V-Drive clunking noise in gear

[Robert95z]

2014 Axis T22 indmar 330... 360 hours-ish

When in gear there is a clunking/knocking noise that speeds up with the rpms and eventually goes away. But is very prominent at idle in gear or low RPMs.

Everything ive been reading seems to point to the damper plate. Could a damper plate really go out that early? And the noise really seems to be towards the front of the vdrive. I can feel the clunking towards the front of the vdrive with my hands.

Heres a short, not so good video. https://youtu.be/ac5hKdN3Jsk

 

Edited October 2, 2019 by Robert95z

[JeffK]

I would start checking the easy things first.  Check to make sure your prop is tight and secure.  I'd also make sure the coupler bolts are tight.  Sound has a way of traveling all over the place with that much metal.

[Dwake]

Yea I listen to your video.  That thing is ready to go.  Don’t use it.  You can break the bell-mouth housing for the drive plate and add to your pricey repair.  I hope you still under warranty.  Mine was $2600 back 8 years ago.

sound just like that for a very short period of time, like minutes before it went  bang-weeeeeeeeeee.  No more clunking but no connection to motor anymore either.  Dead in water.  No drive

 

[Tomwkim]

Mine made exact sound. Three of the four bolts from transmission to drive shaft had sheared off completely. Tech told me they should been torqued at 100 hours and again at 200 hours. I am not aware of this being done by my previous shop. Unfortunately they are no longer in business. New shop is having to replace shaft as it became warped and install new seals. Estimated cost between $1,500-2,000. 

[Robert95z]

I haven't put any tools on anything except the prop nut, which is night.

I can see the 4 coupling bolts, nothing is obviously lose or backed out, but I haven't put a wrench on it yet.

When I turn the prop by hand back and forth there is a metal on metal clanking noise coming from the vdrive. Feels like there's a little slack somewhere, not sure if that has always been there or if its normal.

I'll probably be dropping it off at the shop Friday. Looking at about $1300 in labor plus parts if it is a damper plate replacement.

[Robert95z]

Shaft coupling bolts are tight... Took the starter off and put a borescope in there and everything looks good, but I have the newer style damper plate where the springs are encapsulated. So I don't know if there is a problem or not. 

Any suggestions? 

[Mazeing5]

Yours seems to be a more consistent knock than mine. Did you find out what it was? 

I just had my Damper plate and V-Drive replaced on my 2009 23 LSV. Mine did not sound like this before so I am wondering if this is an issue. My old V-Drive was quiet until the day it wouldn't go into forward or reverse.

The sound goes away when I give it more throttle. This is when it is just barely in gear.  My V-Drive is also very hot when running. I don't know if the old was hot or not because I wasn't as keyed in on it being a potential problem. 

 

[Robert95z]

@Mazeing5

I have not had time to mess with it. So I'm still unsure what my issue is.

You got a brand new vdrive installed and now its making this noise??? What happened do your vdrive to need replacement?

[Steve B.]

Damper plate.

Steve B.

[Mazeing5]

Mine just went out. No noise just riding in a slow to no wake area and put it into neutral and it never shifted again. The shop said it stopped pumping fluid so it wouldn’t engage. I had them change the damper plate while they did it as a preventative measure. Now I wish I didn't because the old one looked fine and made no noise. 

 

Steve B. - Are you saying the noise on the OP or mine is the damper plate? 

 

 

[justgary]

@Mazeing5- Check to make sure that your prop is installed correctly.  It could be loose (usually because the key is too tall, keeping the prop from fitting onto the taper correctly).  If that isn't it, make sure that your coupler bolts are tight (below the v-drive).

[Mazeing5]

I checked the Prop and the shaft couple bolts and they are all tight. I am going to send the video to the shop that replaced the plate and drive and see what they say. I sure hope it isn't a damper plate issue.  I hate to tear the boat apart again. 

 

[Steve B.]

On 10/14/2019 at 6:28 PM, Mazeing5 said:

Mine just went out. No noise just riding in a slow to no wake area and put it into neutral and it never shifted again. The shop said it stopped pumping fluid so it wouldn’t engage. I had them change the damper plate while they did it as a preventative measure. Now I wish I didn't because the old one looked fine and made no noise. 

