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M235 and towing with 2019 Raptor


RCorsa

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7 hours ago, RCorsa said:

Not sure a super duty will be needed but maybe.  I will say the tow capacity of the new  1/2 ton trucks in the last couple years is pretty real with some hitting nearly 12,000 max capacity. Of course brakes will be much better on the. 3/4. 

I was just having this discussion with a friend this morning.  We were discussing the super duty vs the new F-150 offerings.  I have a 2019 with the HDPP and Max Tow package and have zero issues with my 23LSV and would imagine it would handle a 25LSV just fine as well.  M240 would be at the relative limit, but doable.  Take a look at this.

 

image.thumb.png.0a1cbd5505c3b72f3c33a56771de76fe.png

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I caught up this week with the guy who bought my 2018 a few years ago. He burned up this Ram eco-diesel towing the 23 LSV down to Shasta the first summer he had it. Plenty of towing capacity by the book but he had an actual engine fire, so now he’s in a 3/4 ton.

BA948F38-E0B7-40EA-B960-CC5177F8DD79.thumb.jpeg.4b5ca00a7721cf77921274440f3b2ade.jpeg

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I've pretty much maxed out my f150 with my 25ZX which is similar weight to the m240. Does great around town and highways but you put mountains in the mix and the revs end up very high. I won't take it over the mountain passes, just way too much stress for long periods of time on the engine. Also wouldn't be surprised if I was pushing the limit of the payload capacity. 

Edited by Cole2001
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3 minutes ago, surfdude said:

This boils down to personal preference. 

I agree with this for the most part unless you start exceeding the important limits like axle capacity or you are substantially over the tow rating.     

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Like everything else in life there are just some things that take common sense. If you tow at the high end of your towing capacity maybe it is best to stay away from long hills or heavy highway traffic since your brakes, motor, transmission, chassis and safety designs are at their limits. Would you be mad at an overloaded 18wheeler driver if he caused a wreck you got caught up in due to him neglecting what his rig limitations were?

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21 hours ago, RyanB said:

So will cooling. And stability. I don’t think most people know how much better a HD truck tows than a 1500 until they try one. There is a lot more to it than just an impressive tow rating. 

And the differences between say a 2008 to 2014 then the 2018. Every truck I bought the towing just got better. With my 2018 Ram I can actually relax a little bit pulling my loaded 25’ gooseneck. I could not imagine pulling my 25LSV with a 1/2 ton. I did not even like pulling it with my 2019 Ram 3500 utility bed. 
My good friend bought a 2018 24MXZ. This last summer. He pulled it ONCE with his 1/2 ton. Then he started using his kids 2500 while waiting for his new 3500. 

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On 9/24/2021 at 2:15 PM, Slayer said:

I was just having this discussion with a friend this morning.  We were discussing the super duty vs the new F-150 offerings.  I have a 2019 with the HDPP and Max Tow package and have zero issues with my 23LSV and would imagine it would handle a 25LSV just fine as well.  M240 would be at the relative limit, but doable.  Take a look at this.

 

image.thumb.png.0a1cbd5505c3b72f3c33a56771de76fe.png

Oh how I hesitate to “weigh in” (pun intended) on the issue of overweight towing.

Specific to Slayers setup, the Ford HDPP (Heavy Duty Payload Package) is extremely rare, like unicorn rare, unless factory ordered. It does increase the GVWR & CGVWR significantly over a non-HDPP half ton. I am curious about the weight ratings on the Ford factory hitch receiver with the HDPP + Max Tow. Maybe Slayer can comment.

Even on my max tow package F-150 (not HDPP) rated for 11,200lbs, similar to what is indicated on the chart above, the receiver had a 500# tongue/5000# trailer max without weight distribution. In the picture below I am within every applicable rating except tongue/trailer for the receiver.

FF18B9F3-CF33-4FB2-8319-28B6E3376B32.thumb.jpeg.1b3704be738118ee2cec38d8c19a4b7a.jpeg

It can be done. This combination towed really well all things considered. The eco boost is an absolute monster when loaded. I added sumo springs on the rear, it helped. I’m certain air bags would help even more. But bottom line, imho, half ton trucks aren’t built for this much weight, hence the 500#/5000# receiver rating w/o weight distribution. We’re not even talking about loading people and cargo in the truck, although HDPP does solve that problem.

In the end I chose to go 3/4 ton. And believe it or not, an HDPP F-150 has a higher payload rating than this setup cause the diesel is so heavy. A gas 2500 Ram would have similar payload rating to an HDPP F-150.

6BBA561B-165B-4AD7-883C-11D843EDA644.thumb.jpeg.861259a3945b8e885f5169c1be6a2307.jpeg
 

Yes it’s expensive and a pain to live with day to day, kinda like owning a big wakesurf boat. But is fits in the garage and it handles the weight of these boats with a reasonable margin of error. I load up the family and gear and tow with no worries.

6764A8B3-D61B-44CA-BBDF-45434ECFE5E5.thumb.jpeg.52ae651f76fb6bf8727c22487d69a0e9.jpeg
 

 

 

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19 minutes ago, DFW said:

Oh how I hesitate to “weigh in” (pun intended) on the issue of overweight towing.

