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hawaiianstyln

Unfortunately someone loosened lugnuts :(

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hawaiianstyln

65 miles from 13 hour tow to Hot Springs for our honeymoon ending and it appears someone loosened all our lug nuts on one rim.  I always carry a 4-way tire iron and check rims, this morning I didn't think to check them when we left hotel.  Spent the night in Terre Haute, IA and had a 4 hour tow home for the rest of the way back and pulled into a gas station for a refill.  Turned sharp enough (maybe 50 degrees to the left) and the tire wobbled right off and jammed itself up under fender.  I thought I might have seen a slight wobble when we first started driving this morning but the roads are so bad I thought it was just road jarring.  Interesting enough, the ends of the threads are not damaged or sheered.  I had one left that just rattled off just as the tire came off.  All other lugs on rims were tight.  No way all 5 could just come loose like that when I'm always checking the rims almost every tow.  Figures the one time I didn't........

Concern now is the wheel popped the "Vault" cap off the hub on the boatmate trailer.  Are those pressed on?  Not sure if I need something new but I did try and push it back in and looks like a rubber mallet "could" do the trick??

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oldjeep

Im sure the rim is what removed the vault cap.  Out of curiosity when did you last remove that wheel, and why does there appear to be anti sieze on the studs? If you have applied anti sieze to your wheel studs, immediately remove all wherls and clean that stuff off the studs and out of the lug nuts. 

Edited by oldjeep

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macdaddy

Did you lose the rim and tire?  I had one come off.  You can pound the studs out and pound new ones in.  I would be concerned with the boat weight being on one axle.  Happened to me and I just replaced both torsion axles. 

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hawaiianstyln

Luckily the wheel came off when I was going about 2mph on an over pass to get back on highway.  So no I didn't lose anything but all 4 lugs were gone and the last one finally fell off on the overpass.  I would buy new lug bolts and just pound those out and new ones back in, just not sure how the vault cap works.  Can I just pound that back on?  Seems like it goes back on but needs a few taps with a mallet? 

@oldjeep no we did not put on anti-seize but previous owner may have.  I just put on new tires 6 months ago along with all new calipers and break pads.  I just checked the lugs before I went on this trip and during the trip.  all were perfectly tight as normal.

Edited by hawaiianstyln

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MadMan

As a point of interest, at least to someone like me, it's always a left side wheel that comes off.  Because of tire rotation, right side lug nuts self tighten, while the ones on the left self loosen.  It's the reason Chrysler put left handed lug nuts on the wheels on the left side of their cars up until 1970.  Problem was, everyone didn't know this and many lugs were twisted off by trying to remove a lug nut turning it the wrong way.

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Nitrousbird

Happened to me last year on my way to Lake Norris.  Except instead of 2MPH, I was at about 75MPH when I saw a 18" wheel rolling past me.  Thankfully it rolled into the media with no damage to the wheel itself (tread on the tire was jacked up).  Ended up with a tow, trailer shop and them welding in new studs, as they didn't have the assembly in stock (holes were screwed up a bit so you couldn't just pound in new studs).  Jacked the fender all up.

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Fman

Man that really sucks... I always check my trailer connection when I grab the truck to load the boat.  Now it appears we should all check our lug nuts that someone did not loosen them up.  I would hope this would never happen but after 10 years of boating unfortunately would not surprise me.

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nosnarb

I had a similar incident last year where someone loosened 4 of the 5 lugs on the right (passenger) side of the boat trailer all the way to the ends of the studs.  Didn't lose the wheel but it thrashed all of the studs to the point to where I couldn't get the last remaining lug nut off.  Managed to limp into an oreillys auto parts store, removed the entire hub assembly, replaced it with a new one and bolted on the spare to get home.

 

Nothing but 4 letter explicatives for people that do that kind of crap

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macdaddy

I have found that if you have a2x4 block of wood, you can get the buddy bearing to in straight.  If you don't have that...  Pound it in with hammer.  I have also ducked tapped the end of the hub to hold grease in until I could get a buddy bearing.  On a different note... I have been told that aluminum rims can contract and expand with heat which could effect lug nuts.  Do you really think someone loosened your lug nuts??  I guess people can do anything these days.  I do not think someone loosened mine.  Mine came off going down Jelico mountain on the way home from Norris lake.  I am lucky nobody was hurt.  My tire literally followed the road and rolled 3 miles down the hill.  A friend followed it slowly which ticked everybody off on I 75.  Very scary!

Edited by macdaddy

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carguy79ta

This is BS. I had some douchebag do that to my mustang back in HS. Pissed me off.

