M235 first day EPIC FAIL

[Koeh0083]

5 hours ago, minnmarker said:

I had no idea it was there!  Thanks.  I'll stop in next time I drive up through Hudson.

Out family has bought 2 ski nautiques from them over the last 15-20 years when they had correct craft. Our 206 is being serviced right now by them. Kevin is a great guy and I would have like to buy a boat from him but since this one will stay near home I needed to establish a relationship with a local dealer.

[Fman]

5 hours ago, IXFE said:

This thread is making me nervous to take delivery of my '17 25 LSV (from a new dealer). I hope it's as good as my previous Malibus have been. 

Get ready for zip ties all over!   And watch your knee on that loose hatch!

[spikew919]

5 hours ago, IXFE said:

This thread is making me nervous to take delivery of my '17 25 LSV (from a new dealer). I hope it's as good as my previous Malibus have been. 

Just take @Fman with you, nothing but pure perfection seems to come off the line at malibu for him. I need to take him to the casino, bound to be the luckiest guy ever to have gotten every single boat back to back with not even a screw stripped or loose hinge or anything. ???? So jealous 

Edited April 11, 2017 by spikew919

[shawn]

9 hours ago, Fman said:

I agree but let's get the FACTS of what actually happened before posting anything.  And let's be honest, we don't know people behind the keyboard, how they use there boat, maintain it, who they actually are, etc...so a lot of these threads I take with a grain of salt.  There are trolls all over forums.

His experience is NOTHING compared to what I have experienced with Malibu after FOUR boats now and over 750 hours in them.

Come over and crawl through my lsv, you won't find loose hinges, misaligned windows, screens that don't work, hatches that don't stay closed, etc etc...

 

 

His experience is Just like mine with the 20+ Malibu boats and more hours than I care to think about.  But the dealer is the reason we keep going back. I can handle the little things but the big ones will piss you off.  Glad your 4 have been great:)  I guess that is why the people that buy my boats are happy all this stuff is fixed before they get it.  I hope that there is nothing bad wrong but I'm sure the DEALER will take care of it

[shawn]

6 hours ago, 85 Barefoot said:

All of which may be correct as to the heater plumb on a 2017, which is why I specifically hedged on that, but I do agree with you.  However, checking heater connections is hardly taking "half" the boat apart when prep already includes de-winterization.  I think it is absolutely dealer's responsibility to check every essential clamp (anything related to cooling system) before even starting, let alone delivering to a customer.  There's a lot that can happen on a 3000 mile drive or trip across the ocean.

OMG I guess the dealer should just build the boat:)

[shawn]

1 hour ago, TenTwentyOne said:

Can't say as I agree with this......... these are Malibu boats, and Malibu chooses the engine marinizer they want to use. They do have choices, and the total quality of ALL components, of the completed package, should definitely fall on them. They aren't selling these boats without an engine, like an outboard boat. They also don't give the customer a choice on different marinizing companies. They only give the one choice, and they sell you the boat as a complete unit. Any issue with the completed unit should definitely fall on them, because they are the ones who choose all the components to sell the completed boat. (We all know indmar is a good choice. Not debating that)

I have always hated the fact that the engine was warranted separately in these boats..... as well as other components, like stereo equipment (for instance). It's good to see that some companies have started to cover the entire boat, factory direct, on ALL components. No more taking the boat to a dealer and getting  "I'm sorry, we will have to talk to indmar, that is a different warranty", or "I'm sorry, that amp is not covered under the factory warranty because it's made by RF, and their warranty is only one year.". 

What will they say when they are the ones building the engine:)

[Bmckevs]

These scenarios sound exactly like the RV world. I am sure many of you own RVs I have bought 2 since 2014 and both spent some significant time in the shop for different issues. For a 80k+ 5th wheel this was very difficult for me to except at first, but I finally lowered my standards.

I come from the automotive industry 12+ years as a technician for a Fod dealer. I saw a lot of change in delivery quality from 2000 to 2012. The Predelivery inspection is absolutely critical.

Many of the issues these boats seem to have, according to this site is because of initial QC. However due to this fact it seems like a good dealer PDI could take care of many of the issues we as customers are seeing.

Ford had a specific PDI checklist that would get completed that meticulously checked over the vehicle.

Obviously the op issue is a different story.

It is ashame that a 100K does not buy you a good QCed boat that had a solid PDI from the dealer to take care of the small items.

After reading this thread I see I am really going to have to go over my new boat with a fine tooth comb duing delivery just like I did my RV.

