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Endodoc

What do I change first? The board, the setup, or Myself

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Endodoc

New to wakesurfing and tow boats in general. Having a hard time getting enough push off the wave to get slack in the rope for more than 2-3 seconds. First the setup. 2015 LSV 23 with MLS all full. Speed anywhere from 10.0 to 11.2. Port side wave. Prob 400lbs of people ballast. The board is a Liquid Force Fish 5.6. I'm a 6'0 210 lb guy. Have moved my feet all over the board. Front foot has toes on the rail and my weight so far forward that the nose of the board is submarining. Still can only build up speed when I surf down the wave rather than across it. A more experienced friend rode the board this weekend and had to constantly work to stay in the pocket and still couldn't do it for long. Several weeks ago I surfed behind another 2015 LSV at Freedom Wake Park in Orlando. Setup was a bit different with 750's in the lockers and a 750 up front, but on a Nalu Carbon. With that I was getting so much push, that I kept almost running into the swim platform. So I guess the question is, what should I change first, the board, add ballast, or both? Also shouldn't I be able to surf behind this boat with factory setup?

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racer808

You need ballast. That board surfs fine, I have it & ride it ropeless all day long. Do you have wedge down? I'm poor so I only have the manual wedge, but there is no push unless I have it down. Also, you need be closer to toe edge but not all the way. I have found putting majority of my weight on my front big toe is what made all the difference in learning to ride ropeless.

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Endodoc

Yes, have tried wedge all over as well. Factory preset is 3 bars down from stow. Have tried it there and every incremental click up and down for 2 bars. Tried the big toe trick this weekend and I read that on here as well. Its the closest I've come to riding ropeless but still no dice.

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racer808

Well, I run 1100 rear locker, 600 center, 550 bow, wedge down & about 500 non surf side locker with my home made surf gate deployed. Wave is decent. Gets even better with another 300 pounds on the surf side seats but I only get that when I have people, but now I have an extra sac so gonna see how it goes here in a week or two when I can finally get on the water.

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pawter1970

You need to add weight in the back lockers, at least 750lbs bags so 2 sacs. Than I would take some weight off the front bow to start dialing the wake and take it from there.

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wakedncsu

I agree. You need more ballast.

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Fman

The Wakemaker 850's are a nice setup for your LSV, they are custom fit for your locker so you can also retain the storage bins. They also have 1" ports that will work good for you with the factory PnP. I agree with others, you need some rear locker weight. My bet would be with larger bags in the lockers, hard tanks full, wedge down and a couple people in the bow you will be surfing ropeless with no problems. Bunji on this forum has a 2015 LSV, he is running 900's in rear lockers, hard tanks full, 200 lbs of lead in bow, with NO wedge and his wave looks great... I would also give that recipe a try.

http://www.wakemakers.com/?gclid=Cj0KEQjw7_mrBRDH4Y2UjLHEmfcBEiQA8OTHf5dGJv4UP4womp5sRrqMnd26wAh4NHHt7aCR2Y5zq30aAok28P8HAQ

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Endodoc

Looks like everyone agrees. Ballast. Was leaning toward the Ronix PnP 550's because they were designed for this boat. Everyone think larger? Want to keep the rear storage bins and don't want to modify (reinforce) the engine panels.

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leje0306

I was having the same problem with a 14 LSV with 750's in the lockers. I tried brining the wedge up two clicks and it gave me the push I needed to go ropeless. However, the wake wasn't as clean because water flows over the surf gate and the boat basically does a wheelie across the lake. I'm going to add some midship or bow weight, as well as up the speed from 10.6 to see if I can clean it up.

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Stevo

i run the sump 900's with no problems so far, they don't get 100% full based on the shape of the locker vs bag

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DocPhil

To quote the great Allen Iverson, I think you need "PRACTICE!"

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shawndoggy

with 750s in the back that boat will make a fine wave. Even with the 550s it'll probably be acceptable.

"factory setup" needs to include plug and play bags. If you don't have them you have a less than optimal setup.

This is a first timer from yesterday with wedge all the way down and 750s. Speed was around 12.

Edited by shawndoggy

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Endodoc

To quote the great Allen Iverson, I think you need "PRACTICE!"

There is NO doubt there. I'm a total newb for sure and need hours practice. Just got so much push off the other LSV that I rode behind (with additional ballast and different board). Couldn't stay in the pocket with that setup, was always too much gas or too much brake. With my current setup its almost like there is no pocket, no matter how much gas I give it she just won't go. My 10 yr old son has no problem though. The benefits of being light i guess.

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Endodoc

with 750s in the back that boat will make a fine wave. Even with the 550s it'll probably be acceptable.

"factory setup" needs to include plug and play bags. If you don't have them you have a less than optimal setup.

