New VTX or Two Used Boats - What Would You Do?

[Slayer]

Here's another vote for 2 boats. If you have the resources and the time to deal with 2 boats, then do it.

[LGSkier]

The VTX is like the 200 in that it needs speed to clean up the wake. Coming from our 99 Response, my wife hated the VTX wake since she likes long line at 29-30 mph. Personally, I think the Response is going to be much better at 32 than the VTX. At 34+ the VTX gets much better.

Is there much difference skiing at 34 vs 32 from the riders perspective?

[Tims]

Is there much difference skiing at 34 vs 32 from the riders perspective?

Good question. At that point, it's probably depends who you talk to. One way to look at it, no one will argue that a VTX has a better ski wake than a Response or that a VTX has a better surf wave than a 23/24 LSV.

[oldjeep]

Is there much difference skiing at 34 vs 32 from the riders perspective?

only if there are a bunch of balls in the way.

[3sport]

IMO VTX skis really good at 32 and 15 off. But it's still not a response.

For surfing, if you go 2 boats, you going to be okay emptying, moving and refilling ballast everytime it's the other person's turn or having a ballast bag on one of your seats or the floor? Just something to think about.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[LGSkier]

IMO VTX skis really good at 32 and 15 off. But it's still not a response.

For surfing, if you go 2 boats, you going to be okay emptying, moving and refilling ballast everytime it's the other person's turn or having a ballast bag on one of your seats or the floor? Just something to think about.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would hate bags in the floor. I think I would plumb I did anything. Maybe look for a Surf-Gate DIY or aftermarket. A lot of that on the forums. (Scary Smart Posters on Here). Not above that kind of thing.

[Tims]

I would hate bags in the floor. I think I would plumb I did anything. Maybe look for a Surf-Gate DIY or aftermarket. A lot of that on the forums. (Scary Smart Posters on Here). Not above that kind of thing.

247 wave with all hidden plumbed in ballast. That wave will never happen on a vtx.

[toolboat]

I'd get two boats or one that does your favorite thing best, when you get something that's universal sometimes that means it doesn't do anything great. Compromise = nobody gets what they want. Plus, if you have two boats and one is being serviced you can still go out.

[JB-FOOT]

I own two boats and have for years, heck for the longest time I owned 3....why compromise if you dont have to?

You have lake front and 3 dock spaces....you are not towing anything...

Do you have 2 or more vehicles?

Are they differeent? I would bet they are. And why? Because you use them for different reasons and purposes...

My truck, my suv and my car, all used and all do what they were designed to do perfectly!

Most of our ski group all own 2 boats for the same reasons you mention...

I am guessing you are paying cash as well, or could if you go with 2 used boats for sure, am I correct?

Given your set up...get exactly what you want for each use and get

2 GREAT BOATS instead of 1 Fancy looking new "just ok" boat, and dont look back!

Just my not so humble opinion.

Edited April 4, 2014 by JB-FOOT

[TrickyNicky]

I'll +1 for the fact that the wake on the VTX is not going to be ski friendly at lower speeds. I'll say anything below 30 mph and you'd be kicking yourself. 30-32 mph is fine, 32+ your not going to notice much of a difference. For the record when looking at the responses avoid the lxi's as there far too close to the VTX to justify as a second boat, you wouldn't be gaining much at all in the ski wake, some (myself) would even say your losing at 34mph.

And if you don't need bags showing in the VTX than you definitely won't need them showing in an LSV. Sure it needs more weight but it has more storage and being on waterfront you don't have to carry much anyways.

As for the tower issue, no the tower will not be difficult to put down. BUT you won't want to do it everytime you return to the dock, just when you lay the boat up for the night or week/end. Something to consider.

[LGSkier]

I'll +1 for the fact that the wake on the VTX is not going to be ski friendly at lower speeds. I'll say anything below 30 mph and you'd be kicking yourself. 30-32 mph is fine, 32+ your not going to notice much of a difference. For the record when looking at the responses avoid the lxi's as there far too close to the VTX to justify as a second boat, you wouldn't be gaining much at all in the ski wake, some (myself) would even say your losing at 34mph.

And if you don't need bags showing in the VTX than you definitely won't need them showing in an LSV. Sure it needs more weight but it has more storage and being on waterfront you don't have to carry much anyways.