 

Steve B. - Are you saying the noise on the OP or mine is the damper plate? 

 

 

Yes Mazeing5 I thought your sound was a damper plate issue. Is your's fixed now?

Steve B.

[Mazeing5]

It is not fixed. I put a Mechanic's Stethoscope on it and the noise is very noticeably louder at the V-Drive(The portion closest to the gas tank) and not back towards the bell housing. I am still working to see how to get it returned. I bought it from a 3rd party to save 1K so I am trying to get it returned now. 

 

The thing that drives me nuts is I kept my old V-Drive and was told that no one rebuilds them close to me so I bought a new one. I just pulled the old one apart and the first plate I took off called the pump housing has two gears in it. One of the two gears has a "pump key" that was sheared off causing it not to turn so it wouldn't pump fluid to shift into forward and reverse. I don't see any metal any where in the rest of the V-Drive when I drained the fluid so I wonder if this just got worn down over time and i could just replace the key and get another 10 years out of it. I found the key on 2 sites on the internet but both say they are on back order from ZF. The pin that is worn is on page 6 figure 2.4  on this link. https://www.bakesonline.com/images/MediaLibrary/TransmissionManual_ZF45C.pdf 

 

Trey

[justgary]

I can't see if that is just a standard Woodruff Key or not.  If so, a visit to Ace Hardware should fix you up.

I found a much better copy of the manual for you, but I still can't tell what the key looks like.

https://www.bukh-bremen.de/download/Hersteller/ZF/Reparaturanleitung u Ersatzteilliste ZF45C bis ZF88C.pdf

[Mazeing5]

I wish it was. It is a 6 mm round pin with a half moon top to fit into the gear. I tried to machine one but I don't trust what I made it has a little to much play. 

 

[justgary]

2 hours ago, Mazeing5 said:

I wish it was. It is a 6 mm round pin with a half moon top to fit into the gear. I tried to machine one but I don't trust what I made it has a little to much play. 

 

$10.50 for a sack of 25 (for 10mm long, but they have other lengths).  Grade 8 should do nicely.  At this price, you can mess up plenty of times grinding the end and still get what you need.

https://www.mscdirect.com/product/details/70934807

 

[Mazeing5]

Nice find. They also have one end rounded. Maybe they will fit right out of the box. 10 mm seems about right for the length as well. 

 

[justgary]

I think that "rounded" may not meet your specifications, but you can sure put one in a drill and shape it on a grinder pretty quickly.

[Robert95z]

@Mazeing5

Any updates on your situation? 

My mechanic claims this the sound of some gear lash and a "well broken in vdrive" and it is normal. 

Thoughts? 

[Eagleboy99]

2 hours ago, Robert95z said:

My mechanic claims this the sound of some gear lash and a "well broken in vdrive" and it is normal. 

Thoughts? 

360 hrs is not well broken in.

[Robert95z]

12 hours ago, Eagleboy99 said:

360 hrs is not well broken in.

Agree.. I call BS.. I guess I should have went straight to the dealership first.

[Mazeing5]

Yeah,  I would not say yours is well broken in.  My old one didn't make any noise. 

 

The answer from the ZF rep on my new one that was just installed was "its either the damper plate or the idle is to low". I said the old one had the same idle and did not sound like that still have not heard back. I feel a little better knowing I have a spare with my old one now. 

 

Mine does go away when I speed up. 

[justgary]

2 hours ago, Mazeing5 said:

Mine does go away when I speed up. 

That makes me think low oil, high oil, or improper gear lash.  How much do you have to speed up before it quits?

Did you get your 6mm drive pin for the old unit?  Is it back together?

[Mazeing5]

The sound is only when you just put the boat into gear,  any more throttle and it goes away.I haven't been out enough to watch the RPM's.  I did add more ATF in the lower portion because it looked low but didn't make any noticeable difference.  I can live with the noise if it is not a problem as it is really only noticeable when riding through a slow to no wake area. I just always think hearing metal knocking noises as a bad thing. 

 

I haven't ordered the pins yet but i am going to so I can fix the old one to have it as a backup.