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Board, fin configuration questions


bovhica

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I've only been surfing for one season.  I'm a bigger guy. 5'11 290.  I started on an IS Red Rocket (impulse buy.)  It is a good board for a fat guy to learn on, but i got board quickly after a few sessions.  I purchased upgraded fins for it and tried different configurations, but ultimately couldn't find the ride I wanted.  I decided to try a skim style board late last season in the P5 Model X 58".  I guess it's more of a hybrid with the 2" 3 fin thruster configuration, but i really enjoyed progressing on the board and loved the feel and ride.  I felt more comfortable using the edges, so I guess the skim/hybrid type suits me the best.  I haven't tried other fin configurations yet but am looking forward to doing so.  Only negative was I think I have a bit too much weight for the Model X and have to really get forward on the board with my stance to lengthen the sweet spot.  It also seemed to really dig down into the water with my weight on it and pearling is a problem if I get too aggressive. Best solution would be to loose weight, obviously, but in the meantime,  I purchased a Phase 5 Trident this year with the thought it will be a better fit for my weight and help me advance with a similar feel to the X, until I can get those lbs. off.   It only came with a single 1" fin, but i have the model x fins to experiment with if I don't like it as is.  What fin configuration would you all recommend for me as I attempt to be more aggressive this season and progress as a rider?  Maybe try to pull a 3, if that's even possible at my size?

I have a 2011 V-Ride 21, 600 up front, 500 in ski locker, 750s in rear, wake shaper and floating wedge.  I adjust depending on passengers, but have plenty of options for a wake that will push me.  Usually need it pretty steep but with the weight up front can actually get the length if the wave relatively long for what we are working with.  I usually surf at 10.2 to 10.6 mph depending on conditions.  Any faster and I really can't stay on the wave.  Any suggestions or observations about our setup that I need to change?

 

 

Edited by bovhica
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One more question.  My wife will attempt to surf this year.  She is 5' 6" and 155ish.  Was pregnant last season and couldn't give it a try.  I purchased a Victoria pixie 48" for her, but am wondering if she ought to start on our boat board, which is a broadcast  (the longer version) Or possibly the model X before the pixie?  Anyone with experience with these boards and beginners?

Thanks.

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I have the Model X 58" and am typically around 220lbs. I like it best with just the 2 outer fins but plan to play with it more this year. I have found the Model X to be much too fast for most women who have tried to ride it, especially beginners. They keep leaning back and it keeps accelerating forward towards the boat, they eventually fall off the back side.

For beginners I have an old Hyperlite Broadcast that is slow and stable and it works well to get them started without feeling like they will hit the back of the boat.

My wife is around 105lbs. and I got her a Phase 5 Super Fish 49". She loves it and it's a perfect board for her since she can control it. It's rated up to 165 lbs but would be a little slow for people near that upper weight limit.   

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Thanks for the info Brett.  I'll try the 2 fin configuration on the X and also the Trident and go from there.  I have the broadcast but it is the longer one and thought it might be too long for my wife but it may work just to get her up let her get her balance.  Most beginner's I have had with me seem to like the Btoadcast best when they first start but they have all been 175 lbs+ guys.  With the three fins and length it will probably be the most stable board for her to start.  I think she will eventually like the pixie 48", but just not sure if it would be to her advantage to start on It or the Broadcast.  Anyone have experience with a beginner on the Pixie?

Edited by bovhica
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4 hours ago, bovhica said:

Thanks for the info Brett.  I'll try the 2 fin configuration on the X and also the Trident and go from there.  I have the broadcast but it is the longer one and thought it might be too long for my wife but it may work just to get her up let her get her balance.  Most beginner's I have had with me seem to like the Btoadcast best when they first start but they have all been 175 lbs+ guys.  With the three fins and length it will probably be the most stable board for her to start.  I think she will eventually like the pixie 48", but just not sure if it would be to her advantage to start on It or the Broadcast.  Anyone have experience with a beginner on the Pixie?

Just have her try both, back to back.  She will quickly find out which she prefers.  

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4 hours ago, bovhica said:

Thanks for the info Brett.  I'll try the 2 fin configuration on the X and also the Trident and go from there.  I have the broadcast but it is the longer one and thought it might be too long for my wife but it may work just to get her up let her get her balance.  Most beginner's I have had with me seem to like the Btoadcast best when they first start but they have all been 175 lbs+ guys.  With the three fins and length it will probably be the most stable board for her to start.  I think she will eventually like the pixie 48", but just not sure if it would be to her advantage to start on It or the Broadcast.  Anyone have experience with a beginner on the Pixie?

