ATF Leak

[Ndawg12]

They aren't npt but a 1/2" pvc plug with an o-ring will bite a few threads and give a tight enough seal to pump a few psi in there.  However, I did not get it to leak and thought maybe I was so low on ATF that the level was below the leak point.  So I added another quart and put air on it for about 5 minutes and still couldn't get it to leak.  I could hear it release pressure for atleast 10 seconds through an air needle after I disconnected so I know I built some pressure.  

[Woodski]

@Ndawg12:  That might be an indication the trans seal is leaking since if you put some pressure on the backside of the seal in theory that would increase the lip seal to shaft pressure and reduce the potential for leakage.

[wdr]

Would pulling vacuum on it accomplish anything? You would have to seal the trans vent somehow, but I bet a Walmart bag and a rubber band would do the trick. Run the vacuum pump hose through a rubber grommet to seal the fill hole, insert and suck. You would probably be able to hear the air gurgling through the fluid as it is sucked in past the bad seal. Just a thought.

[Ndawg12]

19 hours ago, Woodski said:

@Ndawg12:  That might be an indication the trans seal is leaking since if you put some pressure on the backside of the seal in theory that would increase the lip seal to shaft pressure and reduce the potential for leakage.

Trying to remember/envision how it's all assembled...So could I pull my starter and try stuffing a rag or something in there to see if I've go fluid sitting in the bottom of the bell housing?

[minnmarker]

On 12/16/2015 at 3:12 AM, Ndawg12 said:

No I have not ran it since I winterized. Coincidentally that was just a day or 2 before our first freeze as well so i guess it could have accumulated then. I assume there is no pressure on this line without the motor running?

Going out on a long limb here but could it be RV antifreeze?  Same color but not slippery.

[Ndawg12]

I'm on the non-anti-freeze team so no, plus my ATF is visibly lower and barely read on the dipstick before I added a whole quart, now it's overfilled and will check to see how much has leaked out tonight.

[tdelandsheer]

I had a trans start leaking along the center seal where you would split the trans in half to work on it. I would get a mirror and see if you can track down where it is dripping from off the bottom. 

I also liked the idea to try and check the bell housing. Maybe you could construct some sort of long Q-tip to check that out.  You might be able to remove an inspection plate to check that out too. (like tape a Q-tip to something longer lol)

[Ndawg12]

On 3/2/2016 at 1:35 PM, tdelandsheer said:

I had a trans start leaking along the center seal where you would split the trans in half to work on it. I would get a mirror and see if you can track down where it is dripping from off the bottom. 

I also liked the idea to try and check the bell housing. Maybe you could construct some sort of long Q-tip to check that out.  You might be able to remove an inspection plate to check that out too. (like tape a Q-tip to something longer lol)

I have pinpointed exactly where the leak is coming from.  This pic is terrible for reference but it's coming from a 17mm nut that I assume (like tdelandsheer mentioned above) holds the 2 halves of the tranny together, I didn't count them but I'd guess there's 4-5 of them around the outside of the tranny.  So can anyone shed some light on this, am I pulling the tranny and vdrive to fix this?  Is there a gasket between the 2 halves or would it be an ATV type sealant/gasket?  If I'm pulling it what else could/should I replace while I've got it out?

 

Edited March 21, 2016 by Ndawg12

[tdelandsheer]

4 hours ago, Ndawg12 said:

I have pinpointed exactly where the leak is coming from.  This pic is terrible for reference but it's coming from a 17mm nut that I assume (like tdelandsheer mentioned above) holds the 2 halves of the tranny together, I didn't count them but I'd guess there's 4-5 of them around the outside of the tranny.  So can anyone shed some light on this, am I pulling the tranny and vdrive to fix this?  Is there a gasket between the 2 halves or would it be an ATV type sealant/gasket?  If I'm pulling it what else could/should I replace while I've got it out?

 

I'm sorry to see this NDawg.

