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r33pwrd

Helping me picking sub and amp...

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r33pwrd

So doing a completely new stereo (only reusing the Exile towers) so far I have bought a Sinister SD6 for my 6 cabin speakers (2 sets of the XS-808’s and a set of the XS-650) and a Sinister SD2 to run my Exile surf style towers.  I think this is a solid starting point but can’t decide on what sub and amp setup to do.  Originally I was going to do the WS XS-XXX 12” sub powered by another Sinister SD2 but cannot find many good reviews on it.  My other thought is a JL 1200 watt amp and 13W7…. Ideally I would like amps to match but sound quality is more important to me.  (I will do a ported enclosure under the driver’s helm).  Also for reference I was running the Exile 12” off the javaline 5 channel amp.

 

Thank you

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minnmarker

It looks like you have a very good budget and are already picking excellent components.  What kind of tower speakers are you going to drive with 400 watts per side?  Maybe you don't need a woofer :lol:

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Fman

I had good results with that Exile 12" and Javelin setup in a 1.3 cu ft sealed box.   Super nice sounding bass, we're you not satisfied with it?  in fact I am putting the same setup again in my boat this spring.

 

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surfdude

Anyone try a Rockford t0 sub? I was thinking of going with this or a w6

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r33pwrd
3 hours ago, minnmarker said:

It looks like you have a very good budget and are already picking excellent components.  What kind of tower speakers are you going to drive with 400 watts per side?  Maybe you don't need a woofer :lol:

I am running 4 EXILE SXT9Q... they are rated at 200 RMS 400 peak each.  I know it will be pushing them for sure but I wanted to make sure I had enough amp to upgrade to 2 410's later if I want to.  I actually like the exile towers sound a lot and I'm hoping with the better amp they will sound even better.  Thankfully I was able to get the 20 percent off over thanksgiving weekend (saved me a ton).  I just need a sub setup now :)

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r33pwrd
3 hours ago, Fman said:

I had good results with that Exile 12" and Javelin setup in a 1.3 cu ft sealed box.   Super nice sounding bass, we're you not satisfied with it?  in fact I am putting the same setup again in my boat this spring.

 

I have the same sub and amp now but in a ported box and to me its okay but it may be the box more then the amp/sub combo.  For the record we like our music very loud...

Edited by r33pwrd

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Fman
3 hours ago, r33pwrd said:

I have the same sub and amp now but in a ported box and to me its okay but it may be the box more then the amp/sub combo.  For the record we like our music very loud...

Before you go shake up the Exile tree seal off the box at 1.3 cu ft, that sub rocked the house for all genres of music too, and is it tuned properly?

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r33pwrd
55 minutes ago, Fman said:

Before you go shake up the Exile tree seal off the box at 1.3 cu ft, that sub rocked the house for all genres of music too, and is it tuned properly?

Box was but to exile spec.. I guess I can buy a new amp and try a sealed box..

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Fman

I thought you mentioned you had a Javelin amp which will push plenty for that sub. I am not saying there are not other good brands out there to run but that Javelin pared with Exile 12" sub in a good box is a very nice setup.  I have also run a Wetsounds 12" with Arc audio amp and both of these sounded good. I do think the Exile was better but could be due to the box construction.

Making sure the amp is properly tuned could also make a difference.  imho you have a nice amp and sub, almost seems like a waste of money to go out and purchase something else.  If you end up selling your Exile sub and Javelin pm me.

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MLA

R33,

What is it in a good review, are you looking for? Are you seeing "bad" reviews? Build quality? Its a Wet Sounds woofer designed from the ground up as a true marine woofer, nuff said. Power handling? Yeah, it will handle some serious juice. I know you want all three amps to match, but I like the Kicker KX2400.1 for the XS-XXXv2. 1200W rms @ 4 ohm and all the tuning dials you need. Power wise, a bridged SD-2 is great though. 

