Using Viper II as Bluetooth Source for Aftermarket EQ

[Cory]

At the end of the day, a boat actually has a common ground. So, all things are really sharing that same ground. But, with dual batteries, its easy for audio components to "see" a different positive voltage reference. This is what can cause whats commonly called a ground loop. No matter the source, the potential remains.

Good luck with the noise and a reliable wireless source.

There is nothing magical about the ground rail vs the positive rail. The voltage between these two potentials (i.e., 12 V) varies throughout your boat because of fluctuations in the potential of either rail. Both potentials will vary at any given point throughout your boat's electrical system based upon the instant current load and path resistance back to the respective battery terminal (positive or negative). In other words, the ground rail is not at a constant potential throughout your boat and neither is the positive rail and the combined effect leads to a fluctuating VOLTAGE between the potentials of these two rails throughout your boat. Ground migrates up and positive migrates down due to current and resistance in either path.

[Cory]

At the end of the day, a boat actually has a common ground. So, all things are really sharing that same ground. But, with dual batteries, its easy for audio components to "see" a different positive voltage reference. This is what can cause whats commonly called a ground loop. No matter the source, the potential remains.

Good luck with the noise and a reliable wireless source.

Yes, running your stereo off one battery and other electronics (e.g., MTC or Maliview) off another isolated battery certainly can lead to a ground loop when you connect the Maliview to control the HU. But this can still happen even with everything powered off of a single battery since different components have different resistive paths and different current load paths back to that same battery. In other words, the stereo right next to the battery may be seeing 12.2V from the battery since it is close and has big low resistance wires connecting to the battery, but the Maliview/MTC may only be seeing 12V since they are further away, down a different set of wires that may be more resistive.

[pkh]

I'm definitely out of my league in trying to diagnose it. Bill from Exile pointed out it probably had a different grounding than the rest of the stereo, but I may have misunderstood that.

Anyway, its noisy, creates the same high pitch hum that I heard when I had cheap cables routed near power cables and what not. Now I got that I got that to go away, this Bluetooth source is my last issue.

I guess I could go back to turning gains down on my amp but that seems like masking the problem rather than solving it.

[CJAY]

Where is the viper module located in the boat? i was in my boat this morning looking at the connections and couldn't find it. The BT dongle connection on the RFX-6000 didn't have anything plugged into it

[Cory]

Where is the viper module located in the boat? i was in my boat this morning looking at the connections and couldn't find it. The BT dongle connection on the RFX-6000 didn't have anything plugged into it

Viper module is integrated with the MTC (I think). If the build date of your boat is late enough, then you probably have the updated viper module and I'm guessing they stopped attaching the RF BT unit. It sounds that the RF BT module was a stop gap until they got the viper II updated. That's my guess anyway...

[CJAY]

Viper module is integrated with the MTC (I think). If the build date of your boat is late enough, then you probably have the updated viper module and I'm guessing they stopped attaching the RF BT unit. It sounds that the RF BT module was a stop gap until they got the viper II updated. That's my guess anyway...

Good, because I already see major issues starting my stereo install next week when I get the boat home.... Dealer already took out the amp board so I couldn't find any BT when I turned the boat on either, worried me.

[pkh]

Good, because I already see major issues starting my stereo install next week when I get the boat home.... Dealer already took out the amp board so I couldn't find any BT when I turned the boat on either, worried me.

For the Viper II (MTC Bluetooth) - you may need to turn it on using the settings in the MTC. It also did not come enabled in the original boat firmware mine had so you will want to make sure you have that update.

Edited March 19, 2015 by pkh

[pkh]

I just ordered one of these: http://audioengineusa.com/Store/B1-Bluetooth-Music-Receiver

Decided it was time to stop messing around!

[Wakesetter67]

Am I missing something, What is all the hype about Blue tooth? I have always use a direct plug into my I phone or I pod, And if we wanted to play someone else I phone list we just plugged that in, What are the advantage of having one?

[pkh]

Plugging in definitely simplifies the tech bit a lot.

I just like being able to have the phone free of cables, one less thing to trip over, plug-in, etc.. Especially nice if you want to control the music from anywhere in the boat. If I never had it I probably wouldn't miss it so much, but my last boat had it and I'd really like it back!

[David]

I agree with MLAs statement about ground and supply loops. Pertaining to noise let me put a finer point on it.

The audio shield grounds that connect audio component to audio component are 'above ground' and generally reference to the boat's true ground at one end of the signal path, which is likely at the source electronics. And sometimes you have relationships between audio components that are less than optimum so the audio shield ground, although 'above ground', offers a path to circumvent the voltage differential. Thus current flows down the shield ground which introduces noise into the signal path.

So you do try to manage as small of a resistance difference between all supply and ground of components in the signal path to maintain a consistent voltage.

But many of the exterior source modules are just not suitable for this application. Their signal ground may be common to the power supply ground and offer an alternate ground path. Enter the noise. Many types of noise are modulating the boat power supply at any time. They are just not suppose to find their way into the signal path.

Edited March 19, 2015 by David

[IXFE]

I just ordered one of these: http://audioengineusa.com/Store/B1-Bluetooth-Music-Receiver

Decided it was time to stop messing around!