Why as a big guy do you feel you should go skim style

there is much more Board and buoyancy available in surf style boards

with just your smaller rear fins in the front fin beds of your quad as a two fin config setup in replacing the larger fins and not using them, a surf style can be quite loose and fun. 

as well as give you more pumping ability than your skim board due to your skill level, the skim style board  and your size . 

You would do better on surf and ax you progress and lose weight you can easier trsnsition to smaller surf style and still rock , 

better smaller surf style for me thsn my 1st surf style and I was much better, sand will happen for you 

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On 3/21/2018 at 7:23 PM, SCMike said:

Just have her try both, back to back.  She will quickly find out which she prefers.  

Thanks.  Probably the best and simplest advice.

 Just got her pixie today.  She is excited to try!  Now just need the weather to turn for us!

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On 3/21/2018 at 7:47 PM, granddaddy55 said:

Why as a big guy do you feel you should go skim style

there is much more Board and buoyancy available in surf style boards

with just your smaller rear fins in the front fin beds of your quad as a two fin config setup in replacing the larger fins and not using them, a surf style can be quite loose and fun. 

as well as give you more pumping ability than your skim board due to your skill level, the skim style board  and your size . 

You would do better on surf and ax you progress and lose weight you can easier trsnsition to smaller surf style and still rock , 

better smaller surf style for me thsn my 1st surf style and I was much better, sand will happen for you 

Not sure, I just preferred the ride of the model X over the IS Red Rocket, so I went that direction on my latest purchase.  Maybe I ought to demo another surf style board at some point this year.

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I was 284 last summer and I ride a Model X.  Definitely only run with the two outer fins and take out the center fin.  I found the three fin configuration to be considerably slower feeling.  

I've ridden several surf style board (P5 wire, doomswell) and still come back to hybrid.  Its not a [pure] skim style.  My first board was a HL Shim which was also a hybrid.  While the surf style boards have more volume, they generally have a rounded edge that I find slower (my opinion).

My point is .. don't let anyone tell you which style you should be riding.  Ride as many boards as you can get your hands on a pick what feels right.  The model x is a great board and I could do 3's at 284 lbs.

That said ... I'm 220 and still losing.  Curious to see how that changes my surfing.  Reason to buy another board??   haha

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2 hours ago, bovhica said:

Thanks.  Probably the best and simplest advice.

 Just got her pixie today.  She is excited to try!  Now just need the weather to turn for us!

Good stuff!  I’m heading out tomorrow, first day of the season.  pixie is a cool board!  I’m actually thinking of getting my wife one too.  Victoria is based about a mile from my house.  I’ve gone in and shot the s*** with the guys one day.  Super cool guys. 

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Bought my wife a Pixie a few weeks ago.  Everything is iced up here, so she hasn't ridden it yet.  But I've been told it is awesome.  

Edited by saxton15
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On 3/23/2018 at 8:23 PM, pauley71 said:

I was 284 last summer and I ride a Model X.  Definitely only run with the two outer fins and take out the center fin.  I found the three fin configuration to be considerably slower feeling.  

I've ridden several surf style board (P5 wire, doomswell) and still come back to hybrid.  Its not a [pure] skim style.  My first board was a HL Shim which was also a hybrid.  While the surf style boards have more volume, they generally have a rounded edge that I find slower (my opinion).

My point is .. don't let anyone tell you which style you should be riding.  Ride as many boards as you can get your hands on a pick what feels right.  The model x is a great board and I could do 3's at 284 lbs.

That said ... I'm 220 and still losing.  Curious to see how that changes my surfing.  Reason to buy another board??   haha

Thanks Pauley.  Seems that the guys who ride the X like it with the 2 outer fins. Just curious....were you riding with the 2" or 1" fins on the Model X?  Definitely appreciate input from a guy that has experience on my board and was around my weight! 280+ to 220 is awesome by the way! You may just have to buy another board as a reward....lol.  I'd settle for 250 by June.  I should be close or ball park the way things are going.

I'm with you on the hybrid ride vs surf ( with my limited experience.)  I just felt more comfortable and was able to do much more on the wave with less effort.

The 2 fins will be my first go on both the Trident and Model X.   Can't hardly wait, as Idaho keeps teasing us with 60 degree days followed by freezing temps.  water temps are mid 40s, so still a long wait for us fair weather boaters.  I  woke up to snow this morning! Grrrr!

