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23 LSV vs. Ri237


Hotsoup

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@Ndawg12

Similar to T23 vs 23LSV.  There is definitely differences. 

1. Ballast almost 3000 pounds difference

2. no ram fill

3. no CATS  (articulating tracking fin)

4. Different engines

5. lacking the touch screens,  etc

6. Ri is WAY DEEPER!  (look at space above rub rail)  you see them in showroom they are really different

Chevy  vs Cadillac....

That said, yes you can make them surf very similar, albeit not the same. 

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2 hours ago, Ndawg12 said:

I have a buddy that sells Supremes and he says the hull of the S238 and the RI237 are identical.  I surfed his with ~5k of ballast and it was pretty damn good but not as good as what people are raving about on here IMO.  Is he full of BS?  If not, why wouldn't people be saving 50k and going with a Supreme? 

 

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That was what I was thinking also... The RI does come with way more internal ballast... I wanted to demo again... but at 78,000 plus ttl and how bare boned it was.. I would just assume to buy a LSV once the new ones prove to surf better than the one I have. (Last quote I had on a LSV was 98,000... yes that is 20,000 more... but.... I had added heater, heated seats... The surf system on the Supreme is not user friendly nor can you do transfers on the fly... by time I upgraded the Supreme to my likeing I am in the upper 80,0000 with less features... does not make sense to me at this time.... would like to give it a shot again... but once my "friend" (that use to sell me Malibu) knew I was not interested at that price.. no longer a demo option on a fresh water lake :(... The Supreme seemed very well built to me and if you option for the close cooling system you get the PCM instead of the Crusader... My biggest complaint was the wakeboard wake.. and the salsman agreed... but if you only surf... it might the beast you need

 

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Just now, DarkSide said:

@Ndawg12

Similar to T23 vs 23LSV.  There is definitely differences. 

1. Ballast almost 3000 pounds difference

2. no ram fill

3. no CATS  (articulating tracking fin)

4. Different engines

5. lacking the touch screens,  etc

6. Ri is WAY DEEPER!  (look at space above rub rail)  you see them in showroom they are really different

Chevy  vs Cadillac....

That said, yes you can make them surf very similar, albeit not the same. 

Sorry to correct you @DarkSide but:

1. Correct :)

2. Supreme has PureVert.. same as ram fill... different name... however the PureVert tanks on the Supreme are smaller than the ramfill on the Centurion. also.. not sure of the advantage of the Supreme system when it still relies on pumps to fill front and PNP....

3. Correct :)

4. You can upgrade to the PCM in a Supreme if you go with close loop cooling...

5. 2017 Supreme will have touch screen...

Chevy vs Cadillac,,,, AGREED :cheers: 

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@kerpluxal  the shallow draft of Malibu's may actually help you,  with your shallow waters.   I am not sure how the centurion/supreme does it in shallow depths.    This could be an area where delayed convergence is better than hull and displacement. ...i have zero data to back that up but it kinda makes sense.   

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5 minutes ago, DarkSide said:

@kerpluxal  the shallow draft of Malibu's may actually help you,  with your shallow waters.   I am not sure how the centurion/supreme does it in shallow depths.    This could be an area where delayed convergence is better than hull and displacement. ...i have zero data to back that up but it kinda makes sense.   

Well... I have GSA not Surfgate..(GSA does work in combination of delay convergence plus listing the boat with the tab) There is no replacement for Displacement :biggrin:.... I do run a ton of weight in my boat (1300 each rear total, 500 under coffins, 500 in center tank... 1450 up front... I am going to hold on to her till something makes me smile more...

@Hotsoup ... let me throw you another option... get a used boat of your choice and install GSA/Wave Controller and save yourself some $$$$$ ;)

 

 

 

Edited by kerpluxal
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Just now, kerpluxal said:

Sorry to correct you @DarkSide but:

1. Correct :)

2. Supreme has PureVert.. same as ram fill... different name... however the PureVert tanks on the Supreme are smaller than the ramfill on the Centurion. also.. not sure of the advantage of the Supreme system when it still relies on pumps to fill front and PNP....

3. Correct :)

4. You can upgrade to the PCM in a Supreme if you go with close loop cooling...

5. 2017 Supreme will have touch screen...

Chevy vs Cadillac,,,, AGREED :cheers: 

No worries,  Yes supreme has a touch screen but not the same level,  or features.   example gps mapping is standard,  and can be displayed on one side while the other side still displays ballast , speed or whatever.  So here we're both correct. 

Engine, yes can be upgraded to the same,  but that goes to the original  question of why  50k difference.   Once you upgrade difference starts to narrow and so does price . ...i will say again we are both correct here as well. 

Ram fill/quick fill similar enough, just different speed and capacities.

So all good....here is how boardco defines the difference.

http://www.mmwatersports.com/boat-performance/why-are-supremes-less-expensive/

 

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On 12/8/2016 at 9:07 AM, DarkSide said:

Bama that is an excellent point, i dont know if anyone has tested cruise speed, RPM, etc.  I know i didn't.  If i had to cruise 1/2 regularly this would be an important test.  Here 15 minutes is a long cruise,  our lakes are small.  

I had to research what the other boat was...missed that product announcement from Centurion.  Just looking at the specs, its a 21'6" boat that weights almost 5,500 lbs dry.  Given the laws of physics, this is a surf-focused boat, that I assume won't handle, accelerate or provide overall performance that the 2 ft longer LSV will (the LSV weighs 1000 lbs less dry).

