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one ton


racer808

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I don't know anyone who runs a gooseneck adaptor.  And, from being around campgrounds, I see very few out there.  Regarding failures, I have seen reports and photos on forums like RV.net.  No idea how widespread they are, but I personally would not do it.

The older trailers seem to be built a little more stout, but the newer trailers all seem to be about saving weight.  My trailer is a 32', built in 2002, and weighs about 12,000 pounds.  Most new 5ers in that range now seem to be around 10,000 pounds.  And I don't think the weight savings is from using newer, materials that weigh less yet offer the same strength.  Everyone wants to save weight so that they can advertise as "light weight" or "1/2 ton towable". 

Even on my trailer, I think the frame is under built from the factory.  When I bought the trailer and added the hitch, the welder reinforced the frame up to the over hang.  Three years ago, when I found out my rear hitch was cracked, I had that fixed, and some other areas beefed up again.

So, my opinion is that the frames and running gears on an RV really aren't well suited to do anything more than what they are designed from the factory to do.

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Just now, RyanB said:

I don't know anyone who runs a gooseneck adaptor.  And, from being around campgrounds, I see very few out there.  Regarding failures, I have seen reports and photos on forums like RV.net.  No idea how widespread they are, but I personally would not do it.

The older trailers seem to be built a little more stout, but the newer trailers all seem to be about saving weight.  My trailer is a 32', built in 2002, and weighs about 12,000 pounds.  Most new 5ers in that range now seem to be around 10,000 pounds.  And I don't think the weight savings is from using newer, materials that weigh less yet offer the same strength.  Everyone wants to save weight so that they can advertise as "light weight" or "1/2 ton towable". 

Even on my trailer, I think the frame is under built from the factory.  When I bought the trailer and added the hitch, the welder reinforced the frame up to the over hang.  Three years ago, when I found out my rear hitch was cracked, I had that fixed, and some other areas beefed up again.

So, my opinion is that the frames and running gears on an RV really aren't well suited to do anything more than what they are designed from the factory to do.

So really all connections can fail even yours failed you just caught it before it totally failed. Lots of people around here run the goose necks with no issues. Just a guess but most failures are user error. 

You double tow yea? 

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These guys claim that their gooseneck adapter puts no additional stress on the trailer frame and will not void the warranty. 

http://www.truckspring.com/products/Reese-Goose-Box-Fifth-Wheel-to-Gooseneck-Adapter-20-000-Lbs__94623.aspx#product-specs

it would be nice to not have to deal with the big 5th wheel hitch when using the bed for other purposes. 

 

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11 hours ago, RyanB said:

IMG_2896_zpsxuvs8yfm.jpg

 

Awesome.  You're one of those guys that insists on pulling 20k lbs over high CO passes while hundreds of cars and motorcycles pile up behind you at 25MPH.  Thanks!

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7 minutes ago, Cole2001 said:

These guys claim that their gooseneck adapter puts no additional stress on the trailer frame and will not void the warranty. 

http://www.truckspring.com/products/Reese-Goose-Box-Fifth-Wheel-to-Gooseneck-Adapter-20-000-Lbs__94623.aspx#product-specs

it would be nice to not have to deal with the big 5th wheel hitch when using the bed for other purposes. 

 

I've got a friend that swears by this conversion.  He hauls his 43' toy-hauler all over the country with his Silverado Denali 2500 Diesel.  He has airbags in the back to level but otherwise, pretty much bone stock.  He's put on ~60k miles a year over the last 3-4 years.  He's a contractor and his work takes him to far out places.  He had a dually before this truck and hated having to park it or find a car wash that could fit it.  No complaints on going to singles.

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47 minutes ago, malibu2004 said:

So really all connections can fail even yours failed you just caught it before it totally failed. Lots of people around here run the goose necks with no issues. Just a guess but most failures are user error. 

You double tow yea? 

I guess that the "all connections can fail" is an accurate way to look at things.  But there are things you can do that will increase the likelihood of that happening.  Towing tandem is certainly one of them.  As is anything else that would put added strain on those connections.  Stress that the frame wasn't designed to withstand is absolutely going to increase the likelihood of failure.

