Poll: Winterize- dry or antifreeze?

[UWSkier]

Drain it all down.  Blow out the heater core.  Blow some anti-freeze through that but engine doesn't get any AF.  Doing it this way for 18 years down to minus 20something F temps.

[hawaiianstyln]

21 minutes ago, UWSkier said:

Drain it all down.  Blow out the heater core.  Blow some anti-freeze through that but engine doesn't get any AF.  Doing it this way for 18 years down to minus 20something F temps.

UWSkier does that mean your block is just dry probably because you don't worry about the tstat opening up and previously you had drained the block before your process?  this whole waiting for the tstat to open to get AF flowing thru the block is starting to be less motivating.  This winter (in a month or so) I will be going thru this process so this thread and a few other recents are helping me decide.  Last year and previous I just dumped the water and dryblocked it.  Can these engines really corrode and cause problems that quick to have issues.  Heck I was running my 04 Malibu in Hawaii's salt water 4-5 times a week.  Obviously I used Salt away on EVERYTHING including flush for 4 years.  When I got that VLX in Arizona, the boys at Paradise watersports were amazed out how clean everything looked from 4 years of salt use.  For some reason I just can't see the issue with dryblocking it thru the winter and not dealing with AF flush.  My application would purely be for anti-corrosion because I have a heated garage and several backup options if I lose power including a friends heated barns here in MI.

[Brodie]

Drain and blow out lines/motor with leaf blower.  Been doing this for 15 years.  Next year I may try to rig up a catch bucket and run antifreeze to cut my time dramatically and eliminate having to crawl all around the motor disconnecting/reconnecting hoses.

Edited October 11, 2018 by Brodie

[UWSkier]

32 minutes ago, hawaiianstyln said:

UWSkier does that mean your block is just dry probably because you don't worry about the tstat opening up and previously you had drained the block before your process?  this whole waiting for the tstat to open to get AF flowing thru the block is starting to be less motivating.  This winter (in a month or so) I will be going thru this process so this thread and a few other recents are helping me decide.  Last year and previous I just dumped the water and dryblocked it.  Can these engines really corrode and cause problems that quick to have issues.  Heck I was running my 04 Malibu in Hawaii's salt water 4-5 times a week.  Obviously I used Salt away on EVERYTHING including flush for 4 years.  When I got that VLX in Arizona, the boys at Paradise watersports were amazed out how clean everything looked from 4 years of salt use.  For some reason I just can't see the issue with dryblocking it thru the winter and not dealing with AF flush.  My application would purely be for anti-corrosion because I have a heated garage and several backup options if I lose power including a friends heated barns here in MI.

Usually we do this on a hot engine as we run it up to temp to change oil, but I've done it on cold engines too.  Pull block drains, pull hose off bottom of water recirc pump, pull hose from raw water pump, blow out heater core (and blow through AF), drain V-drive if you have one, and drain manifolds.  With everything unhooked, pull lanyard and crank the engine a few revolutions.  Doing any more than that is overkill.

[05hammerhead]

19 minutes ago, Brodie said:

Drain and blow out lines/motor with leaf blower.  Been doing this for 15 years.  Next year I may try to rig up a catch bucket and run antifreeze to cut my time dramatically and eliminate having to crawl all around the motor disconnecting/reconnecting hoses.

You still have to drain everything before you run the antifreeze.  

[Brodie]

1 hour ago, 05hammerhead said:

You still have to drain everything before you run the antifreeze.  

It' wouldn't be as extensive as what I normally do though.  I'd still pull the block plugs and crossover hose.  I just wouldn't need to pull all the other hoses and blow them out like I do now.

 

Edit: or maybe I just get a new cordless leaf blower with a nozzle that fits in my hoses better?    Our 2 boats are 200 miles apart, so ideally I'd like to rig up something that's quicker, easier, and portable.

Edited October 11, 2018 by Brodie

[TomH]

Man, some of you guys really overthink winterization.  Unless you're a dealer doing a ton of winterizations, where you're recirculating coolant and testing coolant levels to verify protection, every winterization needs to start with draining the water from the engine and any accessories you have (heater, shower, etc.) (on a raw water cooled engine).  Then either add antifreeze or don't based on your preferences.  If you're going to add it, I find pouring it in through the thermostat housing or the circulation pump hose is by far the easiest.  But if you're going to suck it up, that's fine too.  So long as you drained the water from the block first, the thermostat's position will not make a bit of difference on the anti-freeze getting into the block, as it will fill through the circulation pump on an empty/dry block.  

