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tgmind

Best prop for tiny lake.

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tgmind

Thanks for any advice given.

My old lake didn't allow surfing. I just moved to a new lake that does but its only 2000ft long (slalom ski lake). Looking forward to trying surfing even though the run will be short. Also plan to wakeboard a lot but still want to be able to run the slalom course.

Since I don't have to worry about cruising or getting to the riding spot I was wondering if I should go super aggressive with the prop? Wakemakers suggest 1235 or 2079.

My boat is 04 21' VLX Monsoon 340

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NCVride

Just some insight on one of the props you mentioned.  I run a 1235 my '06 VRide.  LCR 320.  It's plenty of prop for surfing but turns some high RPMS at slalom speed.  It will also allow the boat to rip your arms off if you try getting up on a ski hammering the throttle.  Matter of fact it took me several several tries to get up on a slalom after re-propping during th off season   I couldn't for the life of me figure out why I couldn't get up then remembered the new prop and decided to ease way off the throttle 

How much weight are you going to be running?  I run about 2500lbs of ballast plus 4-6 adults and the 1235 has no problem with that amount.  

The 1235 is a great prop.  

Also just a curiosity, how deep is the lake? Water depths less than 8-12' can have a serious effect on your surf wake. 

Edited by NCVride

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carguy79ta

generally speaking a good surf prop will be a bad ski prop.  and vise versa.  My Axis prop tops out at 38mph.  obviously I surf.  gross weight of 8000 lbs is handled easily.  I wouldn't pull skiers tho since it will turn more rpms than I feel comfortable with.

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Sailvi767

Most slalom lakes are shallow. Less then 10 feet of water it can hurt the wave. How deep is the lake?

 

 

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racer808

Less than 10' of water will make the wave unsurfable.  Every time my wife drags me through a shallow area the wave immediately washes out & loses all push.   

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tgmind

Thanks for the replies. Yeah I am worried about the depth. The inlet end is shallow< 6ft and I don't know how quickly it gets deep yet. The dam end is 30ft or so.

OK hearing the replies that one prop cannot be good for skiing and surfing with lots of weight I think I will hold off a bit and see how our activities develop on this new lake before making a change.

 

NCVride, good to know 1235 is plenty for our boats if we do need more torque. Thanks!

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AJwakedevil
1 minute ago, tgmind said:

Thanks for the replies. Yeah I am worried about the depth. The inlet end is shallow< 6ft and I don't know how quickly it gets deep yet. The dam end is 30ft or so.

OK hearing the replies that one prop cannot be good for skiing and surfing with lots of weight I think I will hold off a bit and see how our activities develop on this new lake before making a change.

 

NCVride, good to know 1235 is plenty for our boats if we do need more torque. Thanks!

So I know I am posting this with out enough information... but I have your same boat. It has the stock prop on it. Refurbished... but same pitch. I can surf with ~4000 lbs ballast and wakeboard with 3500lbs. Takes a few seconds to get there, but I am able to. A new prop would be nice for fuel consumption, but I havent had the need to do that yet and dont mind hitting 44 on a cold day heading back to the dock.

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SkiPablo

i vote the 1235.

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NCVride
11 hours ago, tgmind said:

Thanks for the replies. Yeah I am worried about the depth. The inlet end is shallow< 6ft and I don't know how quickly it gets deep yet. The dam end is 30ft or so.

OK hearing the replies that one prop cannot be good for skiing and surfing with lots of weight I think I will hold off a bit and see how our activities develop on this new lake before making a change.

 

NCVride, good to know 1235 is plenty for our boats if we do need more torque. Thanks!

It will work for skiing but I think you probably ski WAAAAY more than you board or surf.  Stick with what it have and try things out.  Depth should be your concern right now.   

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ajgear

Another option is the ACME 1273.  Same diameter and pitch as the 1235, but with a bit more cup.  I called ACME, and the very helpful guy I spoke to explained that the extra cup doesn't make a much difference under heavy load, but once the boat gets up to speed, the cup acts like more pitch.  He said the cup difference (.105 on the 1235 and .150 on the 1273) translates into about 1" of pitch on the top end.  So he likened it to having a 1235 out of the hole (or under heavy ballast), and a 1941 at the top end.  I should have my 1273 late next week.  I'm coming off of an ACME 537, so I won't be able to compare to the 1235.  But if anyone's interested in my impressions of the 1273, I'd be glad to report back.  Interestingly, my buddy has the same(ish) boat as I do, so we will have a relatively direct comparison between the 537 and the 1273.

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oldjeep
On ‎5‎/‎4‎/‎2017 at 6:12 AM, tgmind said:

Thanks for any advice given.

