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Sub upgrade question


ndahlberg12

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1 hour ago, MLA said:

Um, im referring to the amp, the OP currently has. He cannot safely bridge a 2 ohm load on the HT-6 and in no way, shape, or form, will the xi-12 ever net 300W rms from that amp as you calculated. 

Ahhh... so the limitation is his WS amp. But you didn’t say that. No, you said the following:

”Since its been shown that the exile xi 12" woofer cannot be safely bridged wired in parallel @ 2 ohm and wired safely”

Ladies and gentleman, I present to you this exhibit as just one of many subtle examples of how MLA operates. Rather that say the WS amp is the limitation, he blames the Exile sub. Only when cornered by a knowledgeable reader does the truth come out. Most unsuspecting readers would never pick up on his craft. 

Allow me to share another example. The OP stated a preference for the Exile sub. He also said that while he didn’t necessarily want to buy a new amp, he would buy a an Exile Javeline amp if necessary. It took MLA less than one hour to swoop in and recommend a complete WS solution (ie  dude patrols this forum and only this forum looking for sales). Mind you, nowhere in the OP did he ask for brand advice or open the door to this recommendation. In fact he specifically said if anything he’d buy a Javeline. 

So tell me MLA, as long as you were recommending a sub+amp combo, why the redirect to WS?  If the WS amp he has can’t hack it, why does he have to buy an entirely new WS combo?  Why not simply say, “yeah, I see your preference for Exile, I recommend you get that Javeline after all and sell the factory amp to offset our cost?”  I mean, at that point you’re already blowing his budget? If you’re truly about the user, why not stick to his stated brand preference?

@ndahlberg12 I stand by recommendation. Run the Xi12 on your factory amp. It’s not going to blow up. You can always upgrade later. And know that the advice you’re getting from MLA is actually a sales pitch. Lemme guess, he’s probably pm’d you too.  

Come on MLA, is it too much to ask that you follow basic forum etiquette?  This is Internet 101 stuff...

Edited by IXFE
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I ❤️ This.... 👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾

 

This is has been his MO for YEARS...maybe DECADES. I’m glad someone else.... @IXFE realizes this too. 

Stereo Wars 2018 edition??? I’m pretty sure the SW1 was started by this same etiquette.

Edited by Bawshogg
  • Like 2
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1 hour ago, cowwboy said:

Like I posted earlier and linking to where others have done it quite often.

You do not have to utilize both coils.

So if he wants to run exile there is the solution. 

I personally prefer DD and they will build you anything you want, depending on your check book.  But the original poster was not asking for opinions of what other subs he should by.

I dont subscribe to this practice. If building the system, as in buying the components, its most logical to just choose a woofer with a coil configuration and RMS that best matches the amp. When running just one VC, you alter the T/S parameters. This makes it difficult to design a proper enclosure and tune the amp.   Since the xi-12 only comes in one configuration and only other woofer they offer is 2X the cost, I suggested a different brand that does offer the ideal coil configuration.  

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36 minutes ago, MLA said:

I suggested a different brand that does offer the ideal coil configuration.  

Oh, now it’s simply a “different brand.”  Way to diffuse pile of poop you’ve stepped in. 

Let me ask you this (again)... since you’re suddenly so worried about the “the ideal coil configuration” in addition to being the OP’s preference, isn’t the Xi12 also the “ideal coil configuring” when paired with the Javelin, his preferred amp?

Edit: Stop trying to muddy the water with the Big12. You’re literally the only person in this thread who’s brought it up (twice). 

Edited by IXFE
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1 hour ago, minnmarker said:

Perhaps members that make money off boat related products or that are dealers should have to disclose that?

It is pretty obvious that MLA is a stereo shop.

I have so many things to say about this thread. :(But instead choose to not trash any other members or their what they believe is the better product. We all tend to get passionate about what we feel about a better product. I have Wetsounds in my boat, and helped build a friends budget build with Exile. I have talked to many professionals about the differences. Do your homework and decide for yourself.  :)

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2 hours ago, minnmarker said:

What happened to the OP?  Remember @ndahlberg12?

Perhaps members that make money off boat related products or that are dealers should have to disclose that?  I know there is a newer member that works at a dealer and is up front about it - as they should be.

Still here. Just getting caught up. I appreciate @MLA comments, it does seem slanted to wetsounds but some good information I hadn’t thought about that could help keep this mod cost down.

