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'95 Malibu Echelon engine stall


jackyhazza

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Hi,

I know theres been plenty posted on the forum to date in regards to engine stalling issues etc. however if I could run this pass everyone just in case someone reads it and thinks "yep thats exactly what mine did" it may save me from more migraines lol.

'95 Echelon Magnum 350 centre point injection, starts great runs like a kitten then intermittently loses power, struggles to run then stops, sometimes it starts again straight away other times it doesn't.

Investigations thus far:

New electric fuel pump, New coil, new ignition switch, wrapped fuel lines in heat shield material, extra big blower , plus various other tid bits including checking fuel lines and filters removing the valve in the tank etc.

Most recently replaced the MAP sensor as it was showing up as a fault on the computer, new one on and fault cleared, thought we had solved the problem and into the second day (today) same problem, engine stalls splutters and dies.

Ive read plenty about Vapour lock issues etc. and yes it may still be as we haven't actually been able to test the fuel line pressures etc when it stalls, but Im feeling like its going to be a computer and or earthing issue. I have noticed that on occasion the dash readouts have intermittently flipped between readouts as if theres a short or loose connection somewhere, and i realise that grounding issues with watercraft are often the culprit, but then again we have noticed the fuel lines, pump, etc are really hot to touch , is this normal?

In someone with more experience than me (which is next to none) what do you think would be the most obvious, or most likely cause of this problem? I know its a vague and wide question but as I said earlier someone may just read this and think damn thats my boat, and have a solution for me.... I forgot to mention its been at a reputable race boat shop here in Victoria (Australia) twice now with no luck thus far, he's actually trying to convince us to scrap the injection and go with an old school carbie, I personally think thats not going to be the answer.

 

Anyway If someone finds me the solution theres a slab of Coopers Pale Ale awaiting for them in sunny Geelong Victoria Australia, or "Straya" if you talk Aussie Bogan!

 

cheers

 

Dan

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@jackyhazza:  Sounds like an electrical connection problem, you probably want to go through and check all the grounds (earths in 'proper' English).  How old is the battery, could it have an intermittent dead cell?  A test might be to direct wire the fuel pump to see if that fixes it, then troubleshoot the electrics from there.  I would also check the anti siphon valve on top of the tank given the boat is a bit older.  Is the problem temperature related, that points to vapor lock as you noted.

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yeah siphon valve has been checked and is fine, Im leaning towards the electrical side of things but have no real idea where to start, any idea where i need to look for grounds?

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Look for connections on the engine block, intake manifold, fuel pump connection on the sender then move to the behind dash pod and switch area, ignition switch may have some loose connections.  Check battery connections for good contact, you might want to follow the earth battery lead to where it connects to the engine and kind of start there.

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Have you checked your canon plug?  And does it have a hose clamp on it keeping it together tightly?  It's the round plug in directly above the back end of the starter, has like 9 prongs (or something like that).

2016_engine_pic_6.jpg

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  • 1 month later...

Mine did this. Was the pickup guaze filter desintegrated and got caught up in pickup hose (which had been changed after filter broke before i got it) mine is a 94 but same system from what i know. 

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Spoke to A Mercruiser dealer the other day and he mentioned it sounds like the IAC, haven't had a chance to check it thus far, but has anyone heard of this causing stalling at speed etc.? I will take it off and inspect/clean anyway, from what I've read so far it sounds plausible if the valve/plunger/heat plate (not sure of this system type) is sticking either open or shut it could surely cause random problems.. Anyway another avenue to explore  boats on the water at the moment so plenty of time to play.

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I know lots of folks have changed them in attempts to stop stalling issues. Not sure if it was the real culprit though. Mine stalls frequently when cold, going into gear from idle. A lot of them do for whatever reasons. I'll probably do the IAC, and also the coil. Just on a hunch.

Steve B.

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I have had zero vapor lock issues since buying and running exclusively 93 non ethanol.  I costs me about $.75 more a gallon but the motor runs like a dream.  If your tank isn't currently full and non ethanol is easily accessible it's just one more thing to try.

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Jacky, another idea to think on, next time problem happens, locate the purple ignition wire at the coil and check power there, should be 12 volts. If you got no volts, but have 12v at the ignition switch, check the safety lanyard switch for continuity. This switch connects the ignition key hot wire to the purple coil wire. Had mine go out last summer, but it went 100% dead open, so was easy to track it down.