My old lake didn't allow surfing. I just moved to a new lake that does but its only 2000ft long (slalom ski lake). Looking forward to trying surfing even though the run will be short. Also plan to wakeboard a lot but still want to be able to run the slalom course.

Since I don't have to worry about cruising or getting to the riding spot I was wondering if I should go super aggressive with the prop? Wakemakers suggest 1235 or 2079.

My boat is 04 21' VLX Monsoon 340

Are you certain that your neighbors on a private ski lake are not going to burn your boat to the ground if you surf?  Those lake shorelines are typically not built for surf rollers.

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carguy79ta

heard that..coupled with loud music and generally having a good time...can you say...GET OFF MY LAKE!!!

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UWSkier

537. You'll give up on surfing quickly on a slalom lake. 537 will give you a enough torque to surf and won't spin like crazy revs slalom skiing. 

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tgmind
22 hours ago, ajgear said:

Another option is the ACME 1273.  Same diameter and pitch as the 1235, but with a bit more cup.  I called ACME, and the very helpful guy I spoke to explained that the extra cup doesn't make a much difference under heavy load, but once the boat gets up to speed, the cup acts like more pitch.  He said the cup difference (.105 on the 1235 and .150 on the 1273) translates into about 1" of pitch on the top end.  So he likened it to having a 1235 out of the hole (or under heavy ballast), and a 1941 at the top end.  I should have my 1273 late next week.  I'm coming off of an ACME 537, so I won't be able to compare to the 1235.  But if anyone's interested in my impressions of the 1273, I'd be glad to report back.  Interestingly, my buddy has the same(ish) boat as I do, so we will have a relatively direct comparison between the 537 and the 1273.

I ended up getting the 1235 because my stock prop was dinged up and I wanted to keep a spare in hand. I'm loving it but I think mostly how smooth it is compared to my beat up prop.  That 1273 seems like just the right ticket for me. Let me know how you like it.

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AJwakedevil
23 hours ago, ajgear said:

Another option is the ACME 1273.  Same diameter and pitch as the 1235, but with a bit more cup.  I called ACME, and the very helpful guy I spoke to explained that the extra cup doesn't make a much difference under heavy load, but once the boat gets up to speed, the cup acts like more pitch.  He said the cup difference (.105 on the 1235 and .150 on the 1273) translates into about 1" of pitch on the top end.  So he likened it to having a 1235 out of the hole (or under heavy ballast), and a 1941 at the top end.  I should have my 1273 late next week.  I'm coming off of an ACME 537, so I won't be able to compare to the 1235.  But if anyone's interested in my impressions of the 1273, I'd be glad to report back.  Interestingly, my buddy has the same(ish) boat as I do, so we will have a relatively direct comparison between the 537 and the 1273.

Report back. Any spin? Sounds too goo to be true, adding more cup just increases top end and does nothing to heavy load whole shot. But then again I know very very little bout props. 

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ajgear

I won't have the 1273 until Monday.  I plan to get it on the boat ASAP.  Should have a report by later next week.  I know what you mean though @AJwakedevil.  It sounded that way to me too.  Proof's in the pudding though.  We'll see if it truly is the magic bullet, or if it's all theory and conjecture.  The way he explained it is that pitch and diameter are not variable.  In other words, their effects are felt consistently throughout the RPM range.  Cup, on the other hand, has more effect as RPMs increase.  So, at lower RPM coming out of the hole or holding lower speed, it will act like a prop with the same pitch and diameter but less cup, and at higher RPM when cruising or pulling a skier/barefooter, it will act like a prop with greater pitch.  So it's like having the 1235 at the low end, and closer to the 1941 on the top end.  I took it with a grain of salt, but honestly, the guy had no dog in the fight.  I was going to buy an ACME prop either way.  If I was telling him that I was comparing the ACME 1235 to an OJ 915, I would be more skeptical.  But I made it clear that I was sticking with ACME to avoid the sales pitch.  Again though, proof's in the pudding.  I'll report back when I get a couple hours on the 1273.  Of course, I may just tell you all that it's the greatest thing since sliced bread, and then offer to sell it to you :biggrin:.

