Anyone towing with a Honda Pilot

[Michigan boarder]

On 3/8/2017 at 2:39 PM, CedarLakeSkier said:

SkiPablo,

Not sure if you know this or not, but with 12 posts on file I thought maybe I would let you know.

I operated with a 4 pin on a 5 pin trailer for some time.  The 5th pin unlocks the trailer brake when you shift into reverse on the 5 pin setup.  There are a few things that you can do.

• Option 1: The best would be to order yourself a 5 pin conversion kit for your pilot.  It allows you to keep the current 4 pins and hook up a 5th pin to your reverse light on your car/truck in order to disable the trailer brake when you are in reverse
• Option 2:  You were probably given a small key-like device that you could put in the trailer to keep the brake from engaging when going in reverse.  If not, you could probably pick one up at the dealer for cheap.  Just make sure to remove this device before you get on the road again.
• Option 3:  the 4 pin connector fits into the 5 pin with a missing slot, which is fine for driving.  When you get to the ramp, get out and reverse the 4 pin connector.  Let the connector with the rubber "slot" hang off the opposite end of the 5 pin, connecting to nothing.   Get back in your car and turn on the headlights.  This has the effect of sending the current needed to the correct trailer "pin" in order to disable the trailer brake.   Just make sure the flip it back after you load up the boat before you get on the road.

DUDE!!!  Great idea!

[NMMalibuFamily]

11 hours ago, Skin2Win said:

Or in front of me, or next to me, or passing me in the opposite direction.....

I'm feelin' lots of love!  For the record, the Pilot is rated at 4,500 pounds. Several posts indicate the 2009 LSV weighs 3,900 pounds. Add the trailer for an estimated 600 pounds and thats the max rated weight. I recognize that doesn't include gear around another 500 pounds.  

All I know is I can pull it comfortably around 60-65 mph and I'm comfortable stopping. Do I drive it excessive miles? No. But it certainly works for us for the few miles from storage to the ramp. I enjoy chuckling when I'm next to the Ford dually pulling a 18' Bayliner spinning the wheels with their entire crew jumping on the tongue and I'm not even breaking traction pulling the Bu out of the water right next to them. And, I've certainly been in that situation a couple times and it never gets old. 

Don't worry, when we tow long distances the Chevy pickup takes over. I certainly never represented I'd want to tow coast to coast, but if you're considering and asking about towing with a Pilot at least know you're likely not going to have problems with short distance trips provided you're cautious as one should always be when towing anything. 

[Nitrousbird]

2 minutes ago, NMMalibuFamily said:

I'm feelin' lots of love!  For the record, the Pilot is rated at 4,500 pounds. Several posts indicate the 2009 LSV weighs 3,900 pounds. Add the trailer for an estimated 600 pounds and thats the max rated weight. I recognize that doesn't include gear around another 500 pounds.

You numbers are so far from the truth it isn't even funny.  My trailer...for a much smaller boat, is 1240lbs.  I'd expect yours to be in the 1400lb range.  Malibu way underrates the stock weights - the theory is it is the dry weight with no tower or normal factory accessories.  Go scale your boat.  I bet with zero gear it is near 6000lbs on the scale.  Even if you want to believe the 3900lb BS, you have to know your trailer doesn't weigh anywhere close to 600lbs...don't you have the weight slip for it? 

Pulling out of the water is no big deal.  The big deal is on the road...I wouldn't tow my VLX with your Pilot, let alone your LSV.

[NWBU]

1 hour ago, NMMalibuFamily said:

I'm feelin' lots of love!  For the record, the Pilot is rated at 4,500 pounds. Several posts indicate the 2009 LSV weighs 3,900 pounds. Add the trailer for an estimated 600 pounds and thats the max rated weight. I recognize that doesn't include gear around another 500 pounds.  

All I know is I can pull it comfortably around 60-65 mph and I'm comfortable stopping. Do I drive it excessive miles? No. But it certainly works for us for the few miles from storage to the ramp. I enjoy chuckling when I'm next to the Ford dually pulling a 18' Bayliner spinning the wheels with their entire crew jumping on the tongue and I'm not even breaking traction pulling the Bu out of the water right next to them. And, I've certainly been in that situation a couple times and it never gets old. 

Don't worry, when we tow long distances the Chevy pickup takes over. I certainly never represented I'd want to tow coast to coast, but if you're considering and asking about towing with a Pilot at least know you're likely not going to have problems with short distance trips provided you're cautious as one should always be when towing anything. 