Edited by bovhica
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On 3/23/2018 at 10:01 PM, SCMike said:

Good stuff!  I’m heading out tomorrow, first day of the season.  pixie is a cool board!  I’m actually thinking of getting my wife one too.  Victoria is based about a mile from my house.  I’ve gone in and shot the s*** with the guys one day.  Super cool guys. 

Have to say that I'm pretty jealous!  Wish we could get out but we are probably another month out, at least, before I attempt getting in the water.  Hope you all have a great start to the season!

Don't go buy her one right away.  I may have an almost new one available for a great price if the wife doesn't like it.....lol j/k.

Edited by bovhica
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On 3/24/2018 at 3:35 PM, saxton15 said:

Bought my wife a Pixie a few weeks ago.  Everything is iced up here, so she hasn't ridden it yet.  But I've been told it is awesome.  

Hope she likes it.  How long has she been riding?  I assume she is not a first timer like my wife.  I've been thinking that I ought to get her up on the broadcast first with the 3 fins for more stability before she tries the pixie.  Any thoughts?  Please let us know how she likes her new board!

  I took the boat out for a preseason run a couple weeks ago when we had a nice day. Got it summerized and made sure everything was operational, then woke up to 3 inches of snow this morning!  I feel your pain!  We are probably a month or so from actually getting behind the boat.

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27 minutes ago, bovhica said:

 I've been thinking that I ought to get her up on the broadcast first with the 3 fins for more stability before she tries the pixie.  Any thoughts?  Please let us know how she likes her new board!

I would have her learn on the broadcast first.  You want to make it as effortless and fun as possible, so she has fun out there.  More fun = more time on the water for everyone.  She could probably ride a full session or two on the broadcast before she starts to Jones for a higher performance board.

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1 minute ago, SCMike said:

I would have her learn on the broadcast first.  You want to make it as effortless and fun as possible, so she has fun out there.  More fun = more time on the water for everyone.  She could probably ride a full session or two on the broadcast before she starts to Jones for a higher performance board.

Perfect!  Thank you.  Now all I have to do is convince her....lol.  She had her new board in the living room trying to figure out her stance....she doesn't even know if she's regular or goofy!  Either way it's going to be a fun season!!!

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Have her stand with her feet together and close her eyes. Push her back and see which foot goes back first. That’s her natural stance. 

Just don’t do it at the top of the stairs. Haha

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8 minutes ago, pauley71 said:

Have her stand with her feet together and close her eyes. Push her back and see which foot goes back first. That’s her natural stance. 

Just don’t do it at the top of the stairs. Haha

First, Lmao at the stairs comment.  Second, I read this to my wife and she asked if I wanted to try it now.  I said sure.  She replies "you just want to push me!"  

 

Edit:  she's regular....thanks for the tip.

Edited by bovhica
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On 3/25/2018 at 7:25 PM, bovhica said:

First, Lmao at the stairs comment.  Second, I read this to my wife and she asked if I wanted to try it now.  I said sure.  She replies "you just want to push me!"  

 

Edit:  she's regular....thanks for the tip.

If your determining that then she’s a Board newbie , getting up on a surf board is easier than 80 back on a board with bindings BUIUUUUT, once up you feel like your on a pane of glass with grease especially in a skim or hybrid because their leaning back against pull of rope snd not leaning forward because it’s counter intuitive (though I agree broadcast with 3 fins is a great learning board).  What about teaching her to wakeboard or other 1st to get used to a sideways Board stance and edging 

I do agree though that many just fail long line to get up and that can ruin a day after holding on to rope and drinking water or other when falling/getting up,  

if surfing is her 1st Board experience she may get up much easier but that slick as grease feeling and the board slipping out from under you is very frustrating as folks are yelling stuff at you about how to stay up and surf!

my wife had 35+ years of skiing or boarding before surfing, her surfing progression to this point have been good because of this experience .  My wife is a hard learner and needs many reps, maybe yours is s natural athlete and it doesn’t matter

Edited by granddaddy55
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Only thing I would be hesitant about with starting with wakeboarding is as soon as she goes head over heels (everyone does) she probably won’t want to do it again. 

Just put her on the broadcast for a little while, have someone on the platform coaching here and everything will be fine.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I didn't read all the comments but there looks like some good advise. Your experience with the RR is fairly common.

On the other boards 3 fins is most stable, increasing the size of the center fin will increase drag a slow a board down for beginners.

I would start your wife on the broadcast, then she will likely progress quickly to a smaller board. She will struggle learning on the pixie, it will be way to responsive and twitchy. Once she has basic riding down and is able to carve then she will like the pixie a lot more.