As for the tower issue, no the tower will not be difficult to put down. BUT you won't want to do it everytime you return to the dock, just when you lay the boat up for the night or week/end. Something to consider.

I own two boats and have for years, heck for the longest time I owned 3....why compromise if you dont have to?

You have lake front and 3 dock spaces....you are not towing anything...

Do you have 2 or more vehicles?

Are they differeent? I would bet they are. And why? Because you use them for different reasons and purposes...

My truck, my suv and my car, all used and all do what they were designed to do perfectly!

Most of our ski group all own 2 boats for the same reasons you mention...

I am guessing you are paying cash as well, or could if you go with 2 used boats for sure, am I correct?

Given your set up...get exactly what you want for each use and get

2 GREAT BOATS instead of 1 Fancy looking new "just ok" boat, and dont look back!

Just my not so humble opinion.

I would be squarely in the 3 boat category. Don't know if i could part with my Cobalt 263. Which btw has an awesome Surf wave. (built a 3' protective extension behind the existing Platform/Out Drive) but, it has dual controls and I have had nightmares about it. So that will not get used again. Please no abuse on that one....

Are you saying that at 32+, I am going to get a response like wake for slalom from a VTX? If so, the surf wave is the point of contention. Tims posted video is sick for the 247. Problem is a decent 247 and a Response will break to budget. Hard to accomplish the two boat system and stay under $75K i think.

O and di anyone see big bang last night. My Wife thinks I am sheldon with Xbox1, PS4 decision.

Edited April 4, 2014 by LGSkier

[Brodie]

I vote 2 boats, but I am a wake snob. A VTX is decent at 34 mph empty without a tower and all the extras. At 28-30, with all the extra weight, it is way bigger than your jet boat wake. When I bought my diamond hulled 21 LSV, I was expecting a "good slalom wake for a v-drive" which is how people refer to it. Now, I am primarily a course skier and only ski DD boats, but I was hoping for a decent wake for the wife and kids. Nope! Wake sucks at 20-30 MPH. For me, it would be a closed bow Nautique 1997+ (or a Response 1999+) and a 23 LSV!! If I didn't have lots of friends with DD boats, and a DD boat at our cabin, I would need 2 boats at my house.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Brodie

[flapjack]

Now I feel like I need to take lessons.

nope. You just need to ski the course. :-) The course will make you a wake snob.

[flapjack]

The VTX is like the 200 in that it needs speed to clean up the wake. Coming from our 99 Response, my wife hated the VTX wake since she likes long line at 29-30 mph. Personally, I think the Response is going to be much better at 32 than the VTX. At 34+ the VTX gets much better.

This post surprises me. We went from a 99 response to a 2011 VTX.

At 15 off, 28mph I think it is easier to run the course behind the VTX (back pylon) than the Response. The reason is that the Response wake has a sharp hit at each wake; it is difficult for a beginning course skier to hold a constant edge through both wakes. The VTX is a larger wake, but it is a smooth mound. It is pretty easy for a beginner course skier to stay on edge through the entire wake.

15 off, 32 mph is probably the VTX's worst speed. That second trough is tough to get used to.

N.B. We test drove a 13 VTX. At 15/28, I think the back pylon skis better than the front pylon.

P.S. to LG... if I had 2 slips, I'd get 2 older, low tech boats in a heart beat. A 99 Response can be found for <$13K. Same hull as the 14 Response. I'd prefer to have the older electronics sitting in a slip year round.

[jk13]

Plus one for two boats after reading your responses and concerns. The fact that you mentioned a 6" jet boat wake in your first post says wonders. For those that have not skied behind a jet boat the pull is not great, but the wake is soft, frothy, and almost nonexistent to cut through.

Plus like mentioned the depreciation on used boats will be less than on a brand new one. Yes, there may be initial maintenance to be done, but you can always re-sell and buy new in a few years if the mood strikes or you find a riding buddy with a VTX to long term demo while hanging out with them.

[TrickyNicky]

I would be squarely in the 3 boat category. Don't know if i could part with my Cobalt 263. Which btw has an awesome Surf wave. (built a 3' protective extension behind the existing Platform/Out Drive) but, it has dual controls and I have had nightmares about it. So that will not get used again. Please no abuse on that one....