Edited October 11, 2018 by TomH

[formulaben]

For those considering utilizing antifreeze, be advised that Ethanol based antifreeze is hard on rubber.  Propylene Glycol based antifreeze is what we should be using.  Quote from another forum:

RV/Marine non-toxic antifreeze is probably the most misunderstood commodity in our industry today. There are currently three different varieties on the market at three very different prices.

• Propylene Glycol based: This product is only available at your local RV shop (and not every RV shop for that matter).  Like the ethanol antifreeze, this product is non-toxic and safe for all RV plumbing. However, propylene glycol does not have the same fire safety warnings, nor the risk of tainting your RV plumbing system. Furthermore, propylene glycol is a lubricant and will actually work to extend the life of the seals in your faucets and toilets, unlike the ethanol based products.

• Ethanol (alcohol) based: This type of antifreeze is most readily available in hardware stores and most RV shops.  However, this product is also extremely flammable and not to used around any sort of pilot flames or cigarettes. As well, this product has been known to taint certain RV plumbing systems and is only to be used with Quest or Pex plumbing lines. If you have ever used this product you will quickly remember how bad you water smelt and tasted the next spring. Furthermore, because this product is made from alcohol it works to dry out all the rubber seals readily found in your faucets and toilet. As a result we do not recommend or sell this product.

• Propylene/Ethanol Blend: Again this product is non-toxic and completely safe for RV plumbing systems.  This may seem like a good idea, however, it is unknown how much ethanol is required to taint RV plumbing lines and dry out plumbing seals. For that reason we do not recommend this product.

[minnmarker]

4 minutes ago, formulaben said:

For those considering utilizing antifreeze, be advised that Ethanol based antifreeze is hard on rubber.  Propylene Glycol based antifreeze is what we should be using.  Quote from another forum:

RV/Marine non-toxic antifreeze is probably the most misunderstood commodity in our industry today. There are currently three different varieties on the market at three very different prices.

• Propylene Glycol based: This product is only available at your local RV shop (and not every RV shop for that matter).  Like the ethanol antifreeze, this product is non-toxic and safe for all RV plumbing. However, propylene glycol does not have the same fire safety warnings, nor the risk of tainting your RV plumbing system. Furthermore, propylene glycol is a lubricant and will actually work to extend the life of the seals in your faucets and toilets, unlike the ethanol based products.

• Ethanol (alcohol) based: This type of antifreeze is most readily available in hardware stores and most RV shops.  However, this product is also extremely flammable and not to used around any sort of pilot flames or cigarettes. As well, this product has been known to taint certain RV plumbing systems and is only to be used with Quest or Pex plumbing lines. If you have ever used this product you will quickly remember how bad you water smelt and tasted the next spring. Furthermore, because this product is made from alcohol it works to dry out all the rubber seals readily found in your faucets and toilet. As a result we do not recommend or sell this product.

• Propylene/Ethanol Blend: Again this product is non-toxic and completely safe for RV plumbing systems.  This may seem like a good idea, however, it is unknown how much ethanol is required to taint RV plumbing lines and dry out plumbing seals. For that reason we do not recommend this product.

PG antifreeze was on sale at Menard's last week.  Picked up 2 cases.  $2.50 per gallon.

[Heard]

1 hour ago, TomH said:

Man, some of you guys really overthink winterization.  Unless you're a dealer doing a ton of winterizations, where you're recirculating coolant and testing coolant levels to verify protection, every winterization needs to start with draining the water from the engine and any accessories you have (heater, shower, etc.) (on a raw water cooled engine).  Then either add antifreeze or don't based on your preferences.  If you're going to add it, I find pouring it in through the thermostat housing or the circulation pump hose is by far the easiest.  But if you're going to suck it up, that's fine too.  So long as you drained the water from the block first, the thermostat's position will not make a bit of difference on the anti-freeze getting into the block, as it will fill through the circulation pump on an empty/dry block.  

Finally someone else who realizes that if you drain your block of water you do not need to warm up the engine as the antifreeze will go straight into the block to fill it

[Raimie]

5 hours ago, Heard said:

Finally someone else who realizes that if you drain your block of water you do not need to warm up the engine as the antifreeze will go straight into the block to fill it

I didn't realize this, but it does make sense and now I feel stupid. Good to know because unscrewing all the blue plugs and having 160 degree water hitting my hand was pretty unpleasant.

I will point out though that for the hoses that have to be removed, its a lot easier with them warmed up. Typically I winterize when it's in the high 30's/low 40's, but this year it ended up being 60, which was a nice change.