I have the same boat and we rolled the scales at 5,700 lbs. last summer, with the basic gear in it and full fuel. If you get in an accident with that rig, your insurance will not cover you.

Edited March 16, 2017 by NWBU

[blytle473]

28 minutes ago, NMMalibuFamily said:

I'm feelin' lots of love!  For the record, the Pilot is rated at 4,500 pounds. Several posts indicate the 2009 LSV weighs 3,900 pounds. Add the trailer for an estimated 600 pounds and thats the max rated weight. I recognize that doesn't include gear around another 500 pounds.  

All I know is I can pull it comfortably around 60-65 mph and I'm comfortable stopping. Do I drive it excessive miles? No. But it certainly works for us for the few miles from storage to the ramp. I enjoy chuckling when I'm next to the Ford dually pulling a 18' Bayliner spinning the wheels with their entire crew jumping on the tongue and I'm not even breaking traction pulling the Bu out of the water right next to them. And, I've certainly been in that situation a couple times and it never gets old. 

Don't worry, when we tow long distances the Chevy pickup takes over. I certainly never represented I'd want to tow coast to coast, but if you're considering and asking about towing with a Pilot at least know you're likely not going to have problems with short distance trips provided you're cautious as one should always be when towing anything. 

 

I hate to be the towing police but your 600lb estimate on your trailer is just over 2/5th's of what it actually is. Unless you have some special carbon fiber racing inspired trailer that we don't know about. My 2004 trailer for my 23LSV weights in at around 1,400lbs according to the scale..... Based on the way your Pilot is sitting in the back, I'd say your estimates are a little off.

[RyanB]

1 hour ago, NWBU said:

This is a free country, and that's what makes it great so I hesitate even posting this. But since I have the same boat, I'll mention that we rolled the scales at 5,600 lbs. last summer, with the basic gear in it and full fuel. If you get in an accident with that rig, your insurance will not cover you.

Not trying to start the insurance debate either, since there's plenty of threads pointing out that all of us towing with 1/2 tons are usually over legal limits too, but I think the risk of insurance denying 1/2 ton claims is quite a bit less than with a mid-size SUV like the Pilot.

I don't advocate towing with the Pilot either, but the "insurance not covering you in an accident" is blatantly false.  Unless towing over the manufactures rated towing capacity is a written policy exclusion, you have coverage.  Just like if you get into an accident due to speeding or a DUI (both of which are actually breaking a law).  In most places across the country, the manufactures weight rating has no legal standing - it is mainly a tradeoff between the marketing department who wants to show things as best in class, and the financial departments who want to limit warranty claims.

How you would fare in civil litigation might be a different story, but your insurance will still cover you (and defend you) up to the policy limits of liability.

And I know my LSV is a different hull, but I have scaled the boat and trailer.  It was 6060 pounds empty.  I figure my weight is around 6500 pounds full of fuel and ready for the lake.

[NWBU]

Just now, RyanB said:

I don't advocate towing with the Pilot either, but the "insurance not covering you in an accident" is blatantly false.  Unless towing over the manufactures rated towing capacity is a written policy exclusion, you have coverage.  Just like if you get into an accident due to speeding or a DUI (both of which are actually breaking a law).  In most places across the country, the manufactures weight rating has no legal standing - it is mainly a tradeoff between the marketing department who wants to show things as best in class, and the financial departments who want to limit warranty claims.

How you would fare in civil litigation might be a different story, but your insurance will still cover you (and defend you) up to the policy limits of liability.

And I know my LSV is a different hull, but I have scaled the boat and trailer.  It was 6060 pounds empty.  I figure my weight is around 6500 pounds full of fuel and ready for the lake.

I'm not an insurance guy and admittedly don't read the policies I do have in detail. Edited my post above to take out some of the extra commentary since I really don't care what others do, other than pointing out what the boat on trailer weighs.

[Bill_AirJunky]

With a weight distribution hitch? Probably like 2500 lbs without.

[RyanB]

34 minutes ago, Bill_AirJunky said:

With a weight distribution hitch? Probably like 2500 lbs without.

I am pretty sure that Honda recommends against using  WDH.  I know they did on certain models.