@IXFE has brought up several valid points as well. Really appreciate all of your thoughts. I’ve followed several of your builds and was hoping you would chime in. 

I must say I’m a little more confused as to direction than when we started, which isn’t a terrible thing. For how we use our boat, cabin and speakers work fine, the end goal is to wake up the low end without spending a fortune. 

What I have gathered. 

1. Run one of the wetsounds subs with existing amp and be fine. 

2. If I want to run the exile 12 like I want, I ideally need to add an amp or replace the wetsounds with a Javeline to do it correctly and efficiently. 

So my next question, if I decide to move forward with replacing and running a Javeline, can I just remove and replace with existing wiring?

Has anyone else had any luck finding. A prefab box that can be used or is custom the only route?

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1 hour ago, ndahlberg12 said:

Still here. Just getting caught up. I appreciate @MLA comments, it does seem slanted to wetsounds but some good information I hadn’t thought about that could help keep this mod cost down.

@IXFE has brought up several valid points as well. Really appreciate all of your thoughts. I’ve followed several of your builds and was hoping you would chime in. 

I must say I’m a little more confused as to direction than when we started, which isn’t a terrible thing. For how we use our boat, cabin and speakers work fine, the end goal is to wake up the low end without spending a fortune. 

What I have gathered. 

1. Run one of the wetsounds subs with existing amp and be fine. 

2. If I want to run the exile 12 like I want, I ideally need to add an amp or replace the wetsounds with a Javeline to do it correctly and efficiently. 

So my next question, if I decide to move forward with replacing and running a Javeline, can I just remove and replace with existing wiring?

Has anyone else had any luck finding. A prefab box that can be used or is custom the only route?

If you buy a Jav you’ll get a solid 800w to that sub. It can take it!  Also, the Jav has a separate dedicated power supply for the sub channel. Your plan would be to run the cabin and sub off that amp as diagmramed below. And yes, use all the existing wires. It’s plug and play. You’d basically just be swapping your factory amp for the Jav. Then you could sell the factory amp on CL to offset the cost. Or save it for a car project down the road. Sometimes it’s nice having a good multi channel amp sitting on the garage shelf!

As far as box goes, prefab is fine.  Custom is fun of you want a project or enjoy that sort of thing, but I’d run a sealed prefab if you want simple.  Hard for me to suggest one since I’m not familiar with the space a T22 has.  I’ve used QBomb in my last two builds and for $50 they’re great.  Lots of guys here swear by them. The heavy duty truck bed exterior leads us all to believe they’ll stand up to the abuse these boats take. Trick is finding the right size for your application. Pic of mine below. 

I recently installed a Xi12 in the back of my Jeep (entire project powered by one Jav mounted under the passenger seat). For that project I wanted black carpet to match the Jeep’s black carpet.  I also wanted one with a sloped back wall to match the angle of the back seat.  I found this one on eBay and it’s been great. Stick to 3/4” thick and about 1.3 cu ft

@Fman has also used QBomb (I think he got us all started on them), but if I recall he used something different for his ‘17 LSV.  I’m blanking on what it was.  Maybe he has a link for you. 

When I get home to my pc I’ll look for links to those boxes I pictured. Phone apps don’t keep that much purchase history. 

5A65FD3C-14B1-4DFE-BFF2-59793953A220.jpeg

69D607DA-8EBC-4B79-8D13-A6A6704822E1.jpeg

BA8E5A89-B386-463A-8841-3A7B4E0C93FA.jpeg

Edited by IXFE
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@ndahlberg12

1) To retain the existing amp, get its available 300W bridged power and keep it out of protect mode, you will be best served with a  4 ohm single voice coil woofer or a 2 ohm dual voice coil woofer wired in series so it places a safe 4 ohm load on the amp. 

Even staying at the current 300W, you gain a great deal of output from the increase in surface area alone. Going with a ported enclosure over a sealed, gains you even more output without any additional wattage needed. 

2) Theres potential for a significant increase in output wattage, which requires additional current draw. I would suggest reevaluating the complete amp supply chain and circuit protection. Smallish cables can cause amps to run inefficient and hotter then normal. This can lead to poor sound quality and amp going into protect mode. I want to say that your boat was built with 2ga supply trunk and 6ga branch to the amps. You may find that the existing branch cables are not long enough to reach, so replacing is needed anyway.   