What I have read is that the gooseneck adaptor has more twisting force than the fifth wheel.  Is that true?  I'm not sure, but I have seen reports of failure.

I do understand that a gooseneck would be advantageous for the truck bed.  I am also of the opinion that if it was a better way (or even equal) to attach an RV, the manufactures would offer it as an option.  I am unaware of any that do.

At this point, I have had 4 different 5th wheel hitches.  Only one (the superglide) was too big for one person to lift out of the truck by itself.  My current hitch (a non-slider) rated to tow 19,000 pounds, is very easy to take out if I take the head off the base.  If I leave the head on, it is much more unruly.  

In reagards to towing tandem, I only did it once with my Malibu.  It is simply too big for me to feel comfortable doing it.  I do have a fishing boat that I double tow.  

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43 minutes ago, Fffrank said:

Awesome.  You're one of those guys that insists on pulling 20k lbs over high CO passes while hundreds of cars and motorcycles pile up behind you at 25MPH.  Thanks!

You must go by the motto that ignorance is bliss.  Going over Ike, the truck pulls somewhere between 40 - 50 MPH.  Three lanes, the speed limit is 60 MPH, and the big trucks are in the right lane doing the 25 MPH you suggest.  Most other passes can be towed at not more than 10 MPH under the posted speed limit.  And wether you believe it or not, adding the 5000 pound boat that was in the photo you quoted only slows the truck down by about 5 MPH.

I have never had "hundreds of cars and motorcycles pile up" behind me.

But I do want to thank you for your service as the weight police.

Edited by RyanB
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13 minutes ago, 1HELLUVALIFE said:

http://www.etrailer.com/multi-product.aspx?pc1=C16245&pc2=C16420-204&hhmake=Dodge&hhmodel=Ram+Pickup&hhyear=2006&vehicleid=20061239396&hunter=5w 

You can always pull the hitch with this style. Just leaves the rails in the bed, doesn't ever really get in my way. 

Quite a few options to leave the bed clean.  Like a hitch with rails that are under the bed.  This is similar to what I have.  There are four small "pucks" that are the only thing that obstruct the bed.

http://www.etrailer.com/multi-product.aspx?pc1=RP30142&pc2=RP30074&hhmake=Dodge&hhmodel=Ram+Pickup&hhyear=2012&vehicleid=2012642620&hunter=5w

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3 hours ago, RyanB said:

You must go by the motto that ignorance is bliss.  Going over Ike, the truck pulls somewhere between 40 - 50 MPH.  Three lanes, the speed limit is 60 MPH, and the big trucks are in the right lane doing the 25 MPH you suggest.  Most other passes can be towed at not more than 10 MPH under the posted speed limit.  And wether you believe it or not, adding the 5000 pound boat that was in the photo you quoted only slows the truck down by about 5 MPH.

I have never had "hundreds of cars and motorcycles pile up" behind me.

But I do want to thank you for your service as the weight police.

You're welcome to ride with the trucks on the interstate.  Plenty of room for me to get around you on the roads designed for cross-country shipping corridors.  But you didn't take the interstate to Lake Steamboat.  You took one of the many 2-lane roads that are marked 55mph and are filled with people like you driving 25-40mph over 8-10k foot passes.  Yes, there are passing lanes in places.  When you have 100 cars waiting there's not much of an opportunity, though.   

It's not about weight it's about courtesy.  Pull off next time you're double-towing up a 2 or 3-lane pass and count how many cars go past before you have a chance to pull back out.  You'll be surprised how much you didn't see behind you.

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Some of the new 5th wheel hitches actually mount to a goose neck hole in the truck.  I personally have never towed a 5th wheel, but if i am ever in the market, I will certainly be considerings one of them. this thread is really making me miss my diesel, I need to get another one soon!