1 hour ago, NWBU said:

I'm not an insurance guy and admittedly don't read the policies I do have in detail. Edited my post above to take out some of the extra commentary since I really don't care what others do, other than pointing out what the boat on trailer weighs.

I see you edited your response.  But you still state that insurance won't cover you.  That is not correct information.

34 minutes ago, Bill_AirJunky said:

With a weight distribution hitch? Probably like 2500 lbs without.

 

[G-Mack]

Our 08 23LSV are also 6200lbs with full and gear.

 

Agree with comment about weight distributing hitch........ I tow our boat with a 2015 Audi Q7 TDI (rated to 6800 lbs - before I get flamed)....... I bought a WDH for my 22 ft enclosed trailer to use with the Audi as there is much more tongue weight on the enclosed trailer.  Just happened to read the manual (not my typical move) and you can't use a WDH. Makes sense in hindsight...... transferring load forward (through torque on the body and hitch ) on a unibody vehicle not designed for loading in that direction could be messy.   Wonder if I avoided creasing the body behind the rear doors... my best guess as it is the first weak point with the door openings.

[SkiPablo]

this has turned into a fun thread.  

I found out the trailer weighs 1240 from talking to the make of the trailer and also the owner said it was listed the same on the paperwork.   The boat weighs 2900 for with the monsoon engine according to NADA - I'm guessing mine weighs a little less b/c of the aluminum LS1 engine.     So worse case scenario i'm 4400 with boat, trailer, battery and 35 gals of gas.  Hoping to find it weighs 4200 b/c of the lighter engine but we will see.  

I'm getting the boat sometime in the next week or so, so I will see how it tows.  

[Bill_AirJunky]

1 hour ago, SkiPablo said:

this has turned into a fun thread.  

I found out the trailer weighs 1240 from talking to the make of the trailer and also the owner said it was listed the same on the paperwork.   The boat weighs 2900 for with the monsoon engine according to NADA - I'm guessing mine weighs a little less b/c of the aluminum LS1 engine.     So worse case scenario i'm 4400 with boat, trailer, battery and 35 gals of gas.  Hoping to find it weighs 4200 b/c of the lighter engine but we will see.  

I'm getting the boat sometime in the next week or so, so I will see how it tows.  

I always read it wasn't a great idea to tow at max capacity on any kind of regular basis. With my 1/2 ton, I'm at like 75% & it is still underpowered going over steep hills/passes.

[jjackkrash]

2 hours ago, SkiPablo said:

 

I'm getting the boat sometime in the next week or so, so I will see how it tows.  

This is how I've gotten several new tow vehicles:

"Honey, I just towed the XXX and its not safe.  I thought it would work, my mistake.  I need to go pick up a new tow vehicle immediately to keep you and the boy safe and sound on trips."  

[SkiPablo]

I weighed the boat with: 1240 lb tandem trailer, (2) 45 lb batteries, 1/2 tank of gas.   Truck stop scales said 4140.   So subtracting trailer, 1 battery and gas, my boat actually only weighs 2750 lbs - guessing it's the lighter LS1 engine.

I drove it 1 hour home,  the pilot did better than I thought.    The only issue I had was bouncing around 35-50 mph - seems to get a little better at 55 mph... guessing I have too much tongue weight ?  Can I move something around ?

 

 

[Fman]

47 minutes ago, SkiPablo said:

I weighed the boat with: 1240 lb tandem trailer, (2) 45 lb batteries, 1/2 tank of gas.   Truck stop scales said 4140.   So subtracting trailer, 1 battery and gas, my boat actually only weighs 2750 lbs - guessing it's the lighter LS1 engine.

I drove it 1 hour home,  the pilot did better than I thought.    The only issue I had was bouncing around 35-50 mph - seems to get a little better at 55 mph... guessing I have too much tongue weight ?  Can I move something around ?

 

 

2009 lsv weighs 2750 lbs???? That seems very light!  Malibu specs say 3900 lbs which does not include the trailer.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Fman

[jjackkrash]

4 hours ago, SkiPablo said:

 The only issue I had was bouncing around 35-50 mph - seems to get a little better at 55 mph... guessing I have too much tongue weight ?  Can I move something around ?

The tongue weight should be 10-15% of total weight; the only way to tell is to weigh the tongue weight. 

IIRC, you said its an 06, which means you might need new shocks.  Or some stiffer shocks.  Or maybe add some airbags.