Its obvious that if you are looking at the XXXv2 or a JL 13W7, you are looking to take your bass to a whole new level as compared to the previous setup. By the numbers, the 13" and its extra excursion would give it the edge in output. However, in an open environment of a boat, im not sure that will be heard or felt in the seat of the pants. Sound quality is so subjective and many will say the W7 is the bench mark. By no means, does the XS-XXXv2 sound bad. 

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r33pwrd
9 hours ago, Fman said:

I thought you mentioned you had a Javelin amp which will push plenty for that sub. I am not saying there are not other good brands out there to run but that Javelin pared with Exile 12" sub in a good box is a very nice setup.  I have also run a Wetsounds 12" with Arc audio amp and both of these sounded good. I do think the Exile was better but could be due to the box construction.

Making sure the amp is properly tuned could also make a difference.  imho you have a nice amp and sub, almost seems like a waste of money to go out and purchase something else.  If you end up selling your Exile sub and Javelin pm me.

It's all for sale.. I'm going to get a membership here today and post on the classifieds.

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r33pwrd
1 hour ago, MLA said:

R33,

What is it in a good review, are you looking for? Are you seeing "bad" reviews? Build quality? Its a Wet Sounds woofer designed from the ground up as a true marine woofer, nuff said. Power handling? Yeah, it will handle some serious juice. I know you want all three amps to match, but I like the Kicker KX2400.1 for the XS-XXXv2. 1200W rms @ 4 ohm and all the tuning dials you need. Power wise, a bridged SD-2 is great though. 

Its obvious that if you are looking at the XXXv2 or a JL 13W7, you are looking to take your bass to a whole new level as compared to the previous setup. By the numbers, the 13" and its extra excursion would give it the edge in output. However, in an open environment of a boat, im not sure that will be heard or felt in the seat of the pants. Sound quality is so subjective and many will say the W7 is the bench mark. By no means, does the XS-XXXv2 sound bad. 

I just can't really find anyone running the wetsounds sub.  So nothing bad or good for that matter I can find about it.  And yes I'm trying to build a top of the line system that I will never have to upgrade again I hope :)

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r33pwrd
1 hour ago, MLA said:

R33,

What is it in a good review, are you looking for? Are you seeing "bad" reviews? Build quality? Its a Wet Sounds woofer designed from the ground up as a true marine woofer, nuff said. Power handling? Yeah, it will handle some serious juice. I know you want all three amps to match, but I like the Kicker KX2400.1 for the XS-XXXv2. 1200W rms @ 4 ohm and all the tuning dials you need. Power wise, a bridged SD-2 is great though. 

Its obvious that if you are looking at the XXXv2 or a JL 13W7, you are looking to take your bass to a whole new level as compared to the previous setup. By the numbers, the 13" and its extra excursion would give it the edge in output. However, in an open environment of a boat, im not sure that will be heard or felt in the seat of the pants. Sound quality is so subjective and many will say the W7 is the bench mark. By no means, does the XS-XXXv2 sound bad. 

That kicker amp looks nice!  Yea not sure about the w7.. my local stereo shop (big name company) sells JL and says they will warranty the sub used in a boat and even offer an extended warranty for it.. 

Edited by r33pwrd

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minnmarker
1 hour ago, MLA said:

However, in an open environment of a boat, im not sure that will be heard or felt in the seat of the pants. Sound quality is so subjective and many will say the W7 is the bench mark. By no means, does the XS-XXXv2 sound bad. 

:plus1:

At a certain point in "upgrading" sound systems in an open boat you start throwing money away.  Between the engine, the wind, and the very sub-optimal "sound space" there is a limit to what you can do to improve the audio experience.  Also, depending on where you'll be using it, if your neighbors or fellow boaters do not care to listen to your tunes you might find yourself either shamed or LEO'ed into dialing it all back.  On our lake there are several tower speaker setups that do not get used to anywhere near their "potential" - and the dealer on the lake does not install systems over a given size if the boat will be staying on the lake - and it's not a small lake.

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r33pwrd

Thankfully our summer place is on a 26 mile stretch of water with about 10 boats so we don't have to worry about bothering other people.. and that's part of the reason I'm not upgrading to Rev 10s or the 410 yet...

