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2019 T23 issues


Made4water

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56 minutes ago, wilster said:

if you have too much weight in the rear, you'll basically swamp the surf gate--you'll have them below the water line and it won't produce a wave. I'd try it in deeper water and make sure no water is flowing over the top of the surfgate when you're at surf speed, if so, you have too much weight.   

I keep hearing this said and I have plenty of water rolling over my gates when surfing. I don't have any issue with it. Also, I can't understand why it would be an issue. Water still pushes against it obtaining the intended result. I have notice that on the side I am surfing, it can make a little trail in the wave, but it seems purely aesthetic...

 

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ahopkins22LSV

11-15’ is too shallow. This boat is a lot bigger then your previous and you need at least 15’+. If you are on a river you need to be using paddle wheel. Into the current is typically better. But @Raimie has reported that her 2018 T22 isn’t effected as much by her current.

I still suspect you have a depth, speed, weight, possible surf gate issue prior to a hull issue. 

Pictures and video are definitely needed at this point as we are all just saying the same thing. Also, where are you located? I’d bet you a set you could get some help from someone on here by this weekend. 

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4 hours ago, boardjnky4 said:

I think it's safe to say we need some pictures of what's going on.

Absolutely until we see a pic of the wave and surf setup screen we are guessing at what the problem could be. I love this group everyone is very helpful. 

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5 hours ago, MFknK said:

I keep hearing this said and I have plenty of water rolling over my gates when surfing. I don't have any issue with it. Also, I can't understand why it would be an issue. Water still pushes against it obtaining the intended result. I have notice that on the side I am surfing, it can make a little trail in the wave, but it seems purely aesthetic...

 

I am usually good if they go under a bit but if they go too deep the water rolls over and screws up the top of the wave. 

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18 hours ago, MFknK said:

I keep hearing this said and I have plenty of water rolling over my gates when surfing. I don't have any issue with it. Also, I can't understand why it would be an issue. Water still pushes against it obtaining the intended result. I have notice that on the side I am surfing, it can make a little trail in the wave, but it seems purely aesthetic...

 

They get to far under they wont work. And if youre running 1100lb sacs I bet they are to far under. More weight is not always better.

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exactly, i've seen a 20-40% wave degradation in height/quality because the surfgate being buried.  this happened on my '15 23lsv with 650's in the rear and a relatively full boat and i can assure you it wasn't aesthetic.  so with 1100's in the rear, i'd bet that's a big contributor to the wave quality issues.  

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44 minutes ago, boardjnky4 said:

OP has already stated that he tried with the bags half-full and it didn't help.

Yes, we know. But in one of his posts he states the water is "rolling over the gates", and has stated he using larger bags NOT approved by Malibu, sounds like a gate is under. A video would be helpful. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

OP,

Fill the stock center, bow, and rear hard tanks, no wedge, lead spread out down the center from walkway back. Start a video and start surfing at 11.8mph on the starboard side, walk to the back and film the surfgates deploying so everyone can see the angle, then back to the observer seat and have the driver start filling the rear ballast while filming the wave. You'll have to see some wave start to form and you'll know when it's good, continuing filling till the bags top out and you'll see where it starts becoming too much weight. I have a 16 T23, and I actually prefer 12.2-4 on my cruise control. Any less and I don't like the wave, you could be going too slow.

Hull issue aside, ditch those 1100lb bags, they don't actually get to 1100lbs, they'll put more pressure on the compartment than a properly fitted bag, and you'll constantly be worried about if they're the right amount of full. Get the custom fit Wakemakers bags and call it a day.

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On 4/16/2019 at 2:22 PM, COOP said:

 Larger bags NOT approved by Malibu

Is there really such a thing as approved bags?  I use 1100 but thats because 99% of the time there is only the driver in the boat so roughly the same as a few adults and smaller bags. 

I have never really seen bags listed as approved or not. 

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First, the water depth IS affecting it. I can notice a difference up to 20 feet. Anything below that has some effect. It doesn't sound like the primary problem though.

Second issue is likely pilot error. You're doing something wrong. It's unlikely to be the boat. But check the boat stuff- is every bag filling, is the wedge going down, are the surf gates going out etc. Assuming everything is actually working, then check the common screw-ups-

# 1 Wrong speed. The more weight, the faster it needs to be moving to form a clean wave. I think most people are surfing between 10-11.5 mph. If you have too much weight to get up to that speed, there won't be a surfable wave. Dropping weight may actually improve the wave!

# 2 Wrong distribution of weight. Axis boats tend to really like nose weight. They have these huge rear compartments that we fill up with 900s or even 1100s and then only a tiny little bag in front. Then all the good seats are in the back. Try draining half the bags in the back and force 3 or 4 people to sit in the bow and see if that fixes it.

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Uhm...Can you post a pic of yourself surfing successfully behind your old boat?  A lot of people here surf on much tougher conditions/surf set ups.  New boats are not hard to set up, and though you're running a lot of weight in the rear, the wave should still have push.  From what your describing, I find it tough to believe the boat is the reason you can't drop the rope...

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12 hours ago, vanamp said:

Is there really such a thing as approved bags?  I use 1100 but thats because 99% of the time there is only the driver in the boat so roughly the same as a few adults and smaller bags. 

I have never really seen bags listed as approved or not. 

Yes there is such a thing. I suspect the Coast Guard may have some input in it. 