 

Edited March 21, 2017 by jjackkrash

[alpensurf23]

Come on crew , the 1st question is can a Honda Pilot tow uphill??? The second is do you really want to be seen at the boat ramp in that thing???

[Shastasurf]

I will admit to owning a Honda Element in the past.  I had some great names for the thing, lol.   However, that thing was beast.  In a heavy snow storm I pulled out my buddies duramax longbed extracab.  He was stuck, high centered, but the element yanked him out after some full throttle jerks.  I was impressed as he was embarrassed.  The Honda Pilot is an element on steroids.......... Who knows, a pilot might just have to pull your boat up a steep ramp when your big truck cant get the traction.  Good luck just keep it safe while towing.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Shastasurf

[SkiPablo]

6 hours ago, jjackkrash said:

The tongue weight should be 10-15% of total weight; the only way to tell is to weigh the tongue weight. 

IIRC, you said its an 06, which means you might need new shocks.  Or some stiffer shocks.  Or maybe add some airbags.

 

the weigh slip said 420 on front but i'm not that would be accurate because the jack is 3 feet from the tongue - i might take it back and put some blocks under the tongue and re-weigh it - the scales had a spot for every axle so I put the jack on the 1st scale and the wheels on the next one.

I did new shocks in 2012 but there were the comfort style (sensa-tracs??)  - that might be it - i should look at KYB or simalar for the rears.

Nada has my boat listed at 2900 (2003 Sunsetter LXI)  

Edited March 21, 2017 by SkiPablo
typos

[MadMan]

9 hours ago, SkiPablo said:

I weighed the boat with: 1240 lb tandem trailer, (2) 45 lb batteries, 1/2 tank of gas.   Truck stop scales said 4140.   So subtracting trailer, 1 battery and gas, my boat actually only weighs 2750 lbs - guessing it's the lighter LS1 engine.

I drove it 1 hour home,  the pilot did better than I thought.    The only issue I had was bouncing around 35-50 mph - seems to get a little better at 55 mph... guessing I have too much tongue weight ?  Can I move something around ?

 

 

What was bouncing? the boat or tow vehicle?

[boardjnky4]

4 hours ago, Shastasurf said:

I will admit to owning a Honda Element in the past.  I had some great names for the thing, lol.   However, that thing was beast.  In a heavy snow storm I pulled out my buddies duramax longbed extracab.  He was stuck, high centered, but the element yanked him out after some full throttle jerks.  I was impressed as he was embarrassed.  The Honda Pilot is an element on steroids.......... Who knows, a pilot might just have to pull your boat up a steep ramp when your big truck cant get the traction.  Good luck just keep it safe while towing.

Honda probably has the most underrated AWD system out there. Elements are AMAZING in the snow. Our Pilot rocks. I've pulled my A20 out of VERY steep ramps. 3 hour road trips without a single issue.

Edited March 21, 2017 by boardjnky4

[SkiPablo]

1 hour ago, MadMan said:

What was bouncing? the boat or tow vehicle?

i believe the tow vehicle

[RyanB]

2 hours ago, SkiPablo said:

the weigh slip said 420 on front but i'm not that would be accurate because the jack is 3 feet from the tongue - i might take it back and put some blocks under the tongue and re-weigh it - the scales had a spot for every axle so I put the jack on the 1st scale and the wheels on the next one.

I did new shocks in 2012 but there were the comfort style (sensa-tracs??)  - that might be it - i should look at KYB or simalar for the rears.

Nada has my boat listed at 2900 (2003 Sunsetter LXI)  

If you go to a CAT scale, you should weigh twice.  One with the boat, once without.  Both times, make sure you get separate axle weights for the vehicle.  Compare the two, and you will know your tongue weight.

And I would be surprised if it was above 10%.  Travel trailers would be 10% - 20%.  Boats seem to be lower.

[williemon]

Tandem boat tongue can be low like 5%. I have a 06 pilot with 2001 ss vlx and even though it tows fine, i feel it. It is maxed though. I first towed it three hours when i bought the boat with my 02 odyssey van. My tongue weight is too high though so thats a concern for me. I installed a stacked plate hayden cooler on the tranny.  

Edited April 3, 2017 by williemon

[Fman]

This thread should be re-titled "Why the Honda Pilot should not be used as a tow vehicle".  Seriously, that thing is a total liability towing any of these newer wake boats.  You are putting your family, friends and others around you on the road at risk.