Andersen Aluminum hitch: https://www.andersenhitches.com/Catalog/gooseneck-mount--ultimate-5th-wheel-connection.aspx

B&W Companion hitch: http://www.turnoverball.com/products/single-point-attachment/companion-5th-wheel-hitch 

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14 hours ago, RyanB said:

I am glad that you will allow me the courtesy to "ride with the trucks on the interstate".  That is generous.  As for the route to Steamboat Lake, I take I70 to CO9 to US40 (roads that vary in speed limit between 45-65 by the way).  

There is one pass, Rabbit Ears, off the interstate.  Speed limit there is 50 MPH.  While some of the older RVs, older trucks pulling boats, and almost all semi trucks are well below the speed limit, most newer RVs are able to be within 10 MPH of the speed limit there, and my rig is no different (I'm usually about 45 MPH).

In addition, there are two lanes going up both sides of the pass, as there are on most US Highways through the major passes in Colorado.  Not that I need cater to you, but I can assure you there are never 100 cars waiting for an opportunity to get around me.  Nor any number close to that, as I am sure that is where you are going next.

It is clear to me that your premise about towing power of a modern truck and assumptions of the road system in this area are incorrect, and I am not going to further derail the conversation in a pissing match.

Is Steamboat lake packed on the weekends or worth making a long weekend & getting away from the metro area madness?

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How reliable are the dodge ram 2500/3500 cummins engines, or gas for that matter?  I had an 08 ram 1500 before my 2014, granted I got rid of it at 65k miles but truck was solid & this ones been solid too.  What are the previous years when the dodge drive train was crap?  So many options out there now that I'm looking

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1 hour ago, racer808 said:

Is Steamboat lake packed on the weekends or worth making a long weekend & getting away from the metro area madness?

It isn't terrible.  I would say 70% of the people up there are fishermen, but there is a large group of locals that are up there every weekend.  They mostly do water sports.  Steamboat Lake is one of the busiest State Parks in the system for camping, so if you want to go, make reservations early.  My dad made reservations yesterday for the 2nd weekend in June, and all of his "favorite" spots were already reserved.

1 hour ago, racer808 said:

How reliable are the dodge ram 2500/3500 cummins engines, or gas for that matter?  I had an 08 ram 1500 before my 2014, granted I got rid of it at 65k miles but truck was solid & this ones been solid too.  What are the previous years when the dodge drive train was crap?  So many options out there now that I'm looking

I know there are a lot of Dodge/RAM bashers, but I have had very good luck with Chrysler products.  My last truck was a 2003 3500, kept it for 9 years and around 115,000 miles.  It was one of the best vehicles that I have ever had.  Both mechanical and interior held up very well.  And it was mainly used for towing.

My current truck is a 2012 3500.  It has been almost flawless.  In for a couple of recalls, and one CEL.  Other than that, I can't think of anything.  This truck is 100% recreational - never been used as a DD, but as you can see from the photos, it tows a lot.

As far as transmissions, I would say they got the issues worked out in 2003 with the introduction of the 48RE.  The previous version, the 47RE, was an ok transmission at stock levels of power. Trouble came when people added tuners.

RAM is the only manufacture that offers a choice of transmissions in heavy duty trucks.  You can still get a stick if you want.  The slightly lower output trucks (2500 and some 3500) come with a 6 speed 68RFE.  That is the one I have.  And the high output Cummins comes with a Medium Duty transmission - the Aisin.  

If you are serious about a new truck, and want a RAM, send me a PM.  I can get you a "friends and family" voucher that will get you a discount without having to negotiate with the dealer.

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I've been looking into newer trucks and reliability. Every model has its fan boy, but from what I can tell the Cummins is one of the more reliable engines. The Aisin transmission is a big plus if you can get it in the truck you are looking at. The Duramax is also a good choice but some say it feels weak, but reliability wise it is good. Many mixed reviews on the Power Strokes these days. I have a tendency to think that Ford lovers would swear their truck is the best as it sets smoldering in the background though, very adamant group they are. All in all, everyone recommends getting rid of the emissions stuff on most of the engines claiming that is a reason of failure. My locale does not allow for that and is inspected yearly.

