2008 VLX Stereo Build

[minnmarker]

On 3/29/2017 at 8:40 AM, Twitch02x said:

Heres a couple of the battery bank along pass side under seats

 

 

What are the smaller gauge red wires for and where do they go?

[Twitch02x]

15 minutes ago, MLA said:

Im not following because bad 12 volt batteries dont jump to 24V, but 2 12V batteries wired in series, will.

You may very well have a battery quality issue, but that wont cause 24V on your system. They are either wired wrong or the volt meter was used incorrectly. I seriously doubt you have 4 bad brand new batteries, just my opinion.  

I could only get 24 volts again in 1 scenario

 it was with the ground on my common ground post and positive on the stereo bank positive terminal with the switch on 1

[MLA]

4 minutes ago, Twitch02x said:

I could only get 24 volts again in 1 scenario

 it was with the ground on my common ground post and positive on the stereo bank positive terminal with the switch on 1

based on your diagram, the ground post is common to both banks and engine, which it should be. If you touch the B+ off the house bank and read 24V, there is where the problem lies. 

four 12V batteries in parallel, have to = 12V. four 12V in series have to = 48. However, 2 in parallel in series with 2 more in parallel could = 24V. 

[Twitch02x]

1 hour ago, minnmarker said:

What are the smaller gauge red wires for and where do they go?

Minnkota charger

[Twitch02x]

9 hours ago, MLA said:

based on your diagram, the ground post is common to both banks and engine, which it should be. If you touch the B+ off the house bank and read 24V, there is where the problem lies. 

four 12V batteries in parallel, have to = 12V. four 12V in series have to = 48. However, 2 in parallel in series with 2 more in parallel could = 24V. 

I had the ground from stereo bank unhooked from common ground post at the time I got 24volts.

 

Nothing is wired in series I tripled checked everything last night, the problem is within the 4 stereo batteries.

I separated everything and tried each stereo batt 1 by 1 wired by itself straight to the amps and as soon as I give the remote wire power the arcing and stinking starts and amps won't power up properly(blinking indicater light).

 

rewired using only the house bank and wholaaa everything works perfect.

 

something happened to the agm batteries, might have been from me cutting off the extra terminals or from being mounted on their side, I'm not 100% sure. Waiting on Exide to open to see what they say.

[90oldskool]

21 hours ago, Twitch02x said:

Finally got amp rack in place last night and got the main power and ground wires hooked up..... only to run into trouble.

I didnt think i had anything wired wrong but when i put the perko switch on 2 it popped the reset back by the motor, i tried removing the ground wire i have that ties the stereo bank into the main ground loop on the boat(basically ran a wire from negative on the stereo battery bank to the 2 factory grounds that are in the observers compartment, which all three are joined via a nut and bolt thru the fiberglass) and that allowed me to put the switch on position 2 but when i give power to the remote wire engaging the relay that turns on all the amps i get a weird smell and a slight noise coming from the stereo bank that sounds like arcing. and the led on my sd6 amp is not staying on constantly. Its like I have a dead short somewhere but havent been able to find it.

Also something i noticed, the wire i have coming from the ground post to the stereo bank seems to have 24 volts on it instead on 12. Im lost at the moment.

I made a quick sketch of my setup, take a look and if anything doesnt look right let me know.

 

 

The two lines running to perko 2 is what is getting your 24v . If you have a line running to the 1st battery is the parallel batteries, the return wire back to the switch is not needed. 

 

Try removing one of the wires from post 2 , and test the volts

Edited April 12, 2017 by 90oldskool

[Twitch02x]

53 minutes ago, 90oldskool said:

The two lines running to perko 2 is what is getting your 24v . If you have a line running to the 1st battery is the parallel batteries, the return wire back to the switch is not needed. 

 

Try removing one of the wires from post 2 , and test the volts

That doesn't create a series connection

reason I did that was to split the load between both ends of the battery bank

[minnmarker]

If you have 24 volts anywhere in a system of 12 volt batteries then there is a series connection somewhere. That's just simple electronics.

On the small red wires: a multibank charger connected to different batteries that are connected to each other in parallel is no longer multibank. The charger may be getting confused.

No offence intended but you should get on site help before you fry your ECU, amps, instruments - or start a fire.

Edited April 12, 2017 by minnmarker
addition

[Twitch02x]

Just now, minnmarker said:

If you have 24 volts anywhere in a system of 12 volt batteries then there is a series connection somewhere. That's just simple electronics.

On the small red wires: a multibank charger connected to different batteries that are connected to each other in parallel is no longer multibank. The charger may be getting confused.

I believe the 24 volts was a result of the voltmeter itself creating a series connection.

[Fffrank]

That's not how multimeters work.  You don't have a problem with your batteries.  You have a problem with your wiring.  Your 12v batteries don't magically change to 24v just because you connect them to an amp.  That's impossible.  Your house bank and your stereo bank are connecting + to - somewhere.  I promise.

[boardjnky4]

The wire from your starter/alternator needs to go into the Common on the battery switch. Otherwise you are not charging both banks correctly while the boat is running.

The battery to the left of the engine should go + -> Perko 1. Then Perko Common -> Starter (I don't recall that needing to have a C.B. on it)

[Twitch02x]

There is a problem with the batteries

 

I tried hooking each 1 up to just the amps, no perko switch, no common ground, no nothing.... just 1 ground and 1 positive straight to the amps. I did all four batteries the same way 1 by 1, as soon as the remote wire gets power the batteries go to stinking and amps go in protect mode!!!