[DarkSide]

23 minutes ago, shawn said:

His experience is Just like mine with the 20+ Malibu boats and more hours than I care to think about.  But the dealer is the reason we keep going back. I can handle the little things but the big ones will piss you off.  Glad your 4 have been great:)  I guess that is why the people that buy my boats are happy all this stuff is fixed before they get it.  I hope that there is nothing bad wrong but I'm sure the DEALER will take care of it

I had an outstanding dealer, the service department was absolutely top notch.   There comes a time though when,  you just get tired of stuff breaking.   When your on the way to the lake, joking with your buddies about what's going to break this trip,  there is a problem. 

[bamaboy]

1 hour ago, Fman said:

Get ready for zip ties all over!   And watch your knee on that loose hatch!

Maybe he will get lucky like I did.  I SOOOOOOOO needed a 9/16 deep well socket that I dropped in the lake working on my lift.  Head to the hardware?  Heavens no!!!

 

All I needed to do was buy another Malibu.  Not only did I get that coveted 9/16 when I removed the kick panel, I found a 5/8 and a half inch to go along with it!  That was a lucky day for me.

[potterm]

Great news from my dealer today.  The prop that I thought looked "perfect" was actually damaged.   They installed my backup prop (which they drove back to my slip to get) and vibration is gone.  Just need to adjust the rudder which was off from the factory. impressed by all the people on this thread that totally called the debris strike.  Code is hopefully not a big deal.  They think it was a knock sensor code.  Strange since I just filled up with 93 octane/ethanol free gas.  I'll keep my fingers crossed (intermittent codes that could not be resolved was the biggest headache of my LSV).  

 

I have renewed hope for my M235.  I just want a reliable boat with an awesome surf wave.   I and everyone in the boat still did not see the mystery debris in a very clear lake but glad that it has to be it.  Never damaged a prop before with 400+ hours on my A22 and 23 LSV on the same lake.   Now I know to just change the prop before assuming the worst. 

 

I still hope Malibu gets the message that their quality control and workmanship needs to improve.  As someone who has purchased 3 Malibu/Axis boats in 3 years, I would hope they would care about my opinion. They make awesome boats but frequent breakdowns and poor workmanship ruin that quickly.  

 

 

[RTS]

Great to hear....

[Bmckevs]

That is fantastic, great to hear!

 

 

[minnmarker]

8 minutes ago, potterm said:

Great news from my dealer today.  The prop that I thought looked "perfect" was actually damaged.   They installed my backup prop (which they drove back to my slip to get) and vibration is gone. 

 

Glad you've got your new boat back and kudos to your dealer.  In the end they were not responsible and yet they put in the extra effort for you.

Now are you going to change the title of the thread?

[kerpluxal]

16 minutes ago, potterm said:

Great news from my dealer today.  The prop that I thought looked "perfect" was actually damaged.   They installed my backup prop (which they drove back to my slip to get) and vibration is gone.  Just need to adjust the rudder which was off from the factory. impressed by all the people on this thread that totally called the debris strike.  Code is hopefully not a big deal.  They think it was a knock sensor code.  Strange since I just filled up with 93 octane/ethanol free gas.  I'll keep my fingers crossed (intermittent codes that could not be resolved was the biggest headache of my LSV).  

 

I have renewed hope for my M235.  I just want a reliable boat with an awesome surf wave.   I and everyone in the boat still did not see the mystery debris in a very clear lake but glad that it has to be it.  Never damaged a prop before with 400+ hours on my A22 and 23 LSV on the same lake.   Now I know to just change the prop before assuming the worst. 

 

I still hope Malibu gets the message that their quality control and workmanship needs to improve.  As someone who has purchased 3 Malibu/Axis boats in 3 years, I would hope they would care about my opinion. They make awesome boats but frequent breakdowns and poor workmanship ruin that quickly.  

 

 

I am glad to hear this... I know how you felt, been there on an engine replacement. Had a stupid ground gremlin that kept putting the boat in limp mode when boat was under load. Thought the issue was resolved and 2 days later it would not run. Assumed the worse and called dealer while I was stranded on water and was not happy. Had a new driver (I was behind boat) that performed the unforsaken powerturn while boat was slammed and ended up being water in the gas tank. Had to give the dealer an apology call. 

On your codes being thrown.. I would not rule out a ground issue.... I did a lot of research and ended up changing my grounds on the block (separating them out and applying dielectric grease on them) and my issue was resolved. You might want them to check the grounds (make sure they are tight, clean, and put dielectric grease on them). 

Anything made from fiberglass or composites (planes, cars, boats, etc) are prone to have this issue and are a biatch to find.

Maybe you struck an unfortunate fish  

[ChainSetter]

For what its worth I bought a 2015 new for over $95K with 1 hour on it in 2016.   It had no less than 16 different major problems.  Some worse than others i.e. functioning dash, functioning wedge, etc.  At this point after more hours than I can ever count Malibu has resolved 10 of the issues.  I have given up on the rest.  This will be my 3rd and last Malibu.