I've found the big Dodge gas engine is well received. Maybe not as flashy as some of the other big engines available but sounds like it is well built and reliable. Don't know about the 6 spd tranny backing it though, I haven't read any horror stories. I'm leaning toward the 6.4 for my next engine/truck combo. I don't tow heavy enough to justify a diesel cost and quite frankly I think the new diesels are far to complex and expensive should they break. I'd love a new Cummins, but just can't see it as being necessary.

I just got rid of a '96 Ram 1500 with the 5.9. It has 278,000 miles on it. The transmission was freshened up at 125k, other than that, minimal maintenance. I think the only thing we did to the engine was a water pump gasket. It towed a good bit of its life too.

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23 hours ago, malibu2004 said:

@RyanB You can order it pre installed from Ford which would mean it's a warrantied item. https://accessories.ford.com/5th-wheel-gooseneck-hitch-prep-package.html 

Chevy/GMC also offers it http://www.gmc.com/gmc-life/trucks/sierra-fifth-wheel-prep-package.html

I would assume Dodge does the same deal.

 

Yes, Dodge has both a 5th wheel prep kit ($220)  and a gooseneck prep kit ($325).  There isn't much to them since Dodge builds the important stuff into every frame

http://moparonlineparts.com/250035004500-hitch-rack-accessories-c-26_47_75_172.html

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45 minutes ago, RyanB said:

It isn't terrible.  I would say 70% of the people up there are fishermen, but there is a large group of locals that are up there every weekend.  They mostly do water sports.  Steamboat Lake is one of the busiest State Parks in the system for camping, so if you want to go, make reservations early.  My dad made reservations yesterday for the 2nd weekend in June, and all of his "favorite" spots were already reserved.

I know there are a lot of Dodge/RAM bashers, but I have had very good luck with Chrysler products.  My last truck was a 2003 3500, kept it for 9 years and around 115,000 miles.  It was one of the best vehicles that I have ever had.  Both mechanical and interior held up very well.  And it was mainly used for towing.

My current truck is a 2012 3500.  It has been almost flawless.  In for a couple of recalls, and one CEL.  Other than that, I can't think of anything.  This truck is 100% recreational - never been used as a DD, but as you can see from the photos, it tows a lot.

As far as transmissions, I would say they got the issues worked out in 2003 with the introduction of the 48RE.  The previous version, the 47RE, was an ok transmission at stock levels of power. Trouble came when people added tuners.

RAM is the only manufacture that offers a choice of transmissions in heavy duty trucks.  You can still get a stick if you want.  The slightly lower output trucks (2500 and some 3500) come with a 6 speed 68RFE.  That is the one I have.  And the high output Cummins comes with a Medium Duty transmission - the Aisin.  

If you are serious about a new truck, and want a RAM, send me a PM.  I can get you a "friends and family" voucher that will get you a discount without having to negotiate with the dealer.

What is the difference in the 2 trucks? I didn't know they made a 2 different models. Tell me more I want to learn. I might be going back to a diesel on of these days and I know for a fact it will either be a Dodge or Chevy. 

 

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I am noticing on the 2500's & 3500's they all have the same hemi as I have in my 2014?  Thought they would have bigger motors?  

4 hours ago, RyanB said:

It isn't terrible.  I would say 70% of the people up there are fishermen, but there is a large group of locals that are up there every weekend.  They mostly do water sports.  Steamboat Lake is one of the busiest State Parks in the system for camping, so if you want to go, make reservations early.  My dad made reservations yesterday for the 2nd weekend in June, and all of his "favorite" spots were already reserved.

I know there are a lot of Dodge/RAM bashers, but I have had very good luck with Chrysler products.  My last truck was a 2003 3500, kept it for 9 years and around 115,000 miles.  It was one of the best vehicles that I have ever had.  Both mechanical and interior held up very well.  And it was mainly used for towing.

My current truck is a 2012 3500.  It has been almost flawless.  In for a couple of recalls, and one CEL.  Other than that, I can't think of anything.  This truck is 100% recreational - never been used as a DD, but as you can see from the photos, it tows a lot.

As far as transmissions, I would say they got the issues worked out in 2003 with the introduction of the 48RE.  The previous version, the 47RE, was an ok transmission at stock levels of power. Trouble came when people added tuners.