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With it being an older boat, have you checked the vent line to the fuel tank to make sure it is not plugged?  I replaced all of my hoses with ethanol compatible ones a few years ago.

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I've written this before about the engine in my '93 Echelon: the distributor shaft has bushings, not bearings and the bushings wear out. When the boat is sitting still the engine would run fine, but any rocking would cause the distributor shaft to go out of balance, then the engine would run rough, stall, and refuse to start. It cost me less than $20 (I think $3) for a local shop to press a new bushing on the distributor shaft. My engine had 1000+ hours on it when this happened...

If you don't mind re-timing the engine, pull the distributor cap and try to wiggle the shaft; if it moves you might have worn bushings. There are a number of good writeups (and videos) on the 'net that cover how to remove and replace the distributor shaft. The shaft itself should still be OK, but the bushings are bronze and are designed to wear out over time.

I figured this out with my boat when it was sitting in a calm marina with the engine at idle, I stepped from one side of the boat to the other causing it to rock significantly, the engine started to run rough but recovered when the boat stopped rocking. I then started to rock the boat by moving from side to side and caused the engine to die. I thought it was a problem with the carburetor (and it did get rebuilt professionally) but the problem was ultimately the distributor shaft.

Good Luck!

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yeah cheers Mikeo, the shaft is fine had it checked... I think we may have had a breakthrough , well at least the longest run of skis etc without an issue... We replaced the entire fuel line system, had the original 1994 thick black hose.. New water/fuel filter, drain and cleaned tank and checked all filters.

What we discovered is that our fuel continually had tiny black pieces of fibres in it about a hair thickness and maybe a 1mm long, almost certain its the degradation of the lines , we found it in the VST bowl, after a clean as well. Took the injectors off and they were clean (filter clean).  When it ran rough the injector spray was poor, and  (and i think this was the breakthrough moment) if you sprayed "start ya bastrad" down the throttle bottle it ran with the crappy injector spray then when you stopped it stopped running.  Conclusion? fuel pressure dropping be;ow 30 PSI due most likely to the contaminants (large ones sticking to the filters in line and reducing pressure.  We replaced all lines with Fuel Injector hose as advised by a good mechanic, ethanol safe.

 

Does anyone have any good products to add into the fuel to reduce ethanol toxicity? its ridiculous here in Australia apparently..

 

PS If this also all fails, we are scrapping all electronics, losing the primitive CPI and join ol school with a four barrel Holley, new easy wiring loom, and customise our own gauges, maybe with a Knight Rider flare!!!  "good morning Dan I notice that your cooler box is low on beer i suggest you refill before continuing your barefoot today, have a nice day"

 

LOL

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18 hours ago, jackyhazza said:

yeah cheers Mikeo, the shaft is fine had it checked... I think we may have had a breakthrough , well at least the longest run of skis etc without an issue... We replaced the entire fuel line system, had the original 1994 thick black hose.. New water/fuel filter, drain and cleaned tank and checked all filters.

What we discovered is that our fuel continually had tiny black pieces of fibres in it about a hair thickness and maybe a 1mm long, almost certain its the degradation of the lines , we found it in the VST bowl, after a clean as well. Took the injectors off and they were clean (filter clean).  When it ran rough the injector spray was poor, and  (and i think this was the breakthrough moment) if you sprayed "start ya bastrad" down the throttle bottle it ran with the crappy injector spray then when you stopped it stopped running.  Conclusion? fuel pressure dropping be;ow 30 PSI due most likely to the contaminants (large ones sticking to the filters in line and reducing pressure.  We replaced all lines with Fuel Injector hose as advised by a good mechanic, ethanol safe.

 

Does anyone have any good products to add into the fuel to reduce ethanol toxicity? its ridiculous here in Australia apparently..

 

PS If this also all fails, we are scrapping all electronics, losing the primitive CPI and join ol school with a four barrel Holley, new easy wiring loom, and customise our own gauges, maybe with a Knight Rider flare!!!  "good morning Dan I notice that your cooler box is low on beer i suggest you refill before continuing your barefoot today, have a nice day"

 

LOL

If you can't find non ethanol, check out the stabil marine blue stuff.  

 

Glad you had a breakthrough and jealous that you guys are skiing!

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