Surfing is fun, but so is boarding, ripping on a slalom ski, dragging kids on a tube, and hauling arse @ 45 MPH back to the dock to get out of bad weather or just for the fun of it.  You really need to test drive them both and see which one fits your needs the best.  If you surf 25% of the time, not sure you want a dedicated surf machine from any manufacturer. 

Good luck, window shopping is half the fun, by the way.  :-)

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On 12/7/2016 at 7:32 PM, Hotsoup said:

Family of 4.  Kids 10 and 13.  We all surf....not as much as I would like.  We currently have a regal 2300 surf.  Great family boat but it's a bit difficult for my wife to drive and wave is inconsistent.  Probably 30% surfing, 70% cruising/hanging out.  Expect us to all develop our surf game but don't need the "biggest" of waves.  Ride quality is important during cruising as we have friends on the lake a 1/2 hour away across open water. 

You should consider a 25 LSV, especially if considering a RI 237. Mass wise they are more similar.. although the 25lsv is smaller than the Ri257 beast.

Also you would be getting much much more room to move around if out for long days and you will appreciate extra room quickly in 30min cruises. It will be slightly better ride than the 23lsv due to size and weight. The RI has deeper v so no comparison there although the 25lsv would be much closer then the 23 LSV. 

The reason I say is that your in the 115k range from what I saw and there are some 25 lsv in that range and some below like the one up here for 105k loaded with a G4 .. getting dumped because it's a little big for all the lakes around that dealer.. cheaper than used!!!

I think with the 25 LSV you solve all your troubles.. getting bling plus better resale Gaurantee.. I'd love to try the RI but until I see the resale I'm not sure I could or would be willing to chance taking a bath.. but I hope to be proven wrong shortly. Although in a few yrs when im ready to upgrade I'm sure bu will have a Ri type overhall in the lsvs. 

Anyhow IMO long cruises and family time u want more realestate out in the water and the 25 has a TON of storage compared to my  2013 23 LSV. 

Too many people get caught up on comparing length to length on these boats but again I feel the 25 LSV size mass wise is better compared to the RI 237, but you do get more much more room in the longer 25 LSV. And seems you could save 10k for a loaded 25 going cheaper than most 23s and surely cheaper than the Ri. Just look around u can find some deals if willing to make a drive.

As always good luck!

Edited by The Hulk
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5 hours ago, The Hulk said:

You should consider a 25 LSV, especially if considering a RI 237. Mass wise they are more similar.. although the 25lsv is smaller than the Ri257 beast.

Also you would be getting much much more room to move around if out for long days and you will appreciate extra room quickly in 30min cruises. It will be slightly better ride than the 23lsv due to size and weight. The RI has deeper v so no comparison there although the 25lsv would be much closer then the 23 LSV. 

The reason I say is that your in the 115k range from what I saw and there are some 25 lsv in that range and some below like the one up here for 105k loaded with a G4 .. getting dumped because it's a little big for all the lakes around that dealer.. cheaper than used!!!

I think with the 25 LSV you solve all your troubles.. getting bling plus better resale Gaurantee.. I'd love to try the RI but until I see the resale I'm not sure I could or would be willing to chance taking a bath.. but I hope to be proven wrong shortly. Although in a few yrs when im ready to upgrade I'm sure bu will have a Ri type overhall in the lsvs. 

Anyhow IMO long cruises and family time u want more realestate out in the water and the 25 has a TON of storage compared to my  2013 23 LSV. 

Too many people get caught up on comparing length to length on these boats but again I feel the 25 LSV size mass wise is better compared to the RI 237, but you do get more much more room in the longer 25 LSV. And seems you could save 10k for a loaded 25 going cheaper than most 23s and surely cheaper than the Ri. Just look around u can find some deals if willing to make a drive.

As always good luck!

I agree 25lsv seams logical, but....

 

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3 hours ago, DarkSide said:

I agree 25lsv seams logical, but....

 

sorry missed @Hotsoup's  wife is a bow babe! :thumbup:

I hardly ever use the bow but we have toddlers so they are not allowed up there without an adult, although i suspect with teenagers perhaps that would change a bit during the time we are cruising, although if surfing then everyone wants to be in the back. personally i've never been a fan of the pickle forks on any boat, i like the Ri nose that has a slightly wider curve/angle to it kind of like the supra SA., although i personally wish they pointed the nose a tad more but that would add 6" of useless boat, but looks wise i love a traditional pointed bow.. i've always though or at least told myself resale on a TB is better...thats my biggest diss like on the G's though.

the Ri's do look sweet performance wise, since i only surf, and i would love a deep v for the chop, but the Draft is a major concern adding even a bit more than what i have could be problematic on a lot of the small lakes up here in channels and sandbar and near dock etc.. and now i have to park near the edge of the sandbar i cant imagine the Ri with a crew in it....Anyhow i'm anxious to try an Ri, but more interested to see what they become in the next couple years before i upgrade. I feel if the Ri becomes a success then BU will update the next LSV to a much deeper boat than currently. Each mold update / revision is doing just that, so i suspect it to be an easy change increasing the top mold 4-6" higher.. adding storage and bigger Hard tanks, PNP etc.. if i had to bet that will be their next revision rather than bottom mold with deeper V. cheaper and allows them to add ballast weight and storage and will keep their wakeboard fans... Also the new engines will have my attention, as @DarkSide mentioned currently with the trannys sometimes the SC upgrade makes no sense especially on the Ri's you only get "lower rpms" basically no torque difference.. Anyhow it should be fun to watch all these companies battle it out over the next few years!

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