Skim boards are designed to dig down, sinking a rail into the wake. The model x and trident are more skim than hybrid, certainly no where near surf.

I tend to think you would benefit from a better surf style board. I tend to reccomend our Ringer XL for people your size.

http://chaossurfco.com/wakesurfboards/chaos-ringer-xl

 

Nick

 

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On 3/30/2018 at 9:18 AM, Cole2001 said:

Only thing I would be hesitant about with starting with wakeboarding is as soon as she goes head over heels (everyone does) she probably won’t want to do it again. 

Just put her on the broadcast for a little while, have someone on the platform coaching here and everything will be fine.

Your right there , wife did a front edge header 6 years ago and detatched retina, road skate fir years until she road agsin in 2017, but I just find newbies never before on a board just lean back with surf rope in hand and Board flips out forward and it takes long time for them to start leaning forwards 

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 3/30/2018 at 7:24 AM, granddaddy55 said:

If your determining that then she’s a Board newbie , getting up on a surf board is easier than 80 back on a board with bindings BUIUUUUT, once up you feel like your on a pane of glass with grease especially in a skim or hybrid because their leaning back against pull of rope snd not leaning forward because it’s counter intuitive (though I agree broadcast with 3 fins is a great learning board).  What about teaching her to wakeboard or other 1st to get used to a sideways Board stance and edging 

I do agree though that many just fail long line to get up and that can ruin a day after holding on to rope and drinking water or other when falling/getting up,  

if surfing is her 1st Board experience she may get up much easier but that slick as grease feeling and the board slipping out from under you is very frustrating as folks are yelling stuff at you about how to stay up and surf!

my wife had 35+ years of skiing or boarding before surfing, her surfing progression to this point have been good because of this experience .  My wife is a hard learner and needs many reps, maybe yours is s natural athlete and it doesn’t matter

Thanks for the advice.  She does want to surf and wakeboard this summer.  Maybe we'll try the wakeboard first.

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On 3/30/2018 at 8:18 AM, Cole2001 said:

Only thing I would be hesitant about with starting with wakeboarding is as soon as she goes head over heels (everyone does) she probably won’t want to do it again. 

Just put her on the broadcast for a little while, have someone on the platform coaching here and everything will be fine.

She wants to try both....so I'll leave it up to her as to which she wants to try first.  Is it bad that I kind of want to see her do the head over heals thing? J/k

 

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On 4/9/2018 at 1:54 PM, Chaos said:

I didn't read all the comments but there looks like some good advise. Your experience with the RR is fairly common.

On the other boards 3 fins is most stable, increasing the size of the center fin will increase drag a slow a board down for beginners.

I would start your wife on the broadcast, then she will likely progress quickly to a smaller board. She will struggle learning on the pixie, it will be way to responsive and twitchy. Once she has basic riding down and is able to carve then she will like the pixie a lot more.

Skim boards are designed to dig down, sinking a rail into the wake. The model x and trident are more skim than hybrid, certainly no where near surf.

I tend to think you would benefit from a better surf style board. I tend to reccomend our Ringer XL for people your size.

http://chaossurfco.com/wakesurfboards/chaos-ringer-xl

 

Nick

 

Thanks for the advice, Nick.  I will definitely start her on the broadcast first.  I may have to make the chaos a future purchase as I do like to ride surf style to change it up now and then.  Unfortunately I soon realize how boring the RR is and quickly ask for 1 of the Phase 5s.   The CEO has put a stop on board purchases for the year, but maybe next year?.....fingers crossed.

Update:  Today was our second day out on the lake.  Air temp was 82, Water temp a cool 61.  Tolerable with a spring suit, but my wife wasn't interested in getting wet until it gets warmer.

I got a chance to experiment with both the model X and Trident.  I rode both with 2 fins and then both with singles.  Both handled similarly with 2 fins but I actually preferred the X over the Trident?  The Trident was fast and stable where the X wasn't quite as fast but was more responsive and playful.  I then set up the X with a single, It was a little slow and I struggled to stay in the pocket. I liked how it handled but I couldn't be very aggressive without losing the wave.  I soon asked the wife to throw me the Trident with a single, and I immediately fell in love.  Not sure why such a difference, but it was an incredible ride!  Fast, playful, responsive.  I could ride aggressively and stay on the wave. I was even able to attempt a 360 with confidence.  I was so confident that the 360 actually turned into a 450 from over rotating...lol.  At that point I was spent and the sun was setting.  Hope to get it next time! Can't wait!

Thanks to all for the advice and shared knowledge!  Great people here!

Edited by bovhica
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