 

Not to mention the 2016 Malibu trailer that was sold with my boat already has rust bubbling through under the tail lights.  Why do I know?  2 LED's failed in the first 2 months and I had to replace them my self to get it done.  The trailer was manufactured less than 10 months ago. So keep an eye out for that!

[oldjeep]

Wouldn't be real surprised at a knock sensor code with a bent prop.  

[Bmckevs]

19 minutes ago, oldjeep said:

Wouldn't be real surprised at a knock sensor code with a bent prop.  

Would be my guess as well.

i have a 2014 GT500 and I got a small pebble caught around the exhaust I had hell troubleshooting a knock sensor issue until I found the pebble. A bent prop easily could cause the issue.

Edited April 12, 2017 by Bmckevs

[TenTwentyOne]

16 minutes ago, oldjeep said:

Wouldn't be real surprised at a knock sensor code with a bent prop.  

I see the thought process of the thinking that would be possible....... but no, a knock sensor isn't going to falsely trip because of a driveline vibration. Without going in to excessive detail, that is not how they work....

 

[oldjeep]

22 minutes ago, TenTwentyOne said:

I see the thought process of the thinking that would be possible....... but no, a knock sensor isn't going to falsely trip because of a driveline vibration. Without going in to excessive detail, that is not how they work....

 

a knock sensor picks up vibrations and compares them to the firing of the cylinders. Not sure why you don't think that a bent prop vibrating the crap out of the drive train couldn't fool the pcm. 

[RTS]

1 hour ago, ChainSetter said:

For what its worth I bought a 2015 new for over $95K with 1 hour on it in 2016.   It had no less than 16 different major problems.  Some worse than others i.e. functioning dash, functioning wedge, etc.  At this point after more hours than I can ever count Malibu has resolved 10 of the issues.  I have given up on the rest.  This will be my 3rd and last Malibu.

It is my personal opinion that in a rush to add the 'tech' that everyone seems to want these boats to have over the last 5-7 years or so, the manufacturers are simply not equipped to deal with it given the low production volumes compared to an automobile manufacturer, for example.  How many electrical/software engineers does Malibu (or any other boat manufacturer for that matter) have on the payroll versus GM or BMW or Nissan...per unit manufactured, of course?  Versus marketing people to make promo videos?  It is one thing to be able to develop a 'prototype' to record cool videos and post to their website of a new feature...quite another to roll it out with proper QC over an entire product line.

My personal financial situation has recently taken a major turn for the better....my wife is up my butt to buy another boat.  Know where I'll be looking???  For a early/mid 2000's Malibu/MC/Nautique, because I don't want to deal with all the nonsense involved with newer boats that the manufacturers (not just Malibu, but any of them) have, in my opinion, gotten way, way too far out of their league.

Give me a reliable towboat with 4 gauges plus tach and speedo on the dash, a fuel injected engine with no Cats, and I'm good. 

Edited April 12, 2017 by RTS

[DarkSide]

1 hour ago, oldjeep said:

Wouldn't be real surprised at a knock sensor code with a bent prop.  

Except he stated codes started BEFORE Vibration.

BTW... @potterm glad your back on the water, hopefully they can sort the codes, etc.

Edited April 12, 2017 by DarkSide

[TenTwentyOne]

19 minutes ago, oldjeep said:

a knock sensor picks up vibrations and compares them to the firing of the cylinders. Not sure why you don't think that a bent prop vibrating the crap out of the drive train couldn't fool the pcm. 

Because knock sensors are a very specifically calibrated piezoelectric sensor that only indicate a specific knock signal in the range of about 7khz-8khz. A prop vibration will not come anywhere near that. No matter the rpm of an engine, a detonation occurring will still vibrate the cylinder wall at about 7khz. Doesn't matter if it detonated at 1000rpm or 6000rpm. The actual detonation emits a 7khz vibration. They are specifically designed to only detect that, in order to avoid mis-indicating a knock. There are some things that could trip them, but a driveline vibration is not one of them. The vibration frequency will never hit anywhere near 7khz.

That said, it is possible for the knock sensor to have tripped with this bent prop..... but that would only mean one thing. The knock sensor is faulty.

 

otherwise, think about what potholes, unbalanced tires, and rumble strips, would do in our cars.....

 

 

Edited April 12, 2017 by TenTwentyOne

[Fman]

4 hours ago, spikew919 said:

Just take @Fman with you, nothing but pure perfection seems to come off the line at malibu for him. I need to take him to the casino, bound to be the luckiest guy ever to have gotten every single boat back to back with not even a screw stripped or loose hinge or anything. ???? So jealous 

If you want to see holy grail Malibu feel free to come over and crawl through my lsv.  Secretly, they build mine on a special line supervised by Jack himself.