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10 hours ago, COOP said:

Yes there is such a thing. I suspect the Coast Guard may have some input in it. 

They might, but I still have never seen an "approved" malibu bag and am curious why you would call a setup not approved. Assuming common sense is in play, is an extra 400lbs really that big of a deal if the crew is small? 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 4/16/2019 at 12:36 PM, wilster said:

exactly, i've seen a 20-40% wave degradation in height/quality because the surfgate being buried.  this happened on my '15 23lsv with 650's in the rear and a relatively full boat and i can assure you it wasn't aesthetic.  so with 1100's in the rear, i'd bet that's a big contributor to the wave quality issues.  

I found similar on my '13 LSV with the old surfgates.  Running too much weight did no good - 500 in the back on each side was actually perfect with bow weighted with 200 lead as well - the wave we as good as about any without crazy slamming it.  Always have found bow weight to be more important than I thought it should.  That said, 650's in my A24 were not throwing what I figured, so went to 850.

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I agree that the new hulls are less likely to need a lot of weight to make a great wave. We have seen super waves with all tanks and bags full with 2 larger guys. Thats our normal riding set up.

I'd start with ZERO and work my way up.

Yes @daylorb to the 850's in the A24. We have found that running the rear 850's light with some rear passengers helps the wave.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 4/14/2019 at 3:28 PM, Made4water said:

Surf gate and wedge are deployed no issues there. I just had the dealer install the new wedge software. The wave is a massive rolling wave that has no push or no lip on wedge 1-6.

My setup is as follows:

600# of lead that I move around  to help shape the wave.

plug and play rears are 1100#. But I have tried half full, full, and 3/4 full

plug and play front is the custom bag from wakemakers. Think it is a 525.

I have 2 625# bags that have been shuffled around the boat to try every position possible. 

I have tried empty and full of all the above sacks combo with no luck. Dealer does not know what to do as of yet but they have reached out to axis. Yes I understand the 2018 T23 is a legit surf boat but the hull is new for 2019. I was just trying to see if anyone else has heard of this issue. Maybe I got a lemon?

Have you found an ideal setup yet? Just took out my 19 t23 for the first time to surf and I’m not overly impressed. Coming from a 16 a20, I currently believe my a20 wave was better 

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man hopefully this is just a setup issue ( I love my 16t22 wave !) but will plan to upgrade when the 5yr W runs out! was planning on a t23 to be in the hunt but not if the wave has regressed with the updated boat??? hopefully there will be some more updated youtube videos of waves as the summer goes along.

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9 minutes ago, smuurph84 said:

man hopefully this is just a setup issue ( I love my 16t22 wave !) but will plan to upgrade when the 5yr W runs out! was planning on a t23 to be in the hunt but not if the wave has regressed with the updated boat??? hopefully there will be some more updated youtube videos of waves as the summer goes along.

OP's been MIA on this thread since mid-april... my guess.... it was operator error and it's sorted out now.

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Yeah, there’s nothing wrong with the ‘19 T23 wave, and the new hull tweaks just improved it from the ‘18.

Just about every setup issue on the later model surfgate boats is solved by not dragging around too much weight in the rear. If the face of the wave is washing out, back off the wedge a bit and/or dump a bit from the rears. Or park some heavy folks up front and watch how it changes the wave.

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Since 19 T23 is being discussed. Since T23, T22 and A22 are all fairly close in size...…….Anyone have first hand experience on difference in surf waves.....if any?

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5 hours ago, NWBU said:

Yeah, there’s nothing wrong with the ‘19 T23 wave, and the new hull tweaks just improved it from the ‘18.

Just about every setup issue on the later model surfgate boats is solved by not dragging around too much weight in the rear. If the face of the wave is washing out, back off the wedge a bit and/or dump a bit from the rears. Or park some heavy folks up front and watch how it changes the wave.

Do u have a setup you can share? Any personal experience? Just asking because I’m very interested. Like I’ve posted, I’m 100’ + deep with a 23’ boat and I’m not as impressed with the wave. My 16 a20 was easy. All hard tanks full plus bow pnp and sumo 650 in rears . Wedge stowed at 11mph. Killer wave for 20’ boat. T23 should b better but so far it’s not with the multiple different setups I’ve tried 

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1 hour ago, Giesh164 said:

Do u have a setup you can share? Any personal experience? Just asking because I’m very interested. Like I’ve posted, I’m 100’ + deep with a 23’ boat and I’m not as impressed with the wave. My 16 a20 was easy. All hard tanks full plus bow pnp and sumo 650 in rears . Wedge stowed at 11mph. Killer wave for 20’ boat. T23 should b better but so far it’s not with the multiple different setups I’ve tried 

I’d have to defer to @Raimie or @Anderson24 for Axis setups since I’m used to 23 LSV setups. I demoed the T22, T23 and A24 last fall when a buddy was shopping, and all 3 seemed easy to setup with good waves using stock plus PNP and wedge.

Pics or video of the wave might help, along with your particular setup.

Usually I see spray coming over and washing out the the face from the surfgate being too submerged. Or sometimes a little extra weight on the port side helps for the regular riders.

This is from my 23 LSV, running less than recommended PNP last year, but you should be able to get a similar setup since the T23’s hull is fairly similar.

37465324-BF30-4164-8C8E-D58219FF4CF2.thumb.jpeg.f195126220bd3228a93d020626326773.jpeg

Edited by NWBU
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