Compass on 2015 Dash?

[mikeo]

Well, I purchased this one...

http://www.amazon.com/1575-42MHz-RP-SMA-Active-Antenna-Connector/dp/B00AHQTMWE/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1437424527&sr=1-2&keywords=28dB+LNA+Gain+1575.42MHz+RP-SMA+Male+GPS+Active+Antenna+Aerial+Connector+Cable

It's $10 and PRIME, so I figured not much to lose (free return if it doesn't work).

Please report back on that antenna, it looks like it might be better quality than the one I purchased. I'm very interested in you get WAAS signal (visible in the chartplotter satellite screen) since I'm not picking up any WAAS signal. Tefchnically WAAS is enabled in a GPS receiver, but I can't find a place to enable it yet.

[IXFE]

Why are we trying to solve this problem ourselves... if it even is a problem. I can't seem to get anybody to tell me if my boat should have the compass or not.

Anyway, my boat's at the dealer now anyway so I just asked them, "what's up with my compass??"

We'll see what they say.

[mikeo]

Here are more detailed pictures on the testing I did over the weekend:

firmware version:

No GPS antenna attached, 12" dash display:

No GPS antenna attached, diag screen 7" display:

with GPS antenna attached, 12" dash display:

with GPS antenna attached, diag screen 7" display:

Here's the testing process I used:

1. arrived at the boat, battery switch is off

2. disconnect GPS antenna

3. turn battery switch on

4. turn master power on

5. observe 12" display, check diag screen on 7" display

result: no compass, no GPS data on diag screen; I waited 2 minutes for anything to appear.

6. turn off master power

7. turn off battery switch

8. attach GPS antenna

9. turn on battery switch

10. turn on master power

11. observe 12" display, check diag screen on 7" display

result: no compass initially, no GPS data on diag screen initially. waited 10 seconds; as soon as GPS data appeared on 7" diag screen the compass appeared on the 12" display.

The testing isn't 100% accurate because someone could make a case that the GPS was receiving signal and was "warming up" during the 2 minutes in the first test and the GPS "locked in" during the 10 seconds in the second test. I tried to eliminate this variable by turning off the battery switch between tests. In a brief test (at the beginning of this thread) I removed the GPS antenna from the 7" display while the system was on and I did NOT lose the compass; I wasn't moving and I only left it disconnected for about 30 seconds so I don't qualify that as a "real" test.

My conclusion is that the GPS antenna is required to get the compass to display on the 12" dash system.

edit:

Ok, admit it, how many of you geeks put the GPS coordinates in google maps to figure out where my boat is?

Edited July 20, 2015 by mikeo

[mikeo]

Why are we trying to solve this problem ourselves... if it even is a problem. I can't seem to get anybody to tell me if my boat should have the compass or not.

Anyway, my boat's at the dealer now anyway so I just asked them, "what's up with my compass??"

We'll see what they say.

IXFE: From my experience with Malibu Tech Support they're suffering because they recently moved office locations and are no longer near engineering; In fact, they're in a different building up the street between the main "factory" and the new shipping area. The lack of contact with engineering has removed their ability to ask over a cube wall, at lunch, or "at the water cooler" simple questions like "is the new dash system supposed to show a compass?" Now they have to call or email internally and too much is being lost in the shuffle.

While it IS Malibu's responsibility to be the most knowledgeable about our boats, we're the consumers who are enthusiasts and we make it our business to know. The staff at Malibu deals with everyone who has a question and tech support doesn't sit in a boat investigating every little detail like we do. (maybe there is a good office/cubicle ideas there, I know I wouldn't mind conference calls if I was sitting in my boat all day!) Members of TMC are the 1% of Malibu boat owners; I'll bet at every dealer we go to the mechanic has a story about a TMC member knowing more about that one little detail than they did.

[Cory]

Why are we trying to solve this problem ourselves... if it even is a problem. I can't seem to get anybody to tell me if my boat should have the compass or not.

Anyway, my boat's at the dealer now anyway so I just asked them, "what's up with my compass??"

We'll see what they say.

Cause it's a $10 purchase that only requires me to click a few keys on my keyboard and if it doesn't work it's a free return and UPS & USPS are right by my house. Why not? For $10 I get to play with my boat some more, learn something new about it (or not), and maybe get a compass for fun out of it.

I don't really see much downside.

Edited July 20, 2015 by Cory

[DarkSide]

So chartplotter and maps are two separate options?

I remember that maps (the SD card) was an option that I didn't choose. But I don't remember there being a chartplotter option.