You failed to realize or read that none of my Malibu boats have been "perfect", nor have I ever said Malibu builds a perfect boat or makes no mistakes.  That being said, yes my Malibus have had very few problems with the hours I have put on them.  If you did not know I owned a 2011,2013,2015 22vlx and now a 2017 lsv.  Each one of these boats had less than 4 warranty claims on each of them all over 200+ hours when I sold them.  To be exact my 2015 22vlx had 2 warranty claims, a tower strut replaced and a back seat cushion that tore on the seam. I did have the touch screen flicker one time but it never did it again.  I can't defend or comment on the Malibu stereo because I do a stereo delete and install my own system.

Maybe I am in the minority here but I sure as heck will not deny these boats have treated me and my family well.  The reason I keep coming back to another Malibu.

[IXFE]

my wandering thoughts on this subject...

fman is not alone.  five malibus to date (number six coming soon).  very few warranty items.  my '16 was by far the best with only trailer wheel hub go bad (grease leaked on the wheel).  only screen issue i ever had was a bad viper box on my '14 (the old screen).  I'm a pretty picky guy (known for being AWS most picky customer) but apparently not as picky as some.  

two guys in this thread are on their 3rd malibus and still bitching about QC, which begs the question... why did you keep buying?  I am not questioning your experience at all, just the wisdom of continuing to throw money at a company that has so obviously let you down.  I know I wouldn't.  I'm ruthless.  I wrote off Weathertech after ONE bad experience.  Ruger was very close to getting frozen out by IXFE but they came through just in time.  Just today I had a really unpleasant experience with Amex (corp card).  They are dead to me now... like forever.  If Malibu hosed me on two consecutive boats there wouldn't be a third.  

just bought a new spec house from one of the largest builders in the country (and not a value brand).  the punch list on this house would choke a horse, and two months in and it's not done.  Love the house, but wish it had the QC of my Malibus.  

the only place i've ever noticed misaligned cushions is the wakeview seat; it seems the bracket it's mounted to repositions that cushion a touch so the bead doesn't line it up perfectly.  Should Malibu make an adjustment?  Sure.  Do I care enough to start a thread?  Nope.  

My first boat had windshield gaps that were not concours quality.  I raised the issue.  dealer "adjusted" it (ie with shims).  still wasn't right.  another attempt, still not "spot on."  I started to realize the cure was worse than the problem and this was "normal" for boats.  This wasn't a Malibu btw (gasp, others have these issues??)

i agree that QC isn't on par with some products we get (cars, cell phones, guns, etc.), but this issue isn't unique to Malibu.  I believe it's the entire industry.  The worst gel defects I ever saw on a new boat came on @bamaboy G23.  Would that stop me from buying a G?  Nope!  They fixed it when the season was over.  No harm, no foul.  Bottom line, this isn't a Malibu thing it's a boat thing.  Do I like it?  Nope.  But I've adapted

I've found a few zip ties in my boats (remember, I install my own stereos so I see plenty behind the scenes).  I don't get the outrage.  Rather than start a thread, you know what I do?  I pick them up and never think about it again.  Much quicker for me that way.  

Is Malibu aware of the issues we write about?  Yes.  I know for a fact they have put processes in place to improve.  One dealer told me recently they have noticed fewer and fewer QC stuff the last two years... 2017 in particular.  

some will say I'm a malibu apologist so disregard my comments.  it's easy to assume that, but if you read closely i'm plenty critical of malibu.  worst stereos ever (pre '17), how they nickle and dime you on options, sub par regular wave, lousy surf band, crappy covers (I actually ordered one this year), coolers without drains, small bow tanks, etc.  I have even openly praised other brands, other waves, etc. on this forum.  nobody owns me.  i call it like i see it.  Malibu looks amazing, is best all around performer for my family, and they hold their value very well.  

it really comes down to this... some people are idealists and others are pragmatists.  The idealists stand on their pedestals and whine, "it shouldn't be this way."  The pragmatist says, "Yeah, but it is and nothing I say is gonna change that."   Honestly, if you're that unhappy with your boat, dump it and move on... to another boat... to another hobby!  I would!  Life is too short.  As for me, I love boating too much to be pissed at my boat all the time.  It's really simple... if you have issues, get them fixed and learn to enjoy the process (I actually like visiting my dealer).  

[IXFE]

and just for fun... and because this thread is severely lacking in pics... 

you ain't living until you find a caulk gun in your bilge! 

(kidding, of course)

Edited April 12, 2017 by IXFE