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David

In order of efficiency, if you want tons of bass, the ingredients are 1) type of loading (sealed, bass-reflex, etc.), 2) surface area, 3) excursion, and 4) power. A bass-reflex enclosure will produce a substantial output increase. It's an easy upgrade without more speaker or more power. But it will be MUCH larger than a sealed enclosure for the same driver. The next in line is surface area. There's no substitute. The frameless 13W7 has about 40% more radiating area than a conventional high-roll surround 12-inch subwoofer. Woofer excursion and amplifier power are interconnected. More excursion means less sensitivity and requires much more power. There is certainly a benefit but it's costly. So where do you begin in order to get the strongest bass output? First, your boat will determine the maximum enclosure displacement. And that number will determine the best subwoofer driver option in combination with the type of loading (enclosure). Start with your dealer modeling the max enclosure for your particular boat. From there the pieces should click into place.

 

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r33pwrd

I do not have space limitations really.  I have an a24 and there is a ton of room under the drivers helm. Currently I have a 2.2 square foot box and could easily add another square foot or so.. 

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David

In placing the horse before the cart, getting a concise max enclosure size is still an important exercise on your way to obtaining the best possible bass. For example, a 13W7 in a bass-reflex enclosure requires an external enclosure displacement of over 4 cu.ft. And that's minimum. Changes to the enclosure shape could increase that number.

Also, with varying 2, 3 and 4-ohm subwoofer options, you want to have your subwoofer choice made before selecting your amplifier.  

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minnmarker
1 hour ago, r33pwrd said:

Thankfully our summer place is on a 26 mile stretch of water with about 10 boats so we don't have to worry about bothering other people.. and that's part of the reason I'm not upgrading to Rev 10s or the 410 yet...

Chelan?

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r33pwrd
1 minute ago, minnmarker said:

Chelan?

nope just south at a place called Desert Aire, its a small community on the Columbia river.  Not popular like Chelan as the beaches suck but its a great place for people like me who enjoy being on the boat more than a beach.  

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r33pwrd
12 hours ago, David said:

In placing the horse before the cart, getting a concise max enclosure size is still an important exercise on your way to obtaining the best possible bass. For example, a 13W7 in a bass-reflex enclosure requires an external enclosure displacement of over 4 cu.ft. And that's minimum. Changes to the enclosure shape could increase that number.

Also, with varying 2, 3 and 4-ohm subwoofer options, you want to have your subwoofer choice made before selecting your amplifier.  

Curious were you see 4 cu ft for the 13w7? JL says like 2.4 or am I missing something?

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David
7 hours ago, r33pwrd said:

Curious were you see 4 cu ft for the 13w7? JL says like 2.4 or am I missing something?

External, including port displacement and material. The place to start when determining a fit.

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r33pwrd
1 hour ago, David said:

External, including port displacement and material. The place to start when determining a fit.

Okay going to go pull the Exile out this weekend and measure the area. 

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ConnollyCrew
On 12/5/2016 at 11:46 AM, r33pwrd said:

So doing a completely new stereo (only reusing the Exile towers) so far I have bought a Sinister SD6 for my 6 cabin speakers (2 sets of the XS-808’s and a set of the XS-650) and a Sinister SD2 to run my Exile surf style towers.  I think this is a solid starting point but can’t decide on what sub and amp setup to do.  Originally I was going to do the WS XS-XXX 12” sub powered by another Sinister SD2 but cannot find many good reviews on it.  My other thought is a JL 1200 watt amp and 13W7…. Ideally I would like amps to match but sound quality is more important to me.  (I will do a ported enclosure under the driver’s helm).  Also for reference I was running the Exile 12” off the javaline 5 channel amp.

 

Thank you

Had and SD6 and ran the last two Channels  bridged (600rms) on an XS-12 in a ported and properly tuned box and it sounded great with good bass output. I was told that the bass carried quite a long way as well. 

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