Perfect wakeboat tow rig might be the 2016 Titan XD

[85 Barefoot]

OK I'll say it....

that thing is hideous.

A wannabe denali HD grill, tundra cab, and wanna be raptor suspension/tire package. And a miniature mirror.

[Falko]

I don't think it looks worse/better than any other of the big "Fist in the wind" truck designs out there today. They're all bloated and blocky.

As far as trucks go, I like it.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Falko

[ibelonginprison]

I'm not a fan of anything stock, really. But aftermarket wise, I get that thing on some 35's with an aggressive offset wheel, some lights and hefty winch bumper should help out a lllllot.

The plus side to a turbo diesel over a gas burner is to get more power.... you just crank the boost and fuel.

If it's anything like the other Cummins, it probably takes next to nothing to get over 650+ tq with that thing.

[wakesetter8796]

I am liking the powetrain, but not the exterior! The bright side is the mileage can't be any worse than the current titan.

[jjackkrash]

I'm not a fan of anything stock, really. But aftermarket wise, I get that thing on some 35's with an aggressive offset wheel, some lights and hefty winch bumper should help out a lllllot.

The plus side to a turbo diesel over a gas burner is to get more power.... you just crank the boost and fuel.

If it's anything like the other Cummins, it probably takes next to nothing to get over 650+ tq with that thing.

I'm always leery of just jacking the horsepower/torque. More torque especially means more stress on everything more often. It seems like it could lead to premature wear on lots of other components if they are not designed to handle it.

[RyanB]

My basic point is diesel's aren't generally cheaper too own, at least as far as tow vehicles go. So only get one if it is better for your application. There's a big up-charge for the engine and, like you pointed out, the fuel is more expensive. And I'd agree I'd probably take a Tundra and its 400HP/400 foot pounds of torque over that smaller diesel. But I would not take a Tundra over my Duramax for towing my 10-11k pound travel trailer. Not a chance.

I think we mostly agree. The up-charge in any of the diesels (with the exception of the 6.0) comes back in resale. And the daily costs aren't really that terrible IMO.

I just think that with current fuel prices, this is a bad time to launch a diesel, especially one that will likely not out pull competitive gassers, and may not even offer better fuel economy.

And gassers have made a lot of progress. Over on rv.net, there is a guy that got a new 2500 RAM with the 6.4, and did a comparison vs a 2014 6.7 CTD pulling a 15,000 pound 5er. He put his results up on youtube, but the moral of the story is that acceleration and hill climbs (not at elevation) were actually equal.

And, for the record, I have owned diesel trucks going back to 1999. I am very happy with my 2012 CTD, and it pulls my 32' fifthwheel and my boat (tandem) very well. If I were buying new right now, I would stay with a diesel. But if I were not towing often, and only towing less than 10,000 pounds, I would likely go back to gas.

Either way, I am happy that Nissan came out with this diesel. More options for the consumer is a good thing.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[AJWest]

I'm game for a new player in the diesel game, especially in the new 1/2 ton-ish class of diesels. I currently have a 5.9L cummins in an '07 Dodge 2500 Mega Cab. I keep my trucks for 300,000 miles and is my daily driver in town (I love the comments from the guys who say or think 3/4 or 1 tons tons are a pain as a daily driver...turn in your guy card). Hope to see this Titan and Toyota adding competition in this class and maybe prices could possibly come down in a couple years. The whole argument about buying gas vs diesel and maintenance costs...blah blah blah. Seriously? Kind of comical to read these comments from people who have $85K-$125K boats.

[Falko]

Not following the line of thought that the current gas engines making 400 or so lbft, probably at 4-4500 revs, is going to compete towing wise with a 560 lbft engine doing it around 2500. Even with 27 speed transmissions on the gassers, you are still running way up in revs only to fall 40% short on torque. I think towing wise this thing is going to smoke the gasser competition.

[formulaben]

You might want to take a close look at the diesel Tundras coming out in 2016. Supposed to be very impressive performance and mileage wise....

Any chance they'll also offer this diesel in the Sequoia or FJ Cruiser?

[oldjeep]

Not following the line of thought that the current gas engines making 400 or so lbft, probably at 4-4500 revs, is going to compete towing wise with a 560 lbft engine doing it around 2500. Even with 27 speed transmissions on the gassers, you are still running way up in revs only to fall 40% short on torque. I think towing wise this thing is going to smoke the gasser competition.

Depends on what you are towing. If it is a 5000lb boat - who cares unless you are doing towing drag racing. Its not like we are talking about towing 18K equipment trailers with a 1/2 ton.

[Falko]

I missed the fine print stipulations. Thank you for clarifying.

[oldjeep]

I missed the fine print stipulations. Thank you for clarifying.

No problem, just makes me giggle when friends are talking about how much power this or that has and how much better it is than this other thing when the biggest thing they tow is a utility trailer.

[rennis]

That is one homely looking truck. Love the idea, not a fan of the execution.

Pleeeeeese put a diesel in the Tundra, all yee faithful at Toyota!!

[jjackkrash]

Depends on what you are towing. If it is a 5000lb boat - who cares unless you are doing towing drag racing. Its not like we are talking about towing 18K equipment trailers with a 1/2 ton.

Exactly. I've towed 6-7k loads over passes with a Tundra holding 70-80 mph no problem without gear hunting.

Also, even though torque is important, HP matters on hills as well to hold speed, and 400 is better than 300.