I started by trying to tighten the bolts. This took a special mixture of cut in half wrenches to get to all the bolts. This did not fix mine though.

When I couldn't tighten it enough I ended up pulling the trans and Vdrive (had to pull the gas tank too to get them out). I had a trans shop put all new seals and gaskets through the entire trans. Since I hired that part out I can't tell you what type of seals they were (I think it was a rubber type seal though).

I did rebuild the seals/gaskets in the Vdrive on my own though. It wasn't leaking but I figured it was out and I was waiting on the trans anyway. The OEM for the Vdrive had a great kit with some decent instructions. 

I'm happy to answer any questions you might have either here or in a PM. Good Luck!

Edited March 21, 2016 by tdelandsheer
missing word

[Ndawg12]

Yup I all ready cut a 17mm in half.  There's just no room to get much torque on it but I was able to put enough on it to know that it's not loose.  This is not good news but we'll see what my dealer says.  Thanks for the info TD and if I tackle any of this then I'll reach out to you.

Edited March 21, 2016 by Ndawg12

[Ndawg12]

First pic is indication that I've found the leak source. Pic 2 is how tight it is, plus a normal length wrench has to be cut in half. I was able to loosen that nut, so now the question is: do I take a chance and "jimmy rig" a solution involving adding a convexed flat washer and some 3m 4200?  Or take it to my dealer where they will probably need to pull the tranny/vdrive and fuel tank at a minimum?  Id guess that  repair to range from 1-1.5k. 

 

[minnmarker]

Good detective work!  Perhaps clean it up good, a copper crush washer or two, and some blue Locktite?

[wdr]

IIWM, I would clean it up and use a good dose of 4200 or Permatex gasket maker around the base of the threads then place a washer with a small enough ID that I had to almost spin it on the threads to get it on. Then tighten the nut down so the washer would force the sealant into the threads and casting. Check occasionally and enjoy the coming summer. It is almost too late in the year to take it in now, but if it is still giving you problems at the end of this season I would wait until the last day of the season and take her in the following weekend. JM2C

[Ndawg12]

26 minutes ago, wdr said:

IIWM, I would clean it up and use a good dose of 4200 or Permatex gasket maker around the base of the threads then place a washer with a small enough ID that I had to almost spin it on the threads to get it on. Then tighten the nut down so the washer would force the sealant into the threads and casting. Check occasionally and enjoy the coming summer. It is almost too late in the year to take it in now, but if it is still giving you problems at the end of this season I would wait until the last day of the season and take her in the following weekend. JM2C

That's basically what I did last night, I hope it holds.  I'm going to let the 4200 dry/cure for a few days before I refill it.  Hopefully I've put this to bed, it's cost me sleep for the last 2 months or so.  Thanks for everyone input.

[shawndoggy]

great detective work on the diagnosis

[Ndawg12]

Welp, this fix lasted exactly one season and now it's back and leaking worse.  Thinking I'm pulling the tranny and vdrive this time

[hawaiianstyln]

On 2/21/2017 at 2:55 PM, Ndawg12 said:

Welp, this fix lasted exactly one season and now it's back and leaking worse.  Thinking I'm pulling the tranny and vdrive this time

@Ndawg12 what ever was the outcome of this?  Did you pull your Tranny/Vdrive?  I just noticed this same leak out of the same bolt   I did the same detective work as you and it took me a bit to figure it out with a mirror.  I can't get a wrench on this to save my arse.  I will go to harbor freight and buy some cheapie and cut it in half and try that.  Mine only leaks at that point when i'm running it.  As of now, it's not a major concern because it probably drips maybe 4-6 times over a 4-6 hour period on the water.  My buddy and I were thinking of pulling my Tranny/Vdrive this winter to tackle it out.  We are both handy and resourceful but he definitely can handle this job and already knows the setup since he is a BU owner too.  I'm almost sure it is the seal between the tranny and bellhousing?  If I pull the V and Tranny, at this point I might as well start replacing all the seals in that entire area (shaft seals/vdrive?).  Just not really sure what all I need and buy ahead of time to plan this repair.

