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02 sensor delete for 2017 23 LSV (Monsoon 410 Raptor 6.2l)


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Hello,

Last year I dealt with an issue for the entirety of the season. My situation is challenging in that my dealer is 3 hours from my house, so bringing my boat in for service is a major endeavor. This issue popped up at the beginning of the season on the first ride out- I had a VERY loud buzzer go off that needs to be manually toggled off ever 2 minutes or so of use stating an o2 sensor fault. My dealer came up when they serviced a local summer camp and replaced one of the sensors. The repair stuck for a couple days, and then it started doing it again. I suffered through it last season, but it is both very annoying and also very embarrassing.

This year my dealer was supposed to come up and address it again, most likely replacing all four sensors and scoping the catalytic converters while they are at it (requiring them to take the boat back to replace the manifolds if the cats are bad.) Well, COVID-19 is here, summer camps aren't going to open at all, maybe never again (most won't be able to weather a full season of mortgages without income) so it is up in the air as to when, if at all, they will come.

I did hear there is an inexpensive patch that plugs inline with the sensors to eliminate the fault code. I understand that it effectively makes the o2 sensors useless, however that is a compromise I'm willing to temporarily make. Can anyone link me the part I need? I'm having trouble finding it. Also, do I need four?

Thanks,

Bob

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My money is on the cats.

It is possible to bypass the cats, but keep in mind that the engine will then run open loop instead of closed loop.  That will possibly mean higher fuel consumption and lower performance, but probably not a noticeable amount.  If done poorly, it could put the engine at risk due to heat accumulation from running too lean.

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1 hour ago, bm11 said:

 

I did hear there is an inexpensive patch that plugs inline with the sensors to eliminate the fault code. I understand that it effectively makes the o2 sensors useless, however that is a compromise I'm willing to temporarily make. Can anyone link me the part I need? I'm having trouble finding it. Also, do I need four?

Thanks,

Bob

Nope. There was on some of the older motors, 10 years back or so.

Dont compromise. Get it fixed. If you let it go it may not be warranty if some goes severely bad. I know you want to be on the water, but if the entire motor takes a crap you'll not only be out of the water, but possibly out many thousands of dollars.

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Guys, keep in mind that it isn't just time off the water. We are also talking about a 6 plus hour round trip to drop it off, followed by a six plus hour round trip to get it back. I'm not trying to be lazy, but I have limited days off, and this would mean take two of those. The boat runs fine, but the alarm is piercing.

You are sure there are no bypasses for this motor? If that is the case, does anyone know how to disable or even disconnect the alarm?

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I have been dealing with the same issues on my boat and my boat is at the dealer right now as I type this.  I am also 6 plus hours round trip to my dealer. They have replaced both o2 sensors and the port side catalytic converter.  That did not fix the check engine light and it came on all of last summer. 
 

So they told me they will replace the starboard side this week and clear the codes. Hopefully this fixes the problem.  Why is it embarrassing when the buzzer goes off?  Just hit cancel and move on. Since your Boat is under warranty, I would tell them to keep it and water test it as long as they can to make sure the code is gone. That’s what I told my dealer. I can’t use my boat even if it was warm, due to boat ramps being closed. 

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Is this the “fuel trim log” error? I think that’s what it’s labeled. I have been having this issue as well, usually under indie (slow no wake) for an extended period. Indmar told me that this is because the O2 sensors are in the corners of the manifold and when there isn’t pressure (boat under power), the carbon builds up and throws the sensor. He said it’s not an issue that I need to worry about and to just reset the boat and run it hard. Not exactly convenient, but it does work. 

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As LS1 said, my service guy said it is annoying to have the alarm go off, but it is 100% not hurting anything in the motor. Hopefully it will get fixed this week. I will keep you guys posted. 
 

Here is a pic of what I am getting. 
 

 

5F79744C-343B-4887-A8C9-900E7B00FDE4.jpeg

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ahopkinsVTX
2 hours ago, COOP said:

Nope. There was on some of the older motors, 10 years back or so.