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42 minutes ago, MLA said:

@ndahlberg12

1) To retain the existing amp, get its available 300W bridged power and keep it out of protect mode, you will be best served with a  4 ohm single voice coil woofer or a 2 ohm dual voice coil woofer wired in series so it places a safe 4 ohm load on the amp. 

Even staying at the current 300W, you gain a great deal of output from the increase in surface area alone. Going with a ported enclosure over a sealed, gains you even more output without any additional wattage needed. 

2) Theres potential for a significant increase in output wattage, which requires additional current draw. I would suggest reevaluating the complete amp supply chain and circuit protection. Smallish cables can cause amps to run inefficient and hotter then normal. This can lead to poor sound quality and amp going into protect mode. I want to say that your boat was built with 2ga supply trunk and 6ga branch to the amps. You may find that the existing branch cables are not long enough to reach, so replacing is needed anyway.   

Not sure I agree on the ported argument. While I applaud the attempt to get more from less, it seems like an expensive and/or time consuming bandaid. @ndahlberg12, consider this... 

1) A ported box is typically going to be much bigger making whatever space contraints you have even more pronounced (sorry, I’m not smart about the T22). 

2) Given that, a prefab ported box is going to be much harder to fit into said space. That’s going to lead you down the path of custom which is no joke. Minimum $750 by a stereo shop or significant hours, tools, and math required as a DIY’er

3) Finally and most importantly, ported boxes have a totally different sound (boomy, muddy, etc).  Some folks like that!  Others prefer sealed (musical, punchy, etc). IMO, the type of bass you want is the only reasons you choose ported vs sealed... not to overcome your 300w situation.

Honestly, unless you prefer the sound of a ported sub, I’d sooner buy that new amp before going down the ported enclosure rabbit hole. 

I agree with @MLA if factory cables to the amp are 6ga. I’d swap to 4ga, but if you’re only running one amp the 2ga trunk is fine. 

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I tend to have the same view as Dave did. Measure how much space you have for a box then go from there. 

I don't completely agree that ported boxes sound muddy and boomy as a general statement. You will normally get around 3db more output and properly built and tuned will sound great. But does require more space. 

On the lake in an open environment I bet most people couldn't tell the difference between a sealed and ported box.

Buy for $50 the qbombs are hard to beat. 

I think my linex coating on my box nearly cost that much. 

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Been looking online for boxes and taking measurements. Does everyone fire the sub towards the driver? Anyone fire the sub downward? I may be able to make that Qbomb work if I lay it down and aim it at the floor, obviously it would need to be spaced off the floor. 

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For a down-fire setup, you might need to elevate the enclosure as much as 4". This would put the woofer inside the locker, somewhat insulated, if you placed a facade back in place. Id make use of the existing facade and woofer cutout and back load the new box to the back of the facade. 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Sub and Amp are here. Brian and Donovan made me a great offer on the 12 and the javelin I could not pass up.  

 My schedule went to crap along with my installer buddy. Found a very knowledgeable guy that specializes in marine audio just to the south of me about 45 minutes. We had a long talk and I’m very excited, dropped the boat off before I left town. On the road this week for work, hoping to come home to some progress so I can get back on the water!

Current plan is to go side fire ported box as big as we can get. He said he will come up with a sketch for me wary this week I’ll post up for other people pondering this mod as I struggled to find many others that have done it and documented it. He’s also going to try and get my underwater lights separated from the interior lights. 

BFDFFB46-0401-4589-8179-346278A21582.jpeg

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Installer sent me a few pictures, soooooooo excited to hear it. 

Box is just shy of 2 cu ft after the woofer displacement, we went back and forth on sealed vs ported. So he is going to build it sealed and get it installed and see how it sounds.

Box will be spaced off the floor with rubber feet and mounted to the “new” kick panel. Woofer will fire forward. Box is built from 1in marine plywood and has been sealed with 3 coats of poly. 

F933B13C-C1ED-4FE5-83DA-B0605859C641.jpeg

0F4A567B-C370-4FC0-9C9A-C6E9CD666B90.jpeg

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On 4/14/2018 at 3:21 PM, IXFE said:

If you buy a Jav you’ll get a solid 800w to that sub. It can take it!  Also, the Jav has a separate dedicated power supply for the sub channel. Your plan would be to run the cabin and sub off that amp as diagmramed below. And yes, use all the existing wires. It’s plug and play. You’d basically just be swapping your factory amp for the Jav. Then you could sell the factory amp on CL to offset the cost. Or save it for a car project down the road. Sometimes it’s nice having a good multi channel amp sitting on the garage shelf!