ORRRR if @tdelandsheer knows, heck he is only 35 min North of me in Ann Arbor, MI.     Hmmmmmm  

 

[Ndawg12]

On 7/13/2021 at 11:07 AM, hawaiianstyln said:

@Ndawg12 what ever was the outcome of this?  Did you pull your Tranny/Vdrive?  I just noticed this same leak out of the same bolt   I did the same detective work as you and it took me a bit to figure it out with a mirror.  I can't get a wrench on this to save my arse.  I will go to harbor freight and buy some cheapie and cut it in half and try that.  Mine only leaks at that point when i'm running it.  As of now, it's not a major concern because it probably drips maybe 4-6 times over a 4-6 hour period on the water.  My buddy and I were thinking of pulling my Tranny/Vdrive this winter to tackle it out.  We are both handy and resourceful but he definitely can handle this job and already knows the setup since he is a BU owner too.  I'm almost sure it is the seal between the tranny and bellhousing?  If I pull the V and Tranny, at this point I might as well start replacing all the seals in that entire area (shaft seals/vdrive?).  Just not really sure what all I need and buy ahead of time to plan this repair.

ORRRR if @tdelandsheer knows, heck he is only 35 min North of me in Ann Arbor, MI.     Hmmmmmm  

 

I ended up taking it to the best repair shop in the biz,https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremy-killen-82244647.  I believe it was the rear main tranny seal.  Had him upgrade the dampner plate while he had it all out.  

[macdaddy]

Ndawg…my 247 is doing the same as yours did.  Do you remember how much they charged you for the service?  Thanks

mac

[hawaiianstyln]

20 hours ago, macdaddy said:

Ndawg…my 247 is doing the same as yours did.  Do you remember how much they charged you for the service?  Thanks

mac

@macdaddyI see you are south of Lima, bout an hour 45 from me, who's your closest Malibu Dealer.  I'm curious if you get a quote how much.  If it's reasonable and I remove the seat and make things easy, I'd almost deal with paying the labor on this one.  I would have to imagine this is at least $2K+ considering they have to realign everything and lake test.  I could be way low on that.

[macdaddy]

I deal with mid Indiana marine.  Great bunch of people to work with.  I hope it is less than $2k.

[hambone3293]

Don't know what trans/v-drive you have mine is a velvet drive it leaked from day one(yes I know warranty would of covered)was coming from input shaft area I replaced seal and pump o-ring cost $20.00 once out takes 5 minutes its just the removal/installation that takes a while.  Supported engine with hoist trans v-drive light enough to remove with arms.  If yours is a velvet drive I do have pdf of manual.

[tdelandsheer]

@hawaiianstyln Sorry for the slow response we just finished building our house in Whitmore Lake and finally getting on the water! Yah I pulled the tranny and dropped it at a tranny shop in Brighton (charged $519) for a seal rebuild. No problems since. When I had it out I did do the V-drive seal kit myself ($158). Pull the back seat and its a fairly straight forward job to get it in and out. I'll try to keep an eye on this to help you out if you have any questions. Work was done fall 2013 and still holding well.

[hawaiianstyln]

23 minutes ago, tdelandsheer said:

@hawaiianstyln Sorry for the slow response we just finished building our house in Whitmore Lake and finally getting on the water! Yah I pulled the tranny and dropped it at a tranny shop in Brighton (charged $519) for a seal rebuild. No problems since. When I had it out I did do the V-drive seal kit myself ($158). Pull the back seat and its a fairly straight forward job to get it in and out. I'll try to keep an eye on this to help you out if you have any questions. Work was done fall 2013 and still holding well.

thanks for reaching back out!  That's not far from me, easy drive.  I'm probably going to get started on this in the fall.  If I have all that out, I might as well slap a new damper plate in there and rebuild the Vdrive like you did.