Dont compromise. Get it fixed. If you let it go it may not be warranty if some goes severely bad. I know you want to be on the water, but if the entire motor takes a crap you'll not only be out of the water, but possibly out many thousands of dollars.

I agree. There is a known issue on the ford raptor engine with cat issues. if they are plugged the sensor error is the least of your concerns - it is only your warning before serious failures happen. You can heat up your exhaust to the point that hoses burst and you are completely down for weeks with major engine work. 

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If it is important for you to avoid possible issues with catalyst exhaust and O2 sensors, get a boat that already doesn't have them.  That would mean finding a Malibu built before 2007, or a 2019 Malibu with the PCM / Challenger 6.2 supercharged LSA engine.  I have seen a 2019 Malibu 25 LSV with that engine and no O2 sensors right from the factory.  Maybe have your dealer try to hunt one of these models down for you.

You may be able to find someone who can reprogram the ECM to eliminate the O2 sensors, if they don't mind breaking US EPA emissions laws and if you don't mind voiding your engine warranty, but I really wouldn't recommend it.

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I had my 2017 410 engine's Cats changed last year.  I was told there was an issue with some of the 2017 Raptors.  This was the alarm I was getting prior to them determining the Cats needed to be replaced.  

image.thumb.png.daaaf2687de31f0eefed2fadca138ba0.png

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Even though engine alarms are very annoying, they are there for a reason.  They have basically made operating a boat almost idiot proof. 

My boss had a friend that overheated and locked up the engine in their older 21' runabout.  He asked me why the boat owner had no warning before the engine failure and why the engine didn't go into a "limp home mode" before it seized up.  I found that not only was the boat carbureted, but the warning horn had been unplugged and disabled.  I told him on that boat, the "limp home mode" is directly controlled by the driver's brain and right hand when they start seeing smoke.

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4 hours ago, dwc032 said:

 Why is it embarrassing when the buzzer goes off?  Just hit cancel and move on.

It's embarrassing because I have a ton of friends with boats on the same lake, none of which cost half as much, and mine loudly announces that it is broken every two minutes.

4 hours ago, LS1boarder said:

Is this the “fuel trim log” error? I think that’s what it’s labeled. I have been having this issue as well, usually under indie (slow no wake) for an extended period. Indmar told me that this is because the O2 sensors are in the corners of the manifold and when there isn’t pressure (boat under power), the carbon builds up and throws the sensor. He said it’s not an issue that I need to worry about and to just reset the boat and run it hard. Not exactly convenient, but it does work. 

Exactly what are you doing to resolve it? I was told to "run it hard" but more often than not I've had the boat freighted with full ballast, plug and plays, wedge and a boat full of people, which must qualify based on the fact that that type of use makes them want to change the oil twice as often, right? I've also tried running from one end of the lake to the other at full speed, that didn't clear it up either. I may be missing the "reset the boat" part though and am curious to hear what you are doing.

 

3 hours ago, Hemmy said:

I had my 2017 410 engine's Cats changed last year.  I was told there was an issue with some of the 2017 Raptors.  This was the alarm I was getting prior to them determining the Cats needed to be replaced.  

 

Yeah that's the exact warning I'm getting. According to the service manager, it's a very common issue with these boats and often results in having to replace cats. He said that they are almost always blown out though, which carries almost zero risk of causing engine damage or being dead in the water like a plugged cat might. Hence my willingness to just turn off the buzzer via a delete.

 

5 hours ago, hawaiianstyln said:

is this what you are looking for? 

 

Yup. Does it work on my boat though?

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20 minutes ago, bm11 said:

I may be missing the "reset the boat" part though and am curious to hear what you are doing.

You’re not going to like this. Turn the boat off, shut off the batteries using the switch, wait a few seconds, turn them back on and fire the boat up again. I really want to get mine to the dealership too. 1.5 hours each way and COVID-19 has them so far behind, I would be throwing away my season to get it in with the waiting lists they have. 

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ahopkinsVTX

What’s more embarrassing? Listening to the alarm and the multiple people on here staying it’s a known, big problem, making an appointment with your dealer to get it in, burning the two days to take and pickup the boat and getting it fixed early season? Or ignoring it, trying to by pass it and doing extensive damage to your engine in front of all of your friends?

