “There are multiple options for completing this modification.  I am simply sharing how we resolved this issue and completed this modification on my TXI.”

I chose the least invasive method we could think of.  In case a reasonably priced reliable replacement touch screen is produced in the future, I wanted to be able to uninstall the switch panel with minimal damage to the original wiring insulation. This was the only wire where we had to penetrate the wiring insulation to complete the installation.
 

I’m not an electronics expert; but, I don’t see why your solution wouldn’t work.

[dkscism]

Just now, 4skinuts said:

@dkscism As stated in the first post of the thread “There are multiple options for completing this modification.  I am simply sharing how we resolved this issue and completed this modification on my TXI.”

I chose the least invasive method we could think of.  In case a reasonably priced reliable replacement touch screen is produced in the future, I wanted to be able to uninstall the switch panel with minimal damage to the original wiring insulation. This was the only wire where we had to penetrate the wiring insulation to complete the installation.
 

I’m not an electronics expert; but, I don’t see why your solution wouldn’t work.

Thanks! Great job btw. I can't believe you're the only one to post results of doing this so far with all of the screen problems people have. 

[Malibro22]

Love the write up on this! Thanks for taking the time to share. Has anyone considered offering to kit this up? I know this has been asked before, but I see several people willing to pay for a kit. Just need someone to lead up an effort to order them. My screen is still limping along, but I for-see the day I will need either switches or a new screen. 

[justgary]

2 hours ago, Malibro22 said:

Has anyone considered offering to kit this up?

Only about twelve posts back....  It seems that everybody wants a kit, but nobody wants to actually do a little work to get one.  I don't know of anyone near me (Florida panhandle) with this issue, so I can't go do it myself.  It should only take a few iterations to get everything to work and look nice.

@4skinuts has done an excellent job of showing exactly what needs to happen, but my main questions are:

• What are the wire lengths required?  I prefer to have things fit correctly and look nice, so I would like to have somebody help that can actually measure things.
• Do all of the boats that might need this have the same dash cutout?
• Does everybody need a control for wedge and ballast also?  If so, where does this panel go?
• Are the wedge controls basically momentary contact switches?  What about ballast?
• Do some of you also need a remote key start?  If so, where does this panel go?
• What is the preferred panel material?  Carbon fiber is expensive; ABS doesn't look as nice.  Stainless steel might also be an option.
• How many of you would actually buy a kit?

[braindamage]

@justgaryone complication to look into: my dealer told me there doesn’t seem to be a standard configuration for what gets controlled via the fuse bypass panel. I found this to be startling. I’m not sure if it’s true. My panel matches @4skinuts exactly.

I can answer some questions from my perspective:

Do all of the boats that might need this have the same dash cutout? Don’t know. I could measure mine if that’s helpful.

Does everybody need a control for wedge and ballast also?  If so, where does this panel go? No ballast for me. I don’t use my wedge but would like the option in case my situation changes. I’d like in this panel, but that could be a separate panel mounted elsewhere if there’s not enough real estate.

Are the wedge controls basically momentary contact switches?  What about ballast? Wedge controls would be momentary contacts. I don’t have ballast.

Do some of you also need a remote key start?  If so, where does this panel go? There is a kit for key start already. I’d eliminate start from this panel to allow for other functions.

What is the preferred panel material?  Carbon fiber is expensive; ABS doesn't look as nice.  Stainless steel might also be an option. Expensive is relative. I’d prefer a better looking panel and would be willing to pay more for it.

How many of you would actually buy a kit? I would buy 1. If you were doing a production run, I’d probably buy one in anticipation of a screen failure.

Maybe others who have tighter “ins” with Malibu can answer how many variations of size and function.

yet another “cottage industry” 😁

Edited July 18, 2022 by braindamage

[braindamage]

@justgary one other idea, for the wedge you may be able to get a switch that lifts by momentary contact up, and lowers by momentary contact down. I think it would be a momentary DPDT?

[justgary]

11 hours ago, braindamage said:

@justgary one other idea, for the wedge you may be able to get a switch that lifts by momentary contact up, and lowers by momentary contact down. I think it would be a momentary DPDT?

Yes, that was exactly my thought.  In order to cram it onto the panel, one of the several light switches would need to get combined with another function, e.g. panel lights on navigation light switch.  That would still leave a problem with ballast if it needed to be on the same panel.  I would probably drop the breakers (each circuit is already fused) and try to get a second row of switches on the panel.  It might be too tight.

The driver board seems to have the following circuits:

• Wedge Down
• Wedge Up
• Interior Lights
• Dash Lights
• Anchor Lights
• Bow Light
• Docking Lights
• Blower
• Bilge Pump
• Ignition

So I guess ballast is separate anyway.  My thought with the start switch was to provide it if needed so you wouldn't have to buy the kit from Malibu.  I would expect it to be mounted in a remote location, which would also deter theft if you hid it a little.  If it works like I think it does (nobody confirmed it), it could just be another rocker switch that matches the others.

Thanks for your answers.

12 hours ago, braindamage said:

yet another “cottage industry” 😁

Indeed.

[braindamage]

Hi @justgary there will need to be a breaker of fuse panel as the bypass circuit’s purpose that we are tapping into is to bypass the fuse in case of an emergency.