This is a first timer from yesterday with wedge all the way down and 750s. Speed was around 12.

Yep. Cant get near that much slack in the rope for that long. Not going near that fast either. 11.2 has been about the max.

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DAI

I had 550s last (for sale this year . . Hint - hint) and was able to ride ropeless 2nd time trying (full MLS and wedge 2 clicks up). If you decide to go with the wakemakers custom bags (830s), which I'm running this year, buy the fly high 1,000# bow bag with it. Based on my experience you end up with too much rear weight and need more offseting bow weight. . . Unless the PW2 makes a difference (IDK).

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Endodoc

I had 550s last (for sale this year . . Hint - hint) and was able to ride ropeless 2nd time trying (full MLS and wedge 2 clicks up). If you decide to go with the wakemakers custom bags (830s), which I'm running this year, buy the fly high 1,000# bow bag with it. Based on my experience you end up with too much rear weight and need more offseting bow weight. . . Unless the PW2 makes a difference (IDK).

PW2 should help in adjusting bow rise and lengthen the wave some but in doing this will reduce the downforce (ballast effect) it has on the stern. We often have people ballast up front (not 1K worth) but still took a good bit of water over the nose a few times. Enough to nearly ruin my wife's new iPhone *shoots lasers out of eyes* so I'm hesitant about adding bow ballast right now. Not going with the 550's. Going 750-900, just haven't decided yet.

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DAI

PW2 should help in adjusting bow rise and lengthen the wave some but in doing this will reduce the downforce (ballast effect) it has on the stern. We often have people ballast up front (not 1K worth) but still took a good bit of water over the nose a few times. Enough to nearly ruin my wife's new iPhone *shoots lasers out of eyes* so I'm hesitant about adding bow ballast right now. Not going with the 550's. Going 750-900, just haven't decided yet.

That's a good call on the heavier rear ballast. Edited by DAI

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DocPhil

PW2 should help in adjusting bow rise and lengthen the wave some but in doing this will reduce the downforce (ballast effect) it has on the stern. We often have people ballast up front (not 1K worth) but still took a good bit of water over the nose a few times. Enough to nearly ruin my wife's new iPhone *shoots lasers out of eyes* so I'm hesitant about adding bow ballast right now. Not going with the 550's. Going 750-900, just haven't decided yet.

I wouldn't bother with 900s. From what I understand the custom sacs only fill 830 lbs and those are cut to fit those lockers exactly

I bet you wouldn't get much more in the 750s than the 550s. Probably less than 100 pounds.

550s might not be a bad choice. If it were me, I would probably run 750s or custom sacs

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Endodoc

Think I am going 750's for the time being. Dealer is headed out to replace my Power Button (had bad connection and engine/electronics would just die if you hit the smallest bump) and had the 750's in stock. So we shall see what we see.

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jb 156

I would also run some bow weight at least 400-600lbs.

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shawndoggy

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Endodoc

That's actually a good sign. When you start yo-yo-ing like that it means you've figured out what to do.........but you're reacting late.........and overcompensating. All you need to do now is figure out how to make those speed adjustments sooner......and more subtly. You're closer than you know to riding as long as you want ropeless!

So, there was nothing wrong with that wave. It was probably set up well. You were just yo-yo-ing because of your inexperience. Betcha you're riding ropeless within 2 days of getting that additional ballast in your boat. Good luck man.

Yes. That boat was set up well. I'm trying to get something similar. Was just a bit surprised that I couldn't get slack with a stock setup (MLS full, PW2 3 clicks down from stow, etc.). If I could have yo-yo'd I would have been happy, thats rider error and I can correct that with practice. Even with the log I'm riding now I hope the extra ballast will help me go ropeless. We shall see this weekend I hope.

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Jbort

stock does not get it done for surfing by big guys. we have new 2015 LSV 23 and love it. here is our setup which is good sized since we like big: 1,000 lb ea in rear lockers via plug n play, 200 lbs lead in back, all factory tanks full, 400 lb ballast bag up front, 200 lbs lead upfront, PW2 is 2 or 3, speed is 10.8 to 11.2 mph depending on rider - this wave is wonderful. i go 255 and have big size sweet spot.

The LF Fish board is average and not helping ( to be blunt its slow). Good beginner board but we have seen limited success w bigger guys several times even on big waves. Where are you? if near Atlanta, we got some boards to try out. Get some buddies w different boards-try some. Good luck.

I have two other buddies w even bigger setups and they use more weight upfront so my current conclusion is this boat really likes the whole boat to be deeper in the water and not just back loaded like others. one guys has 1,000 lbs upfront-whew.

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jimmyaussie

I have a 2014 vtx can surf no problem with factory surf setting I do run a balast bag from wakemakers under front seats I pretty much keep this full all the time and that is with wife and two kids

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