Are you saying that at 32+, I am going to get a response like wake for slalom from a VTX? If so, the surf wave is the point of contention. Tims posted video is sick for the 247. Problem is a decent 247 and a Response will break to budget. Hard to accomplish the two boat system and stay under $75K i think.

O and di anyone see big bang last night. My Wife thinks I am sheldon with Xbox1, PS4 decision.

I'm not saying your going to get response wakes from the VTX at 32+, BUT I will say that at that generation response, with what you describe as your skiing style, that you're not going to get an appreciable improvement in ski wake. The faster you go the smaller the difference becomes. That being said, low speed wake will be miles apart, the manoeuvrability of a response will be nicer and as you add ppl to the boat the VTX wake will become worse.

If you truly have 4 ppl in the boat all the time and always ski above 32mph, the VTX is going to be great.

BTW, it should be asked if the VTX has bow ballast, that has been a huge difference in our ski wake. With 4 ppl you can just put 1-2 in the front.

Thats my response in regards to your question. But I now stand in the 2 boat category. Mentioning the manoeuvrability, low speed wakes, extra ppl etc, had me thinking. There is just something about being in a proper DD and feeling un-compromised. I stand by my statement that free skiing at 32 you won't notice any appreciable difference at the end of the line, but driving, and the atmosphere of having a crew in a proper ski boat is something special. If you wanted more room than it would be a dumb compromise to get a response, but since the option is two boats, well you're living many of our dreams

Edited April 4, 2014 by TrickyNicky

[badluck]

You are coming from a jet boat. Go demo a vtx. You will be more than happy. If I were looking I would probably get an 07vtx. I believe it still had switches not the mux setup.You would save cash.I'm not a fan of the mux or the new electronics. Too much to brake. Simple is good.I wanna surf well I wanna ski.Load and unload. Thats what you will be doing.The vtx and 750 in the lockers = great surf boat.Make sure you get bow ballast.

[SmoothWaterMan]

Lol...

Crew - He has demo'd a VTX, and a 20 MXZ from us last year. And the Nautique 200 from the CC dealer. And asked all the questions. He wants the VTX and it's the right boat for him. You can't surf a Response. But he didn't order it last fall, and missed a used one we had over the winter, and doesn't want to order a new one. But he found a leftover in WI or MN and said he was buying that.

Brian, did you demo the one out west? If you don't buy it soon, someone else will first you know.

I know we were talking to a customer when you came by the booth last weekend, but you should have stayed a moment and said hi.

Peter

[Waterskimn]

Lg, I just purchased a 13 vtx diamond hull. I had a 97 closed bow ski nautique(best ski wake I have ever skied on), then went to a 07 x-14 because of the space and ski/wake surfing. The x-14 had a huge ski wake and the wake surfing was hard even with internal ballast and 4 sacks in the back. When I tried the VTX I was a little stunned at how small the wake was for skiing, and with a push of a button we we're wake surfing in 2 minutes. The vtx had 500 pound extra bags in the back hidden that were also controlled with a push of a button. If you are older and don't want to dink around with 2 boats or bags taking up space in your boat I would look to the VTX with extra 750. My 2 bits.

[LGSkier]

First of all wanted to thank everyone for the the great responses on this. It was a huge help. Kind of funny/embarrassing when your local dealer chimes in.

We settled on the New 2013 VTX with Surfgate, PNP etc.

I was really in the two boat camp for a bit. This what we found.

Actually flew to GA/Alabama to look at two Centurion Enzo's with 237 and 230 hours respectively. These were low hour, 2010/2008 boats. It turned out to be a bit of a let down. I felt they should have looked and operated a lot better based on being stored on lifts and with low hours. That and the technology has changed. (nothing like surfgate on any boat older than a '13). We wanted snap out carpet so the older 23/24lsv was out as well.

We did find a sweet Ski Nautique 197 limited that still looked new in GA. Would definitely have bought it. Had we been able to make the other side of the 2 boat thing work.

So Smoothwater was right in the end. And will do the maintenance on the shipped VTX. So for right now it seems the right way to go. Now if someone comes out with a replacement for a Cobalt 27' that is safely surfable, we might get rid of our 263.

Edited May 3, 2014 by LGSkier