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ajgear

@AJwakedevil & @tgmind, I finally got the 1273 on my boat this weekend.  Prior to putting it on, I took the boat out for a flat-out speed run, and got 43-44 mph with the 537.  I put the 1273 on and went back out to the same stretch and got 43/44 mph.  It was almost exactly the same, with the exception that the 1273 bounced around in the lower end, and the 537 was bouncing in the higher end.  But anywhere in a 1 mph variation could clearly be considered well within the margin of error.  Hole shots and under-load performance was not even a fair comparison, the 1273 was much "cleaner".  There was no feeling of cavitation or slip, and with 2500 lbs of ballast and 3 passengers, it popped up to surf speed and held beautifully and much smoother than the 537.  In fact, the 537 struggled to hold 11 mph with that ballast.  My buddy that lives a few doors down has the same boat (3 years older, but with the same motor and very similar ballast) with the 1235, and it feels very similar under ballast and at surf speed, but he only gets 40/41 mph.  I didn't test RPM at various loads and such, so I can't speak to the differences throughout the speed range and under various loads, but in general, it seemed to be slightly higher RPM.  But it was quite noticeably smoother and it never felt like it was bogging at all, so that might just be perception.  I didn't see a marked difference in fuel economy, but that too was largely unscientific.  1/2 day of surfing = 1/2 tank of gas before, and it seemed about the same this weekend.  Incidentally, the surf wake was better as well.  I don't think it was that much better at any one point, but it was much more consistent and rideable.  I would assume that's largely a function of holding the speed in a much closer range and not struggling as much.  I suppose there could be some gain based on less cavitation/bogging as well.  That's beyond my knowledge of hydrodynamics though.  All in all, I'm EXTREMELY happy with the 1273 and the advice I got from ACME. :thumbup:

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AJwakedevil
46 minutes ago, ajgear said:

I'm EXTREMELY happy with the 1273 and the advice I got from ACME. :thumbup:

Rad

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asnowman

I just ordered a 1273 today. It's going on our vtx, which we have run with a 1941 since we got it. We don't ski behind it anymore, but still wanted the higher top end for getting around. I plan to have my 1941 as a spare. Hopefully can get the boats in the lake by july.

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ajgear

@asnowman, I was wondering if you'd gotten the 1273 on, and if you got results similar to mine.  Just curious.

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asnowman

@ajgear yes we got it and have been running it this month, I definitely notice we spin a little higher rpm when cruising, and top out at 43 mph, but it certainly holds speed better than ever for wakeboarding and surfing. Doesn't seem to feel too different with or without ballast and wedge in terms of hole shot either. Seems to me the 1273 is a much better choice than the 1941. I have not tried skiing behind it since the prop change though, so can't speak to that aspect.

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ajgear
12 hours ago, asnowman said:

@ajgear yes we got it and have been running it this month, I definitely notice we spin a little higher rpm when cruising, and top out at 43 mph, but it certainly holds speed better than ever for wakeboarding and surfing. Doesn't seem to feel too different with or without ballast and wedge in terms of hole shot either. Seems to me the 1273 is a much better choice than the 1941. I have not tried skiing behind it since the prop change though, so can't speak to that aspect.

Good to hear.  Glad it worked out for you.  I think you'll find skiing to be slightly better, but not markedly.  That was my experience.  Not having gone back-to-back with the old prop, it's hard to say how much of that was psychosomatic.  It makes sense that a more efficient prop will produce a better wake with less 'bubble', but to what degree, I can't say. 

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asnowman

@ajgear I don't anticipate finding out about the ski wake, we also have a response lxi that we bought just to ski behind, so the vtx had become a general use/wake/surf boat. 

What I find interesting is last year when I talked to acme they told me to stick with the 1941, which I am glad I didn't do.

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ajgear

@asnowman, That is interesting.  The guy I spoke to specifically mentioned the 1941 and the 1235, and then said the 1273 would act like the 1941 on the top end, but would act more like the 1235 out of the hole and under heavier loads.  He explained that the added cup of the 1273 would act like an extra inch of pitch at the top end, but would be inconsequential on the low end.  It is surprising that with the same boat, we got two different answers.  I did tell him that we added about 1,700 lbs of ballast on top of the factory system, so perhaps he was working that into the equation differently.  In any case, I'm glad it's working for you.  And well done on having the response for ski time.  I have a buddy on the lake that has a 2000 Response that we use for the early morning runs when we're serious about it.  Then he surfs on my boat once the water gets busy or the wind picks up.  I only ski mine when he can't go.  The VTX is a great crossover, but sure 'tis no Response when it comes to ski wake.

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asnowman
5 hours ago, ajgear said:

  And well done on having the response for ski time.  I have a buddy on the lake that has a 2000 Response that we use for the early morning runs when we're serious about it.  Then he surfs on my boat once the water gets busy or the wind picks up.  I only ski mine when he can't go.  The VTX is a great crossover, but sure 'tis no Response when it comes to ski wake.

The cfo insisted a slalom tractor arrive at the dock after taking a set behind a friend's tantrum.  I did as instructed. There are a couple threads about that experience on here.

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