Edited October 12, 2018 by Raimie

[dmclarke90]

On my 2017 25 LSV (closed cooling), I winterize by removing all plugs and then re-installing.  I then use RV anti-freeze with corrosion protection to suck into the engine.  I have a 5 foot hose that I connect to the Indmar in line strainer and place other end of hose in a 5 gallon bucket with the anti-freeze.  I run the engine until the bucket is empty.  Just an additional level of protection and corrosion protection.  Takes less than 5 minutes and $10 worth of anti-freeze.

[justgary]

3 hours ago, dmclarke90 said:

On my 2017 25 LSV (closed cooling), I winterize by removing all plugs and then re-installing.  I then use RV anti-freeze with corrosion protection to suck into the engine.  I have a 5 foot hose that I connect to the Indmar in line strainer and place other end of hose in a 5 gallon bucket with the anti-freeze.  I run the engine until the bucket is empty.  Just an additional level of protection and corrosion protection.  Takes less than 5 minutes and $10 worth of anti-freeze.

If you remove all plugs and don't get automotive antifreeze, you don't have closed cooling.  The engine should have antifreeze in it all of the time, and you only need to drain the raw water side of the heat exchanger and manifolds. 

[MakeNWaves]

Move to So Cal, never winterized in my life.

[MadMan]

7 hours ago, MakeNWaves said:

Move to So Cal, never winterized in my life.

And while that is true, often we go out, in the summer, after work and there won't be another boat within a mile of us.

[Sixball]

Going to need to pull my boat soon. I am at 33 deg. this morning. Had to put a winter jacket on to walk the dog this morning. Sad time but always feels good when all is done and put away. First hard frost this morning, everything is white . No skiing this weekend windy and cold and wet. We are also going to take the lake down eight feet for the winter freeze . I am thinking I am leaving all my docks and lifts in. At eight feet down they should be on dry land.

[minnmarker]

2 hours ago, Sixball said:

I am thinking I am leaving all my docks and lifts in. At eight feet down they should be on dry land.

Now that would make my life a whole lot easier!  Our lake, even though a reservoir, only goes up/down +-6 inches Winter or Summer.

[Sixball]

14 minutes ago, minnmarker said:

Now that would make my life a whole lot easier!  Our lake, even though a reservoir, only goes up/down +-6 inches Winter or Summer.

We don't take our lake down more the three feet most years. But our dam owner lost his license to make power two years ago and that is the way our lake level was controlled. Buy dumping through the turbines. So now we are spilling through the spillways and its not a good deal for frozen lakes. Long story we are looking at owning our and three other lakes soon. Our lake in January. At that time we will start modification and updates. We have applied for a new license but it a long five or more year journey.  

[Soon2BV]

drain all lines.  blow thru heater core (my lungs, nothing powered), pour in RV anti-freeze into the block.

"I have done my Malibu's this way for 43* years and never had a problem".  

 

* Editors note - the first Malibu was a '67, 2 door, with a 283, 2 speed power glide, vinyl top and rear window defogger.   

[MakeNWaves]

On “The River” tomorrow.  Air 91, water 74.  No need to winterize.

[electricjohn]

I leave the block dry, but also blow compressed air into the tranny cooler and vacuum the drain holes using a shop vac.  My biggest concern about using anti-freeze is how to get it out of the engine completely before running engine in the lake.

[electricjohn]

On 10/15/2019 at 12:53 AM, MakeNWaves said:

On “The River” tomorrow.  Air 91, water 74.  No need to winterize.

We interrupt our boating season with a snow mobile season.

[bbattiste247]

On 10/14/2019 at 9:53 PM, MakeNWaves said:

On “The River” tomorrow.  Air 91, water 74.  No need to winterize.

I love the area and the river, but we went there (from LV) a few years back and it was crazy busy. I'll never forget the jet ski coming straight for us then it turned at the last minute, leaving everyone in the boat scared and wet. I haven't been able to convince my crew to go back. But I have never winterized either. 

[Fffrank]

4 hours ago, electricjohn said:

I leave the block dry, but also blow compressed air into the tranny cooler and vacuum the drain holes using a shop vac.  My biggest concern about using anti-freeze is how to get it out of the engine completely before running engine in the lake.

Marine antifreeze (Propylene glycol) is non-toxic and biodegradable in both fresh water and salt water (as well as soil.)  They use it by the truckload to de-ice planes.

[Eagleboy99]

2 hours ago, Fffrank said:

Marine antifreeze (Propylene glycol) is non-toxic and biodegradable in both fresh water and salt water (as well as soil.)  They use it by the truckload to de-ice planes.

Not quite correct - high LD50 but still toxic.  And pretty much every major airport has PG recovery systems.  But sure better than EG!