 

try again same scenario but using only house bank and problem goes away!!!

That tells me all 4 AGM batt are junk

[boardjnky4]

1 minute ago, Twitch02x said:

There is a problem with the batteries

 

I tried hooking each 1 up to just the amps, no perko switch, no common ground, no nothing.... just 1 ground and 1 positive straight to the amps. I did all four batteries the same way 1 by 1, as soon as the remote wire gets power the batteries go to stinking and amps go in protect mode!!!

 

try again same scenario but using only house bank and problem goes away!!!

That tells me all 4 AGM batt are junk

remove all wires from all batteries and check them individually with a voltmeter. Do you get 12v?

[Twitch02x]

Just now, boardjnky4 said:

remove all wires from all batteries and check them individually with a voltmeter. Do you get 12v?

12.8

[Twitch02x]

5 minutes ago, boardjnky4 said:

The wire from your starter/alternator needs to go into the Common on the battery switch. Otherwise you are not charging both banks correctly while the boat is running.

The battery to the left of the engine should go + -> Perko 1. Then Perko Common -> Starter (I don't recall that needing to have a C.B. on it)

I didnt wire it like that for a couple reasons

       1st being I dont plan to use the stock alt to try and charge 6 batteries at once, I have the onboard charger to handle charging the stereo bank.

       2nd being I didnt want the run from cranking battery to be 20ft long (which would require me to run an extra 0gauge wire from starter to perko) when it could be 2ft.

[Twitch02x]

38 minutes ago, minnmarker said:

If you have 24 volts anywhere in a system of 12 volt batteries then there is a series connection somewhere. That's just simple electronics.

On the small red wires: a multibank charger connected to different batteries that are connected to each other in parallel is no longer multibank. The charger may be getting confused.

No offence intended but you should get on site help before you fry your ECU, amps, instruments - or start a fire.

Good point on charger, I gave Minnkota a call and spoke with tech support.

He said as long as both leads from each bank are on the same battery its fine, I still see your point tho because when all 4 are wired together in parallel how would the charger know the diff of where each lead went

[minnmarker]

37 minutes ago, Twitch02x said:

I believe the 24 volts was a result of the voltmeter itself creating a series connection.

There's no shame in getting help. Do it before something expensive happens, if it has not already happened.

[Fffrank]

Is the charger plugged in while you are hooking up the amps and getting 24v?

[Twitch02x]

Just now, Fffrank said:

Is the charger plugged in while you are hooking up the amps and getting 24v?

No it hasnt been plugged in for a few weeks

Plugged it in for couple weeks after i got batt mounted and wired but ive been using that E-cord to do other work on the boat.

[Twitch02x]

4 minutes ago, minnmarker said:

There's no shame in getting help. Do it before something expensive happens, if it has not already happened.

Absolutely no shame here!!!! Thats actually what i thought i was doing was getting help.

Im assuming you mean its time to hire a professional???

[minnmarker]

Just now, Twitch02x said:

Absolutely no shame here!!!! Thats actually what i thought i was doing was getting help.

Im assuming you mean its time to hire a professional???

Or locate a friend or neighbor who has knowledge of low voltage power systems. While you are not dealing with high voltage there is still a lot that can go wrong both safety wise and cost wise. Be patient.

[boardjnky4]

19 minutes ago, Twitch02x said:

I didnt wire it like that for a couple reasons

       1st being I dont plan to use the stock alt to try and charge 6 batteries at once, I have the onboard charger to handle charging the stereo bank.

       2nd being I didnt want the run from cranking battery to be 20ft long (which would require me to run an extra 0gauge wire from starter to perko) when it could be 2ft.

Why bother with the Perko switch at all then? 

Wire the 6-battery bank directly to your stereo, and use it solely for the stereo. Onboard charger handles charging

Then use the 2 standard batteries to feed the starter and the house circuits with the Perko Switch, wired traditionally. Then use the Alternator to charge.

[boardjnky4]

29 minutes ago, Twitch02x said:

12.8

Then your batteries are good and you have an issue with wiring.

[Twitch02x]

Just now, boardjnky4 said:

Then your batteries are good and you have an issue with wiring.

Then what explains why I can take a single battery from the stereo bank and wire it straight to an amp bypassing all other grounds, perko, extra wiring, etc and it starts arcing and stinking.

Then i can do the exact same with a house battery and everything works fine???

 

That is what I dont understand???

[boardjnky4]

2 minutes ago, Twitch02x said:

Then what explains why I can take a single battery from the stereo bank and wire it straight to an amp bypassing all other grounds, perko, extra wiring, etc and it starts arcing and stinking.

Then i can do the exact same with a house battery and everything works fine???

 

That is what I dont understand???

well, i guess i oversimplified my statement. The batteries still could have some other issue.... It seems odd that all 4 of them are going to be bad, but a wiring issue may have damaged them.

As i said in my previous response, I would look to simplify this entire thing and separate the battery bank entirely from the house batteries. ESPECIALLY if you don't plan to use the alternator to charge the bank (which I would also disagree with, I'd invest in a high output alternator).

Re-design it

Get 4 fresh batteries for the stereo bank

Edited April 12, 2017 by boardjnky4