As far as box goes, prefab is fine.  Custom is fun of you want a project or enjoy that sort of thing, but I’d run a sealed prefab if you want simple.  Hard for me to suggest one since I’m not familiar with the space a T22 has.  I’ve used QBomb in my last two builds and for $50 they’re great.  Lots of guys here swear by them. The heavy duty truck bed exterior leads us all to believe they’ll stand up to the abuse these boats take. Trick is finding the right size for your application. Pic of mine below. 

I recently installed a Xi12 in the back of my Jeep (entire project powered by one Jav mounted under the passenger seat). For that project I wanted black carpet to match the Jeep’s black carpet.  I also wanted one with a sloped back wall to match the angle of the back seat.  I found this one on eBay and it’s been great. Stick to 3/4” thick and about 1.3 cu ft

@Fman has also used QBomb (I think he got us all started on them), but if I recall he used something different for his ‘17 LSV.  I’m blanking on what it was.  Maybe he has a link for you. 

When I get home to my pc I’ll look for links to those boxes I pictured. Phone apps don’t keep that much purchase history. 

5A65FD3C-14B1-4DFE-BFF2-59793953A220.jpeg

69D607DA-8EBC-4B79-8D13-A6A6704822E1.jpeg

BA8E5A89-B386-463A-8841-3A7B4E0C93FA.jpeg

So can you put a ws free air 10” sub in a q bomb ?  I assume they have a 10 inch or adapter?

i have too much power for @ndahlberg12 repurposed xs fa 10  on my SD4 if I runnit bridged (675mono) and under powered at 185 rms if I don’t bridge.  I may put it on same channel bridged with another fa 10 or 12 mounted in the foot well with dahlberg’s 10 in a qbomb that I may keep in the coffin and bring it out to rock out when we go swimming

My stereo guy said don’t sweat it , we can run the one 10” at 185.  Take advantage of gains and with the with 6 inboats revo6 on @ndahlberg12 repurposed  ht6 at 110 rms per speaker per channel  it might be real sweet . I think he was bridging mono on 2chsnnels at 300 and 4 channels 100 per on 4 or 6 inboats

MY REAL WORRY WAS CUTTING A 10” hole in foot well and coming back one day and wanting to cut a 12” hole around/over/modify a previous cut 10” hole to be 12”

seriously thinking of getting a REVO 12 new from ws or eBay  for $299 (2 OHM OR 4 OHM?????) and cut one hole run the 500 rms 12” now at 685 mono bridged turned down s little and add the repurposed 10 later in a qbomb

cheapest and most likely is the 10 I have installed free air, but the quandary of hole cutting later?!?!

i do not want or have room for a regularly situated box in cabin of a 20 ft picklefork boat or taking up my foot well. Could add a hatchback box later behind footwell or full 10 inch qbomb or other box off floor mounted concentric to cut hole to existing free air 10 or 12 and it still looks like heater hoses would go around it maybe rub on it a little going in and out, again fa in a box?? Good bad in between ?

Edited by granddaddy55
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1 hour ago, granddaddy55 said:

So can you put a ws free air 10” sub in a q bomb ?

You can run any woofer in any sort of enclosure type you want. However, the woofer may not perform to its potential, it may not sound good and it's power handling can be greatly effected. Improper enclosure can also lead to woofer failure. In regards to that particular woofer, I dont like how it sounds in a small sealed enclosure.

1 hour ago, granddaddy55 said:

 I may put it on same channel bridged with another fa 10 or 12 mounted

1st, I would not suggest running 2 different size woofers together off the same amp. You are forced to tune to the smaller of the two.

2nd, you have a 4 ohm woofer currently, so its not going to work adding a 2nd. You will not be able to obtain a safe impedance for the amp, or one that will allow the woofers to net the available wattage.

2 hours ago, granddaddy55 said:

MY REAL WORRY WAS CUTTING A 10” hole in foot well and coming back one day and wanting to cut a 12” hole around/over/modify a previous cut 10” hole to be 12”

Its easy to make the hole larger, its the other way that sucks

2 hours ago, granddaddy55 said:

seriously thinking of getting a REVO 12 new from ws or eBay  for $299 (2 OHM OR 4 OHM?????)