Looks promising, Phil.

Are you going to plug the RCA's straight into the ZLD? If so, are you going to do it in place of the AUX input or in place of the RFX6000 input?

I suppose you could run it into the RFX6000 itself, but I doubt that's your plan, right?

Also, where are you going to mount it and how are you going to run power to it?

[pkh]

Going to run straight into back of ZLD main input, I will keep aux input for headphone jack cable.

For power I figure wire a USB port to the same power coming over for ZLD.

Then I am thinking some 3M Velcro tape should hold it in place under dash.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wakesetter67]

Plugging in definitely simplifies the tech bit a lot.

I just like being able to have the phone free of cables, one less thing to trip over, plug-in, etc.. Especially nice if you want to control the music from anywhere in the boat. If I never had it I probably wouldn't miss it so much, but my last boat had it and I'd really like it back!

That makes sense, I will Have BLA Look into it when we do my install!!

[Cory]

So, I picked up a short 5" usb iphone cable so that I can keep my iphone plugged in and charging when bluetooth streaming music and the phone is in the dash cradle. It works great. I haven't tried it with the engine running, but without the engine running there was no perceptible noise. Better yet, it keeps the iphone screen turned ON all the time so you don't have to swipe and punch in a code or do the fingerprint thing. In essence it adds an additional user interface for controlling music on the dash.

[pkh]

So, I picked up a short 5" usb iphone cable so that I can keep my iphone plugged in and charging when bluetooth streaming music and the phone is in the dash cradle. It works great. I haven't tried it with the engine running, but without the engine running there was no perceptible noise. Better yet, it keeps the iphone screen turned ON all the time so you don't have to swipe and punch in a code or do the fingerprint thing. In essence it adds an additional user interface for controlling music on the dash.

I did the same Cory - it does create a noise issue if you are plugged in with a headphone jack cable and the charge cable at the same time but not if using Bluetooth. Another reason why its nice to have some kind of wireless setup.

YRMV!

Edited March 19, 2015 by pkh

[Cory]

I did the same Cory - it does create a noise issue if you are plugged in with a headphone jack cable and the charge cable at the same time but not if using Bluetooth. Another reason why its nice to have some kind of wireless setup.

YRMV!

That makes sense cause the AUX cable creates a return path for a ground loop. The wireless signal cannot provide a return path for a ground loop.

After I purchased my cable, I found this guy online. I think I wanna get this cable also...

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FZM2VTG/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

[pkh]

I just ordered one of these: http://audioengineusa.com/Store/B1-Bluetooth-Music-Receiver

Decided it was time to stop messing around!

This arrived today, haven't had chance to test it in boat yet but I plugged it into some speakers, paired easy, sounded awesome, and I could still stream music from the other side of the house. That's a lot better than the 8 feet I can get with the factory Bluetooth!

[pkh]

Glad you guys are posting this info - I have been having all of the same issues with my 22vlx since Nov. Honestly, my $139 ION from Costco sounds better than the factory system from Malibu with 4 rev8's.

The most aggravating thing is that it's been to the dealer for an update, still sounds like crap. and then they explain I should use viper2, been then the knob won't work which probably means the transon remote too.

Next step for me is an audio control 4.1 going in in Monday. This will give me the option me to bypass the entire head unit. While not ideal it will good to isolate the the problem. And it worked great on my last boat.

After that I want to rewire the to physcially plug in near the phone holder. I really want the knob and transom remote to work, and don't mind a short cable near the phone holder.

With all the equipment it should sound great.

Hey Matt - having trouble following - are you planning on bypassing factory black box or moving it to under the helm?

I agree missing the factory controls stinks, but unless you plug in you won't get them with Bluetooth anyway (just volume.)

Edited March 22, 2015 by pkh

[mattpoland]

The 4.1 has a button in it that lets you toggle from bypassing the factory unit using the aux on the 4.1 and using the input from the head unit.

[pkh]

I thought about that but I found that noise issues carried over into the EQ even when the factory system was not on.

[arctic4wd]

On 3/17/2015 at 6:44 PM, pkh said:

Update: I've given up on the Viper II Bluetooth source, with engine on its too noisy for my taste. My guess is its grounded differently than the rest of the stereo components so its probably a ground loop issue, but I really don't know.

I'm going to work on getting my AirEnabler wired up under the dash and in the meantime will do direct plug in.

Good news is I finally think I nixed my engine noise issues with some better cables and smarter routing.

 I know this was 4 years ago...

I am having the same issue with engine noise in the Viper II Bluetooth connection. None of the other connections to the fosgate black box are noisey. Did anyone figure out a way to get the noise cleaned up in the MTC? I would prefer to keep using it if possible becuase of the integration with the rest of the system.

[chrisLewis]

Hi I have a 2018 misty harbor tri with a Medallion Viper 2 system. I see no usb port. It says it has bluetooth but does not show how to make it visible to pair. Anyone have any ideas?

[MLA]

4 hours ago, chrisLewis said:

Hi I have a 2018 misty harbor tri with a Medallion Viper 2 system. I see no usb port. It says it has bluetooth but does not show how to make it visible to pair. Anyone have any ideas?

IIRC, its visible all the time when no device is connected.