RAM is the only manufacture that offers a choice of transmissions in heavy duty trucks.  You can still get a stick if you want.  The slightly lower output trucks (2500 and some 3500) come with a 6 speed 68RFE.  That is the one I have.  And the high output Cummins comes with a Medium Duty transmission - the Aisin.  

If you are serious about a new truck, and want a RAM, send me a PM.  I can get you a "friends and family" voucher that will get you a discount without having to negotiate with the dealer.

I appreciate it, can't afford new this time, wife wants me to trade truck in for the other big truck that is a few years old, or sell her Kia & get a used tow vehicle that is older but reliable.  

Edited by racer808
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7 minutes ago, racer808 said:

I am noticing on the 2500's & 3500's they all have the same hemi as I have in my 2014?  Thought they would have bigger motors?  

I appreciate it, can't afford new this time, wife wants me to trade truck in for the other big truck that is a few years old, or sell her Kia & get a used tow vehicle that is older but reliable.  

The newer 2500s and 3500's have the 6.4 Hemi as an option too, the 5.7 used in the HD trucks has some differences from the 1500 - no MDS is one.  Honestly the 5.7 geared right is a beast and that is why they had no issues putting it in the bigger trucks.

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I admit that I don't keep up with the gas side of the 2500/3500 as much as I do the diesel.  How old are you considering?  I am almost certain that they did not put the 5.7 in the 3500.  And the 6.4 hasn't been out that long.

I do believe you are doing a disservice to yourself if you are thinking of buying an HD truck with a gas engine to pull a 5er in Colorado.  After all, common courtesy dictates that you pull 70 MPH over the passes, right?  :whistle:

In all seriousness, I think a diesel is the right tool for the job when you talking about pulling a large RV in Colorado.

Which would bring us back to the how old are you considering question.  RAM basically introduced a new HD truck in 2013 with a heavier frame, DEF, and the Aisin tranny.  I love my truck, but there are quite a few advantages (mainly MPG) if you go with 2013 plus.  And I am not sure if you have shopped yet, but it is crazy how high resale is on the newer trucks.  My guess is you will find that for not a lot more $, you can get into something that is brand new with full warranty vs something that is a few years old and often has a lot of miles.

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6 hours ago, malibu2004 said:

What is the difference in the 2 trucks? I didn't know they made a 2 different models. Tell me more I want to learn. I might be going back to a diesel on of these days and I know for a fact it will either be a Dodge or Chevy. 

 

Not sure what you are asking?  Differences in the 2500 vs 3500 is mostly suspension.  2500 has rear coil.  3500 offers an air suspension option.

2500 offers the G56 manual transmission as well as the 68RFE.  No HO Cummins available.

3500 offer the above transmissions, plus the HO Cummins engine with Aisin transmission.

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44 minutes ago, RyanB said:

I admit that I don't keep up with the gas side of the 2500/3500 as much as I do the diesel.  How old are you considering?  I am almost certain that they did not put the 5.7 in the 3500.  And the 6.4 hasn't been out that long.

I do believe you are doing a disservice to yourself if you are thinking of buying an HD truck with a gas engine to pull a 5er in Colorado.  After all, common courtesy dictates that you pull 70 MPH over the passes, right?  :whistle:

In all seriousness, I think a diesel is the right tool for the job when you talking about pulling a large RV in Colorado.

Which would bring us back to the how old are you considering question.  RAM basically introduced a new HD truck in 2013 with a heavier frame, DEF, and the Aisin tranny.  I love my truck, but there are quite a few advantages (mainly MPG) if you go with 2013 plus.  And I am not sure if you have shopped yet, but it is crazy how high resale is on the newer trucks.  My guess is you will find that for not a lot more $, you can get into something that is brand new with full warranty vs something that is a few years old and often has a lot of miles.

You can get a 5.7, 6.4 or cummins in a 2017 Ram 3500  5.7L is the standard engine and has been since the 5.9 went away

http://www.ramtrucks.com/model-compare/detailed-chart/?modelYearCode=CUT201615

Edited by oldjeep
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