BTW, it’s Indmar that will be covering the cost of the warranty for it, not Malibu so any Indmar certified dealer can do it. 

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1 hour ago, bm11 said:

Yup. Does it work on my boat though?

it would work but this issue should have been fixed on your era boat versus mine (I would think).  I would call or email indmar and inquire, Larry usually responds quickly.  if it were me, yah I would burn a few days and get the warranty work done to fix it before I go cutting and installing resistors to block out the issue/concern

  • Like 2
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I had the same issue with my 2016 VTX with the same motor, once the O2 sensors were replaced it was never a problem. I agree with everyone else take it to your dealer or at least talk to them about it.  You may get lucking maybe they're delivering another boat in your area or they could possibly send you the senors and you could replace them yourself. 

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1 hour ago, dcarl said:

I had the same issue with my 2016 VTX with the same motor, once the O2 sensors were replaced it was never a problem. I agree with everyone else take it to your dealer or at least talk to them about it.  You may get lucking maybe they're delivering another boat in your area or they could possibly send you the senors and you could replace them yourself. 

good point even if they can send them to you in the mail, go to harbor freight or napa for the socket. should be roughly $7-$8

https://www.harborfreight.com/3-8-eighth-inch-offset-oxygen-sensor-wrench-97177.html

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On 5/5/2020 at 12:23 PM, hawaiianstyln said:

good point even if they can send them to you in the mail, go to harbor freight or napa for the socket. should be roughly $7-$8

https://www.harborfreight.com/3-8-eighth-inch-offset-oxygen-sensor-wrench-97177.html

They aren't apposed to mailing them to me. Ideally they come up and look at the manifolds with a scope when they do, to check the conditions of the cats.

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I had same issues.  The oxygen sensors are relatively cheap (under $100) socket was $8.  I changed out pre cat on port side.  No issue sense.  I'm also, several hours away from decent service.  I keep on both an extra pre cat and post cat sensor.  It is a five minute change out job once you know how.

 

Also, have been doing the "hot lap" maybe it is helping.  Bad design, but pretty easy overall to fix it so far.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I had the same issue pop up on my 18 MLX with the base Indmar 410 last week.  Dealer replaced the O2 sensors, but issue came back during test run.  Next step is to replace the cats.  Not exactly sure what the issue is with the cats but my question is once they replace the cats, does this fix the issue?  Did they update the part to prevent the issue or is this something I will be dealing with again in a few years?

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33 minutes ago, tex599 said:

I had the same issue pop up on my 18 MLX with the base Indmar 410 last week.  Dealer replaced the O2 sensors, but issue came back during test run.  Next step is to replace the cats.  Not exactly sure what the issue is with the cats but my question is once they replace the cats, does this fix the issue?  Did they update the part to prevent the issue or is this something I will be dealing with again in a few years?

I'm interested to know this as well.  I have the same engine and mine is a '17.  Hopefully the fix will prevent future issues.....or I just go get a '20 23LSV.....with an M6.

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Got mine back from dealer 2 weeks ago. The dealer replaced port side O2 sensor full tune up and fuel filter. Took it out for the last two weeks no check engine light. Thought all was fixed. Well out all day Friday and at the end of the day check engine popped up again. I have no idea what to do next. 6 7 hour round trip to dealer sucks. 

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Here is what you and your dealer should be checking:

Check the 8 nuts per manifold to make sure they are tight. They are 22 foot pounds. Probably can’t get a torque wrench in there so use a box end wrench and snug them down.

 

Depending on the code, swap sensors to see if code follows.

 

Check the v-band clamp to ensure they are tight. Make sure the gasket between the exhaust manifold and the lower cat elbow is centered in the opening. Check bump hose to ensure they are aligned correctly. See instructions for alignment.

 

Pull the sensors in the exhaust manifolds and inspect. If they are wet, flow test the manifolds. See instructions for flow testing.

 

Pull the sensors in the upper cat elbow to see if they are wet. Use a bore scope to inspect the catalyst. See instructions for cat inspections. 

 

Verify the fuel pressure. Should be 50-62 PSI.

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