Finally, gas engines make their HP and Torque at higher RPMs; that is just a fact of life. If you just don't like RPMs, or just want a diesel and don't mind paying a significant up-charge, or are concerned with unloaded fuel economy even if the costs doesn't justify it, or want an engine that is built to last longer than a gasser, then diesel is a good way to go. You won't get any arguments from me that there are lots of good reasons to buy a diesel.

[UWSkier]

That is one homely looking truck. Love the idea, not a fan of the execution.

Pleeeeeese put a diesel in the Tundra, all yee faithful at Toyota!!

Supposedly the Tundra is getting this same Cummins mill at some point... but Toyota's current design language (the refreshed Taco for instance) suggest the new Tundra will be far uglier than this Nissan... I personally like the black Titan posted above better than any Tundra out there currently.

[Lance B. Johnson]

I would have to agree. That truck above looks better than the new Tundra IMHO.

[Falko]

Horsepower is simply a function of torque and rpm. Up the torque or the rpm and you get more hp. One of the main reasons gas engines can show more hp, they can rev higher. Since hp is work measured, yes, they will do more work but at the sacrifice of more wear on the engine. So it really comes down to what you value, hence why they make black AND white trucks.

[rennis]

Supposedly the Tundra is getting this same Cummins mill at some point... but Toyota's current design language (the refreshed Taco for instance) suggest the new Tundra will be far uglier than this Nissan... I personally like the black Titan posted above better than any Tundra out there currently.

Gonna have to agree to disagree on the styling. Current Tundra is a good looking truck. A bit dated since the bones have been around for damn near 10 years, but still a good looking rig. (I am admittedly biased having owned one, however.)

I have not seen the Tundra renderings for the 3rd generation, but if it looks like that Titan, I'll be upset.

[pook77]

I have the 2013 Tundra and for the most part I like its styling better than the current gen. I saw one of these orange TRD PROs at the dealer while they did my oil change yesterday and it has me reconsidering. Get rid of all that chrome and black out the grill and wheels and they look pretty good imo. Ditch the oval style toyota badge too, which is a plus. And.... it would match my boat better

Edited January 15, 2015 by pook77

[UWSkier]

Nissan and Toyota need to work on fuel economy first IMO. The Tundra and Titan both suck way more gas these days than the comparable domestics. I get about 16-17 Hwy in my Titan. My friend with a Tundra Platinum gets about the same or less. My old man has a '14 Sierra and pulls 21 Hwy and my brother gets 20 with his F150. All quad cab, 4x4s.

[rennis]

Nissan and Toyota need to work on fuel economy first IMO. The Tundra and Titan both suck way more gas these days than the comparable domestics. I get about 16-17 Hwy in my Titan. My friend with a Tundra Platinum gets about the same or less. My old man has a '14 Sierra and pulls 21 Hwy and my brother gets 20 with his F150. All quad cab, 4x4s.

Agreed. Real world economy in a Tundra is terrible. Mine was leveled and had 295 Nittos (so admittedly not gas friendly) and averaged about 11mpg.

[Tims]

Horsepower is simply a function of torque and rpm. Up the torque or the rpm and you get more hp. One of the main reasons gas engines can show more hp, they can rev higher. Since hp is work measured, yes, they will do more work but at the sacrifice of more wear on the engine. So it really comes down to what you value, hence why they make black AND white trucks.

It's myth that high RPM's engines wear out faster. Many diesels are designed around long strokes which create higher piston speed at any given RPM. Engine technology and design are the main reason for longer engine life and modern light duty diesels will wear out as quick as a modern gasser.

If your 6 cylinder diesel is making 600 pound feet of torque at 2000 rpm the EGT's will be close to max (lots of heat!!!!) and piston speed will be high. While on the other hand, the N/A v8 gasser at 4500rpm is probably making less heat and close to the same piston speed.

Bottom line, more torque and hp = more heat. Whatever motor can get rid of that heat the most efficiency and/or has materials build to handle it has a better chance of lasting longer, Does not matter if it is gas or diesel fuel.

[Falko]

That's only piston speed though. Bearing speed at the crank mains and cam is proportional to engine speed (albeit cam half). And the valve speed has to do with rpms as well, and the faster the valves are moving the more guide wear and more valve stretch occurs. I would agree modern engines last longer, but I will take a lower rpm power engine over that of a higher one.

[Lance B. Johnson]

Agreed. Real world economy in a Tundra is terrible. Mine was leveled and had 295 Nittos (so admittedly not gas friendly) and averaged about 11mpg.

I know it. I don't even want to know what my mileage was coming back from Montana bucking the head winds for a good part of it.

[Tims]

That's only piston speed though. Bearing speed at the crank mains and cam is proportional to engine speed (albeit cam half). And the valve speed has to do with rpms as well, and the faster the valves are moving the more guide wear and more valve stretch occurs. I would agree modern engines last longer, but I will take a lower rpm power engine over that of a higher one.

Bearing speed does not have impact on wear nearly as much wear as load. Same thing with valve train wear. What will erode or crack a valve seat quicker? A low rpm diesel running at 1600 EGT or a high rpm gas engine running 1100? I like low RPM high torque diesels, but don't believe that they will last any longer than a modern gasser because of the need to rev it higher up a grade. It is much easier/cheaper to engineer durability for RPM than it is for heat.

I love the fact that Nissan is dropping this cool power-train in the Titan, but I think it's pretty hard to make any arguments around longevity and economy in the modern engine era. The other thing that sucks is that there seems to be an some kind of movement to kill off the diesel in America. (High fuel prices and ridiculous emission standards) Even Europe is starting to go away from them.