Specific to Slayers setup, the Ford HDPP (Heavy Duty Payload Package) is extremely rare, like unicorn rare, unless factory ordered. It does increase the GVWR & CGVWR significantly over a non-HDPP half ton. I am curious about the weight ratings on the Ford factory hitch receiver with the HDPP + Max Tow. Maybe Slayer can comment.

Even on my max tow package F-150 (not HDPP) rated for 11,200lbs, similar to what is indicated on the chart above, the receiver had a 500# tongue/5000# trailer max without weight distribution. In the picture below I am within every applicable rating except tongue/trailer for the receiver.

FF18B9F3-CF33-4FB2-8319-28B6E3376B32.thumb.jpeg.1b3704be738118ee2cec38d8c19a4b7a.jpeg

It can be done. This combination towed really well all things considered. The eco boost is an absolute monster when loaded. I added sumo springs on the rear, it helped. I’m certain air bags would help even more. But bottom line, imho, half ton trucks aren’t built for this much weight, hence the 500#/5000# receiver rating w/o weight distribution. We’re not even talking about loading people and cargo in the truck, although HDPP does solve that problem.

In the end I chose to go 3/4 ton. And believe it or not, an HDPP F-150 has a higher payload rating than this setup cause the diesel is so heavy. A gas 2500 Ram would have similar payload rating to an HDPP F-150.

6BBA561B-165B-4AD7-883C-11D843EDA644.thumb.jpeg.861259a3945b8e885f5169c1be6a2307.jpeg
 

Yes it’s expensive and a pain to live with day to day, kinda like owning a big wakesurf boat. But is fits in the garage and it handles the weight of these boats with a reasonable margin of error. I load up the family and gear and tow with no worries.

6764A8B3-D61B-44CA-BBDF-45434ECFE5E5.thumb.jpeg.52ae651f76fb6bf8727c22487d69a0e9.jpeg
 

 

 

19 minutes ago, DFW said:

 

@DFW you're correct.  And, your 25LSV is sick!!!  Hopefully my next steed.  

My HDPP F-150 is as you suggest.  It's 500# / 5,000#.  With WDH the capacity is 13,200#.  I agree that the ecoboost is an absolute monster and it's been a damn fine rig to tow with.  I tow with confidence yet also know what the limitations are and I don't push it.  And by pushing it I mean driving aggressively.  I think it handles my 23 with relative ease, much like yours did with the 24MXZ.  I'm truck shopping right now.  I haven't considered a 3/4 ton because I really don't want to spend that much money, but I've also not looked at RAM much.  It's another discussion entirely, but I get employee pricing on Ford and it's one of the reasons I always drive them.  As for the truck I currently own, I wasn't shopping when I picked it up.  It is indeed a unicorn and it was on a dealer lot.  I saw it and went to get it.  I always drive by the local lot to see what they have and it happened to be there.  Done deal.  

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Thanks Slayer, we’re loving the 25.

HDPP really transforms an F-150, not surprised it handles your boat with ease.

I’m 110% Ford guy…A SuperDuty would by my 1st, 2nd and 3rd choice if it fit in my garage. Just can’t leave a $70-80K aluminum can sitting in the driveway when we get this several times a year.

2F426096-37B6-43AA-B848-3381E8E12B7E.thumb.jpeg.4fe3c95cf0047d97f9437eca7db23945.jpeg

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4 minutes ago, DFW said:

Thanks Slayer, we’re loving the 25.

HDPP really transforms an F-150, not surprised it handles your boat with ease.

I’m 110% Ford guy…A SuperDuty would by my 1st, 2nd and 3rd choice if it fit in my garage. Just can’t leave a $70-80K aluminum can sitting in the driveway when we get this several times a year.

2F426096-37B6-43AA-B848-3381E8E12B7E.thumb.jpeg.4fe3c95cf0047d97f9437eca7db23945.jpeg

Holy hell!!  I wouldn't want my aluminum rig exposed to that crap either!!  That's crazy!  Unfortunately for me, my truck lives outside all the time.  It's going to be that way for another 6 years until we can get back to the lake where we keep the 23LSV.  Our house on the small lake we live on doesn't have a garage large enough for anything other than dirt bikes, a harley, gun safes, and ammo.  As soon as our boys have drivers licences, we'll have my truck and the Mrs. rig in the garage again!  

 

Happy to hear you're loving the 25.  We're very interested in one.  

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The 7.3 gasser in the Super Duty is a good way to save about 10 grand and increase your payload quit a bit over the diesel.  I have really liked mine so far.  I haven't towed anything over 16000 pounds yet but at least up to that it has done very well.  Plus you can get the Tremor if that look and capability is your thing.

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What exactly does the HDPP include? I’ve got the 7000GVWR and the max tow which is one of the more equipped f150s. 
 

Also can’t justify a HD platform when I need to fit into a parking garage, also considering I only ever tow around town and have access to a diesel when needed. The ecoboost is great for power just not as heavy of a truck so need to take it easy. I’ve seen 44L/100km or 5mpg when going up some small hills :blush:

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FWIW, the limitation on 2500/250 trucks is to stay within a Class 2B rating.  They are significantly more capable than any 1500/150, even the highly touted F150 HDPP.  Gotta look beyond the payload rating.

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11 hours ago, RyanB said:

FWIW, the limitation on 2500/250 trucks is to stay within a Class 2B rating.  They are significantly more capable than any 1500/150, even the highly touted F150 HDPP.  Gotta look beyond the payload rating.

Totally agree!

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