Kind of the same options, but you have to buy the "data card" separately. Here is the option call out from mine. The maps to use navigation is the navtronics hot maps

[justgary]

Mikeo -

Hot swapping that GPS antenna should not cause any problems at all if you ever have a hankering to do it. No need to turn anything off or kill the master power.

[thtrog]

I would think with GPS speed control one puck is enough. Like I posted, before the update my compass worked.

Edited July 21, 2015 by thtrog

[mikeo]

Mikeo -

Hot swapping that GPS antenna should not cause any problems at all if you ever have a hankering to do it. No need to turn anything off or kill the master power.

I agree, hot swapping the antenna shouldn't matter since it's not on the CAN bus. The point of me doing the full shutdown and removing power during the detailed test above was to make sure there wasn't any possible data still in the system and doing as much of a "cold boot" on the GPS as I could. Most modern GPS units cache data on their last known location so they can get a signal lock faster by knowing which satellites are overhead.

[mikeo]

I would think with GPS speed control one puck is enough. Like I posted, before the update my compass worked.

What version of firmware did you have before? If we can call out the specific versions and validate the difference then we can lobby Malibu and Medallion to restore the functionality.

I'm nit saying you're wrong, but we need evidence (pictures) to show that something was taken away in irder to attempt to get it restored.

[thtrog]

What version of firmware did you have before? If we can call out the specific versions and validate the difference then we can lobby Malibu and Medallion to restore the functionality.

I'm nit saying you're wrong, but we need evidence (pictures) to show that something was taken away in irder to attempt to get it restored.

I don't take it that way, didn't even realize compass was gone until this thread. I know nothing else was changed, only warranty I've had was to update the RF BT dongle. Here's a pic before I uploaded the new firmware. FYI - I've not asked my dealer about this and pretty sure GPS was in Maps was active before.

[IXFE]

I verified with my dealer today (who verified with Malibu) that you don't get the compass from the factory unless you upgrade to the "maps" option which includes both an antenna and the SD card.

Now if you fellas crack the code with a $10 antenna, that's some sweet sauce!

[mikeo]

I verified with my dealer today (who verified with Malibu) that you don't get the compass from the factory unless you upgrade to the "maps" option which includes both an antenna and the SD card.

Now if you fellas crack the code with a $10 antenna, that's some sweet sauce!

but as thtrog points out: if we had it before hiw/why did they take it away?

Now that we know what firmware enables the compass, now we need to verify the version of the 7" computer; I know of two versions and the "old" version didn't have a place to screw in the GPS antenna. I'll see if I can find a picture of the old version, and we need to find someone who hasn't updated their firmware so we can nake a case to Malibu.

[Cory]

If the $10 antenna arriving at my house tomorrow by 8pm works--who cares about the how/when/where/why. I just want my simple compass, so I know which direction is north.

[thtrog]

I verified with my dealer today (who verified with Malibu) that you don't get the compass from the factory unless you upgrade to the "maps" option which includes both an antenna and the SD card.

Now if you fellas crack the code with a $10 antenna, that's some sweet sauce!

I'm going to run it by my service mgr to see what response they get. Navigation has been included with GPS speed control the last two years, purchasing the maps card was optional. Anywho, it did work on my boat with the first gen display and firmware. Here's another pic to prove it...

Still interested to see what your antenna does and I'll update others on my response.

[IXFE]

I'm going to run it by my service mgr to see what response they get. Navigation has been included with GPS speed control the last two years, purchasing the maps card was optional. Anywho, it did work on my boat with the first gen display and firmware. Here's another pic to prove it...

Still interested to see what your antenna does and I'll update others on my response.

Here's my guess... those of us who had early 2015 builds had the compass because our Viper II hardware had the antenna on it. Then we all rushed down to our dealers to get new Viper II hardware because we wanted the improved BT module. I'm thinking the new Viper II modules don't have the GPS antenna which is why we lost the compass. Perhaps it was intentional by Malibu.

[thtrog]

I was not one of those and only had the updated RF BT replaced, it's great! I do expect the new firmware only supports the new Viper II, I'll see what reaponse I get.

[Cory]

It worked! I have a compass. From inside my garage, I pick up 12 satellites. I do not appear to have a WAAS signal, at least not from in the garage.

How much is a SD card with map data on it? Can I purchase one on Amazon for cheap? Any recommendations of one for the PNW?