What advice does the seller have? No reason for them to not have some skin in the game.  

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On ‎4‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 9:09 AM, cowwboy said:

Like I posted earlier and linking to where others have done it quite often.

You do not have to utilize both coils.

So if he wants to run exile there is the solution. 

I personally prefer DD and they will build you anything you want, depending on your check book.  But the original poster was not asking for opinions of what other subs he should by.

Oh but you do have to utilize both coils in any DVC woofer. Whether in parallel, in series, or discrete with a stereo amplifier. Otherwise you have placed the woofer at risk power handling wise, and you've altered the parameters.

  

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Quote: ["3) Finally and most importantly, ported boxes have a totally different sound (boomy, muddy, etc).  Some folks like that!  Others prefer sealed (musical, punchy, etc). IMO, the type of bass you want is the only reasons you choose ported vs sealed... not to overcome your 300w situation."]

This would only be true if you have a poorly designed ported box, and there are certainly plenty of those examples. But bass-reflex/ported enclosures should not be discounted for lack of sound quality, because it's just not true when designed and executed correctly. Premier recording studios don't accept boomy, muddy bass from their $30K bass-reflex monitors, and home audiophiles investing six figures in a pair of bass-reflex speakers have zero tolerance for boomy, muddy bass. Yes, a ported enclosure is likely to be larger than a sealed enclosure, but you can also get another full octave of deep bass extension, or simply more deep bass output, or some combination of the two depending on the design, and with great tonal quality if that's the goal.

    

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To David's point.  I've been considering finding a way to get a little more room and shift my sealed enclosure over to a ported enclosure for my JL 12W6v3-D4 sub.  I've been doing a bunch of work on WinISD tinkering with designs.  It's tight under there with a heater core installed.  Here's the sub response for a sealed and properly ported enclosure for the same driver.  You have to balance air velocity through the port, impedance, where to put your high pass filter (aka subsonic filter), not ignore the excursion.  Then you have to investigate the group delay and phase of the sound coming from the box.  It's a bit different with a ported vs sealed.

In my last boat I had the JL10W6v2 sub in a sealed box and just didn't like it.  I then did the ported box.  Both pretty close to JL recommended specs with some input from David.  I WAY more preferred the ported box.  Felt like I had a 12" sub in a sealed enclosure in there instead of a 10".

YMMV.  But if you don't want to potentially design a few boxes to get things right, then sticking with a sealed enclosure is less painful.

2018-05-23_13-38-24.png

Edited by Slurpee
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Hi Slurpee,

Just thinking aloud and adding a few random points. There are certainly many more bass-reflex alignments than shown. Above, there's a nice +3dB crest centered about 50 Hz. In truth, 50 to 80 Hz is where most of the music's bass energy falls, and normally one would select an 80 Hz lowpass at the top of that range. So the above are pretty good options. However, an alternate alignment could be zero crest in exchange for greater deep bass extension. In contrast, you could even enlarge the peak at the cost of low bass extension. What's kind of universal in various subwoofer raw drivers and enclosure loading methods, is you tend to get a similar amount of overall energy, you just get it focused in different areas. In a typical 12" sealed example, when aiming for a musical Qtc of say .85, the loaded resonance is often double the raw driver free-air resonance and the output is already at one/half power by 45 Hz, rolling off at 12 dB per octave below that point, as illustrated above. Versus a closed automobile cabin where the low bass rises at a 2nd order rate, that extra low bass output of a bass-reflex system in an open-air boat is REALLY welcomed.     

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1 hour ago, David said:

Quote: ["3) Finally and most importantly, ported boxes have a totally different sound (boomy, muddy, etc).  Some folks like that!  Others prefer sealed (musical, punchy, etc). IMO, the type of bass you want is the only reasons you choose ported vs sealed... not to overcome your 300w situation."]

This would only be true if you have a poorly designed ported box, and there are certainly plenty of those examples. But bass-reflex/ported enclosures should not be discounted for lack of sound quality, because it's just not true when designed and executed correctly. Premier recording studios don't accept boomy, muddy bass from their $30K bass-reflex monitors, and home audiophiles investing six figures in a pair of bass-reflex speakers have zero tolerance for boomy, muddy bass. Yes, a ported enclosure is likely to be larger than a sealed enclosure, but you can also get another full octave of deep bass extension, or simply more deep bass output, or some combination of the two depending on the design, and with great tonal quality if that's the goal.

