Advice Needed: Riding Surf vs. Skim

[rsutton1223]

Advice needed from those that surf both skim and surf style: We have been surfing skim style boards since we started surfing. This week, I got a Phase 5 Swell to start trying out surf style. Any tips/tricks from those that ride both?

[shawndoggy]

stand on top of it and cut back and forth?

(what kind of advice are you looking for specifically?)

@-BS- has some pretty good advice on getting air, but it's not really specific to (just a little easier with) surf style boards.  What he manages to do with a CWB tsunami is pretty amazing.

[rsutton1223]

On the limited time I have on it...I am noticing that you have to use your core/hips for movement a lot more than a skim style where you can force the issue with your feet. 

[shawndoggy]

5 minutes ago, rsutton1223 said:

On the limited time I have on it...I am noticing that you have to use your core/hips for movement a lot more than a skim style where you can force the issue with your feet. 

that's funny.  I'd say my experience is exactly opposite.  Skim requires good body mechanics and really stacking your hips over your knees over your toes in a turn lest you get the dreaded banana peel washout.  Surf with those big fins is much more forgiving to bad body placement (and also very rewarding to good body placement).

In short -- transition from skim to surf easier than the other way around, b/c good skim riders have good body mechanics.

 

Edited July 29, 2019 by shawndoggy

[SouthsideBoarder]

3 hours ago, shawndoggy said:

that's funny.  I'd say my experience is exactly opposite.  Skim requires good body mechanics and really stacking your hips over your knees over your toes in a turn lest you get the dreaded banana peel washout.  Surf with those big fins is much more forgiving to bad body placement (and also very rewarding to good body placement).

In short -- transition from skim to surf easier than the other way around, b/c good skim riders have good body mechanics.

 

Interesting. 

I tried a friends phase 5 phantom and really found it hard to stay going in the pocket even with pumping. Granted, it was my first surf style ride ever as I usually ride skim. I did notice it was crazy locked in but he also had the larger fins in the middle back and the smaller on the outside forward. Would this be the contributor?  I found that with my phase 5 Danielo diamond it feel so much easier to go and maneuver. Is this accurate surf vs skim?

Any tips for the next try? The experience I had makes me hesitant to ever buy a surf style board. If it’s relevant we ride an ‘18 23 LSV.

Edited July 29, 2019 by SouthsideBoarder

[surfdude]

Sounds like his fins are bass akward 

[ajive]

For me it was really just getting the feel.  I went from skim to surf shortly after getting to the point where unforced wash-outs were no longer a thing for me.  I HATED the surf board for a couple weeks but now it's my preferred board type.  The way it feels to me is this: on the surf board you are turning from the fins, so it's more of a roll the board with your hips action.  Skim you pivot the board flat on the water and then use a little edge to grab the direction you want and straighten out.  Going back and forth between board types always takes me a minute to adjust my form.

Based on that picture this won't help you, but I have a three fin set up on my board and I only use a single fin in the center.  As far as I know, this is not a normal set up, but I do prefer less fins for less resistance when turning.  I should probably try a two or three fin set up again sometime, but I've always felt sluggish with so much forced board control.

I agree with shwandoggy, the surf is more forgiving to mistakes once you get the feel

[rsutton1223]

I might try it without the 2 rear fins tonight and see how that feels as well. 

[surfdude]

Put the big fins in the front, take off the small back fins

[SOcalSurfer]

I wasnt a huge fan of surfstyle when I first rode my friends doomswell but i couldn't pass up the deal i got on a nubstep. I got a set of future fins and i was shocked the difference a set of fins makes. The board is so fast and so much fun to ride. If you are feeling the board too locked in or too slow i highly recommend upgrading your fins.

[kerpluxal]

Depends on what you are trying to do on the board.. but recently I have seen the Pro riders also switching to dual fins instead of quads. 

I prefer dual and my new Tuk Tuk is only set for dual. Fins will also make a huge difference as well.. But again, what type of riding will change your fin selection. You can research the Futures Fins site and see the variety of fins and different riding styles they are designed for. I use BlackStixs in my Tuk Tuk and DoomsWell.

[TxDude]

On 7/29/2019 at 12:23 PM, rsutton1223 said:

I might try it without the 2 rear fins tonight and see how that feels as well. 

This is the configuration I like on my Doomswell Nubstep Bamboo . I also ride a Phase 5 Hammerhead.  I learned to surf on a long surf style board.  It took a long time for me to adjust to the Hammerhead skim board. Any skim board is all about using the rails to turn. You are carving with your heals and toes. The surf style boards are much more forgiving and don’t require anything close to the same heal toe transfer required on a skim board. It’s hard for me to describe the surf style  but I’ll try. On the surf style I use the back fins as somewhat of an anchor as I steer the board with my front foot and hips. It’s much more of a slower and rhythmic movement. If I switch from my skim to my surf style board it always takes a minute or two to realize I will not get the same heal toe responsiveness I get on the surf style.  If you jump on a surf style and try to implement the same aggressive heal toe carving required of a skim it feels like the board is almost unresponsive or the response of the board feels like it is dragging. 

 

I don’t know if this helps but this is my experience. 

[ahopkins22LSV]

4 minutes ago, TxDude said:

This is the configuration I like on my Doomswell Nubstep Bamboo . I also ride a Phase 5 Hammerhead.  I learned to surf on a long surf style board.  It took a long time for me to adjust to the Hammerhead skim board. Any skim board is all about using the rails to turn. You are carving with your heals and toes. The surf style boards are much more forgiving and don’t require anything close to the same heal toe transfer required on a skim board. It’s hard for me to describe the surf style  but I’ll try. On the surf style I use the back fins as somewhat of an anchor as I steer the board with my front foot and hips. It’s much more of a slower and rhythmic movement. If I switch from my skim to my surf style board it always takes a minute or two to realize I will not get the same heal toe responsiveness I get on the surf style.  If you jump on a surf style and try to implement the same aggressive heal toe carving required of a skim it feels like the board is almost unresponsive or the response of the board feels like it is dragging. 

 

I don’t know if this helps but this is my experience. 

I think that’s a good way to explain it. I ride my skim like a snowboard edge to edge not allowing the edge to slide. On my friends chaos surf board I have seemed to learn it ride it more flat footed and steering with my front foot and hips like you explain. Man can you make that board pop off the wake too!

[rsutton1223]

Taking off the back two small fins made a huge difference. I still feel the same amount of push but it is a lot more maneuverable. 

[shawndoggy]

IMHO you shouldn’t ever really “steer” any wakesurfer.  Rather, turn like a longboard (skateboard) by carving/rocking on the rails. Skim REQUIRES that technique, whereas surf you can get away with trying to steer the board under you (I.e. physically point it a different direction), but that isn’t usually the best technique. 

Again IMHO. Not a pro by any means. 

[volfan705]

you have too many fins on the board.  It comes with the ability to set it up.  Never ride it with all 4.  pick 2 on that one and go.  On models with 3 available most go with 2 outside or 1 middle

[shawndoggy]

1 hour ago, volfan705 said:

you have too many fins on the board.  It comes with the ability to set it up.  Never ride it with all 4.  pick 2 on that one and go.  On models with 3 available most go with 2 outside or 1 middle

disagree.

[vanamp]

5 hours ago, shawndoggy said:

disagree.

I'm with you on this one.  Quad setup here:

 

 

[isellacuras]

I also ride quads on my soulcraft. The rears are the original nubs and a switch out between the WCT’s (preferred) and AM1’s depending on how I feel.