Edited July 23, 2015 by Cory

[DarkSide]

Cory, maps you want is hot maps premium by Navtronics. Do not buy the more expensive platinum version it has more features but will not work.

[Cory]

Cory, maps you want is hot maps premium by Navtronics. Do not buy the more expensive platinum version it has more features but will not work.

That's $140 for the west on Amazon. I'd spend $75, but $140 is a little steep for a novelty item.

[DarkSide]

On a side note y'all are getting different info then I got. I was told the zero off navigation chartplotter is how you get maps, the card is not included and you have to buy it separately. It is $140 on Amazon prime. The version came straight from the tech support group while I was at the factory.

This is how I ordered mine, I hope I didn't pay $300 bucks for just an antenna. That would suck.

[DarkSide]

That's $140 for the west on Amazon. I'd spend $75, but $140 is a little steep for a novelty item.

Especially if you are not 100% positive it will work. I suspect it will not, you probably need the Navtronics software to be able to read the map files

[Cory]

This GPS stuff is one big black box. Not enough info out there... Mikeo what say you?

Anyone wanna send me a backup copy of their SD card for safe keeping?

[mikeo]

This GPS stuff is one big black box. Not enough info out there... Mikeo what say you?

Anyone wanna send me a backup copy of their SD card for safe keeping?

I think the earlier comment that the early ViperII units had an antenna built in and therefore they were receiving GPS signal is accurate, but since I don't have a "gen 1" ViperII I can't verify that. I do think I know where there is a gen I ViperII that I can look at, so I'll have to check on that tomorrow.

I made a few calls to both Malibu and Medallion trying to get to the bottom of the chartplotter question while I was waiting for my boat to ship across the country and here's what I found out:

1. As DarkSide has pointed out only Navionics HotMaps Premium will work with the chartplotter; Platinum will NOT

2. The Navionics software is pre-loaded in the 7" computer, it just needs a data card to show anything at a smaller scale than 150 mi.

3. I was told by Malibu that the chartplotter option only includes the antenna being installed at the factory; I don't know where/how but I didn't want them drilling any more holes in my boat.

4. The dealer is responsible for supplying the correct SD card (region), installing it, and verifying functionality.*

5. Navionics provides software and test data (cards) to Medallion, but it's up to Medallion to integrate and troubleshoot the software. Navionics couldn't explain to me who did or how they did the software integration with Medallion since they claim they don't produce a software stack that runs on windows. (It's been covered before, but the 7" display is a windows computer)

5. I'm paranoid about losing original/only copies of data and software, so I made a copy of the Navionics SD card according to the backup instructions provided by Navionics. The backup card didn't work in the boat, but the OEM card does. I have an alternate backup to restore the OEM card that I'm not disclosing since it's only available to registered Navionics card owners.**

6. The Navionics charts are nice, but not necessary and I find they get in the way since they take over the 7" screen. I have an iPad mini mounted above the 7" and use MotionX GPS HD with the USGS maps and that provides chart plotting data for one of the two primary areas I operate in. I also get my music and a bunch of "other stuff" by having the iPad in the boat. This leaves the 7" display free to operate switches, etc.

* apparently Malibu has a section of the order for the local dealer to supply some items that are included with the boat, the idea being that the rules/regulations are regional and some items may be locale specific. For example: some life preserves, thowable life preserver, quantity and type of fire extinguisher, etc. are different depending on local/state laws. Instead of Malibu trying to figure this out, they task the dealers with dealing with it. There are very few region specific options that aren't safety gear included with the boat, but the chartplotter maps card is one of them.

** Since I can't verify that you own a Navionics card, and I want to keep the online backup I have working I'm not disclosing how to make backups. Call Navionics tech support and they'll verify you as a registered customer and then tell you how to make a backup.

Final thoughts: for $10 retail Malibu should just put the GPS antenna in the boats, it's "cheap" not to. The $10 antenna may not be the one Medallion sells or recommends, but now we know it works. I'm going to let my dealer know the answer to the riddle and I'll bet they start putting the $10 antenna in for their customers. The chartplotter maps are nice but aren't worth it unless you're going somewhere confusing you've never been before (NorCal delta or other river system). You CAN "roll your own" if you didn't get the chartplotter or GPS option when you ordered your boat (or if you bought one from dealer stock), get the $10 antenna to get the compass, and get the $140 Navionics card to get the maps.

[Cory]

Oh well. I guess I'll have to do without the maps. At least I know which direction I'm heading now. Can I record a path without the map data (basically just a line on a blank screen), then retrace that line to get home in the dark?