Edited by carguy79ta

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rakr

I recently had to change a tire and apparently didn’t tighten all of the lugs enough. I had a 4 way and really yanked on the to get them tight, 95% tight in the air and a good yank on the 4 way once the tire is back on the ground. I happened to be at the dealership when I noticed one of the lugs was gone. Jacked it up and the tech tightened all of them to 105ftlb. 1 week later and 2 tows, 3 of the 5 remaining lugs were loose... left side. (I’m ordering 6 new studs tomorrow, just in case).

Good thought on the left side thing @MadMan, initially I thought someone may have loosened them. I’m adding a quick hit with the 4 way to my check list before(and maybe after)  trailering. 

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granddaddy55
On 8/12/2018 at 3:47 PM, oldjeep said:

Im sure the rim is what removed the vault cap.  Out of curiosity when did you last remove that wheel, and why does there appear to be anti sieze on the studs? If you have applied anti sieze to your wheel studs, immediately remove all wherls and clean that stuff off the studs and out of the lug nuts. 

Your not talking about permatex are you?  that’s stuff is awesome when I remove wheel lugs like a knife through butter even though it was tight and snug before I start turning with 4 way.  also use it on my tower knobs , not a spec of corrosion or different metal interaction on wheel lugs or studs or knob threads or tower threads for knob

highly recommend permatex for this area snd tower knobs, put it on myself at dealer in their garage on delivery 4.5 years ago, original application still there snd in good shape  

Edited by granddaddy55

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oldjeep

Permatex is a brand name for all sorts of different products.  But using antiseize or grease on lugs and studs is a huge no no

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dalt1
12 minutes ago, oldjeep said:

Permatex is a brand name for all sorts of different products.  But using antiseize or grease on lugs and studs is a huge no no

I know all torque specs are for clean and dry treads but what does a coat of lube do to that spec? Do you end up over tightened because it's lubed? Torque is the stretch on the bolt so Seems like it wouldn't matter.

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oldjeep
47 minutes ago, dalt1 said:

I know all torque specs are for clean and dry treads but what does a coat of lube do to that spec? Do you end up over tightened because it's lubed? Torque is the stretch on the bolt so Seems like it wouldn't matter.

Yes, you can wind up at almost double dry torque.  In addition if the antisieze gets between the nut cone and wheel it can defeat the friction you are depending on to keep the nut from turning. 

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carguy79ta
13 hours ago, oldjeep said:

Yes, you can wind up at almost double dry torque.  In addition if the antisieze gets between the nut cone and wheel it can defeat the friction you are depending on to keep the nut from turning. 

Agree. Torque is torque. If you lube the threads, therefore reducing friction, you can get twice the bolt stretch.

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solorex
13 hours ago, oldjeep said:

Yes, you can wind up at almost double dry torque.  In addition if the antisieze gets between the nut cone and wheel it can defeat the friction you are depending on to keep the nut from turning. 

I have been racing cars for 18yrs and I have never once heard this.  I have been using anti-seize on my studs since day 1 , all sorts of different wheels soft super light race wheels with slicks, my daily driver cars etc... never once had a torque issue.

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Falko

Wouldn't you end up with varying torque rates on engine assemblies by using oil/grease on studs there as well? Serious question.  I've always put never seize on studs and never had an issue, but I want to be sure I'm doing it right, so....

EDIT:

Just found this, https://www.antiseize.com/PDFs/torque_specifications.pdf

 

Edited by Falko

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MadMan
1 hour ago, Falko said:

Wouldn't you end up with varying torque rates on engine assemblies by using oil/grease on studs there as well? Serious question. 

This is absolutely true.  Fastener torque specs are always given with the type of lube (or dry) used.  Every wheel nut torque I've seen is specified dry.

You don't have to actually measure torque to stretch a bolt correctly.  It's semi-common when building a race engine to actually measure the rod bolts stretch when tightening, as opposed to using a torque wrench.

 

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solorex

Guess you learn something new everyday.  I'd never use it during engine assembly... but on wheel studs I started ever since I saw my dad needing to torch off a lugnut on his aluminum wheels on his Isuzu in the '90s.  Suppose I have been overtorquing for quite a while.  But never had an issue.

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oldjeep
8 hours ago, solorex said:

I have been racing cars for 18yrs and I have never once heard this.  I have been using anti-seize on my studs since day 1 , all sorts of different wheels soft super light race wheels with slicks, my daily driver cars etc... never once had a torque issue.

Not super suprising, we're still having e10 myth conversations 25 years after it became main stream 😁

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Falko
37 minutes ago, oldjeep said:

Not super suprising, we're still having e10 myth conversations 25 years after it became main stream 😁

you bite your tongue! E10 is the DEVIL!!!!

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