    

David I totally agree. I should have qualified my statement. Let me take another shot...

Building a ported box is infinitely more difficult than just settling for sealed. There’s so much more science/math involved with getting a ported box built/tuned correctly to optimize sound quality for a given woofer (none of which are the same). Doing it in a constrained space like a boat is another variable working against you. For a DIY it’s a real challenge even if they’re handy with the wood working tools. And it’s not as simple as just hiring a pro.  Some are true artists and others are just glueing together mdf (or worse). 

So my point was... a boomy, muddy sound is often the result of a ported box project that just didn’t pan out despite best efforts to understand what the woofer wants and execute the enclosure accordingly. The tough part is this... it’s a huge gamble of either money or time or both... you really don’t know what it’s gonna sound like until you’re done. You’re either gonna be pleasantly surprised or kinda disappointed.

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1 hour ago, David said:

Quote: ["3) Finally and most importantly, ported boxes have a totally different sound (boomy, muddy, etc).  Some folks like that!  Others prefer sealed (musical, punchy, etc). IMO, the type of bass you want is the only reasons you choose ported vs sealed... not to overcome your 300w situation."]

This would only be true if you have a poorly designed ported box, and there are certainly plenty of those examples. But bass-reflex/ported enclosures should not be discounted for lack of sound quality, because it's just not true when designed and executed correctly. Premier recording studios don't accept boomy, muddy bass from their $30K bass-reflex monitors, and home audiophiles investing six figures in a pair of bass-reflex speakers have zero tolerance for boomy, muddy bass. Yes, a ported enclosure is likely to be larger than a sealed enclosure, but you can also get another full octave of deep bass extension, or simply more deep bass output, or some combination of the two depending on the design, and with great tonal quality if that's the goal.

    

A well designed ported box will sound good. Take into account what kind of music you listen to. If its bass heavy make sure you tune the box/port correctly. Once you get lower than the port tuned freq. power handling drops off rapidly as does sound quality. 

Personally I prefer sealed boxes, especially on boats. Ports make great entrances to homes for all sorts critters. And also allow moisture to get at the back of the woofer, and not all marine woofers are coated/sealed on the back side.

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1 hour ago, IXFE said:

David I totally agree. I should have qualified my statement. Let me take another shot...

Building a ported box is infinitely more difficult than just settling for sealed. There’s so much more science/math involved with getting a ported box built/tuned correctly to optimize sound quality for a given woofer (none of which are the same). Doing it in a constrained space like a boat is another variable working against you. For a DIY it’s a real challenge even if they’re handy with the wood working tools. And it’s not as simple as just hiring a pro.  Some are true artists and others are just glueing together mdf (or worse). 

So my point was... a boomy, muddy sound is often the result of a ported box project that just didn’t pan out despite best efforts to understand what the woofer wants and execute the enclosure accordingly. The tough part is this... it’s a huge gamble of either money or time or both... you really don’t know what it’s gonna sound like until you’re done. You’re either gonna be pleasantly surprised or kinda disappointed.

It doesn't have to be crap shoot. Good, technically-proficient vendors will supply every detail needed to get it right. Before I was retired 5 years ago, a boat owner would send me their maximum external enclosure dimensions per their boat. Some would build a cardboard mockup just to be sure that it would fit into the under-helm cavity (insert angles, legroom, cables, heater, etc.). From that info I would decide which sub/driver and loading system would offer the best results from that available space. Then a DIY boat owner was building exactly to spec. It works much better when you place the horse before the cart and begin with the enclosure rather than the subwoofer. Many others are still providing that same technical assistance.

Btw, let me make this distinction about another topic in this thread, just to be clear and maybe save a member some serious heartburn one day. You can run a 2-ohm load safely on a single channel of most amplifiers. You can run a 4-ohm load safely on two bridged channels of most amplifiers. But, with a great majority of amplifiers, you cannot safely bridge two channels into a 2-ohm load. It could work for a while, but you would likely suffer an early thermal shutdown on a July/Aug afternoon. And doing this continuously could permanently damage the amplifier. So in this discussion, consider that one amplifier example had a mono single-channel to drive the 2-ohm subwoofer (and that's perfectly fine), and the other amplifier example having two channels in the bridged mode would not be fine to drive a 2-ohm load. Not a brand to brand thing. Just about fully knowing the individual products and their applications.   

     

Edited by David
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